Columbia INCITE | Oral History_Terrell Frazier_Keyontae Johnson-Davis-3-4-19
Q:
OK. Today's date is March 4th, 2019. And this is Terrell Frazier interviewing--
JOHNSON:
Keyontae Johnson.
Q:
Great. At Sherman Elementary School. Keyontae, do I have your permission to record this interview?
JOHNSON:
Yes.
Q:
OK, great. All right, let's get started. So we kind of talked a little bit about this earlier, but it doesn't have to be the same thing. Thinking back, kind of growing up, over your younger experiences, kind of what stands out for you when you think back on those?
JOHNSON:
That's a good question. When I went to Chicago in fifth grade, we had a field trip to the science museum. I don't know what it's called, but it's like a big science museum down there. And we walked around there, we learned about science, we experienced a lot of stuff. My favorite thing was when we got to play with the winds. It was like you could make a tornado, but it was in a cylinder and you could spin it around. That's my favorite memory.
Q:
That Science Center, I think it is, that has a lot of like interactive exhibits.
JOHNSON:
A whole lot.
Q:
Yeah. Did you like science then, or were you into it?
JOHNSON:
Yeah, I really like science.
Q:
Were you born here in Wisconsin, or?
JOHNSON:
Yes.
Q:
Yeah. What was it like growing up here that you think is unique?
JOHNSON:
Well, I'm gonna start with this. When I was four, I moved to Atlanta, so all the way up from when I was born. It was kind of like-- it was fun. I had spent the majority of the time with my dad, because it was like, he wanted to spend time with me because he knew, after I left, he wouldn't really going to spend time with me like that. And it was like fun, it was easy, everything was like smoother. My brothers, we all had a lot of fun, especially in the
summertime. But that's when everybody had more money and more free time and it was fine. And when we moved to Atlanta, it was kind of hard. Like, I had a hard time re-adapting myself with the other kids. So experiencing stuff like-- I had a harder time doing that there than I do here. Because it's like, you're born here, you have a feel of how Milwaukee is. You know how people react. You know how people think. And in Atlanta it's like it's a whole different story. You don't even know where you are half of the time. The school that I went to, I don't remember what it's called, but it had a high school in it too. Like elementary, middle school, and high school. It was a big school. I got scared of the mascot, but. Q:
What was it?
JOHNSON:
It was like a hawk, but I was super small, so I didn't know, like, if it was going to try and attack me or whatever. But I was super small so I'm like, I can't do it. I used to always get scared. And it was a lot easier in Milwaukee than it is in Atlanta.
Q:
What-- kind of like who was, when you think back on that experience, was there someone who was there for you most to help you with that transition?
JOHNSON:
Yeah, it was my mom. She helped me a lot.
Q:
How so?
JOHNSON:
She-- when she dropped me off, she was like, do you want me to walk with you? And I was like, yes, cause why not? That's my mom. And sometimes she would like ask one of the teachers to walk with me or talk to me or make sure that I'm OK, and she helped me a lot. And my Granny, she used to come all the time, like she used to visit us all the time.
Q:
To visit.
JOHNSON:
Yeah.
Q:
Was it kind of good to see--
JOHNSON:
It was.
Q:
--like from home. Yeah.
JOHNSON:
It was way better.
Q:
When you kind of think about the people in your life who are like the most important and special to you, what comes to mind when you think about them?
JOHNSON:
My mama. This is typical, but it's like, she just be on me constantly, like 24 hours. But that's it. That's normal for a teenager. But my Granny, like when she was here, she was like my go to person that I would talk to. My uncle, we would usually like play fight and wrestle and play fight wrestling or whatever. And my dad, he made me more socially active than anybody else that was, what's the word, that was important to me.
Q:
How so?
JOHNSON:
Because it's like my dad-- so he was a DJ or ex-DJ or whatever you call them. And, you know, DJs are socially active. And basically, the people that he knew, he introduced us to them. And we used to always be invited to parties and our cousins would like to have us over their friends, we would get to know their friends. A lot of stuff like that.
Q:
Yeah. This is in Atlanta?
JOHNSON:
Mmm-mm. Milwaukee.
Q:
Was there anything in particular that sparked the move to Atlanta?
JOHNSON:
No, she just wanted to up and move to Atlanta.
Q:
I wonder. You said you were four?
JOHNSON:
Mm-hmm.
Q:
How many-- do you have just brothers?
JOHNSON:
I have brothers and sisters.
Q:
How many?
JOHNSON:
I cannot count on one hand. [? Kashawn, ?] [? Keandre, ?] [? Kier, ?] [? Tatiana, ?] [? Layla, ?] [? Jerome. ?] Nine.
Q:
Nine. Are you on the older side or younger side?
JOHNSON:
Older.
Q:
Older?
JOHNSON:
Older.
Q:
What is that like?
JOHNSON:
It's like, they are really annoying. I'm sorry, but they are very annoying. And I know that they be watching me and whatever, they just be annoying. I'm sorry, it's just annoying.
Q:
Yeah. Is anything like-- what's the good part of being an older brother?
JOHNSON:
The good part is like, whenever I ask them to do something, they'll do it, but they like make a remark. And like they say something and I'll be like, just go do it, and then they go do it. And it just be funny sometimes. I can't be mad at them and not-- I can't be mad for a long time without cracking a smile or something. The stuff that they be doing, like the facial expressions that they be making just be funny.
Q:
Right. When did you move back here to Milwaukee?
JOHNSON:
When I was six. Yeah, when I was six. And I would stay with my Granny, and I didn't start school until my Mama moved out. But other than that, we just stayed at--
Q:
Moved back out to here?
JOHNSON:
Yeah, right.
Q:
So you came back first? Yeah. What was that like?
JOHNSON:
It was fun, because I got to spend plenty of time with my Granny. Like I spent more time with her than I did with my Mama.
Q:
Is that where you kind of get the closest, like felt really close to her?
JOHNSON:
Yeah, out of everybody, yeah.
Q:
In what ways did you kind of like feel-- when you think about those experiences, like what stands out for you having that time with her?
JOHNSON:
All the good times. Like in December, well, I don't think you're from here, but it's like a
Christmas bus. And it's at the [? Grand Avenue one, ?] and it's like a Christmas bus, and they drive you around. You get hot cocoa, hot apple cider, and you can just drive around downtown. Like you can see all the lights and all of that. And that's what I like the most about it. Q:
When you think about kind of that experience and what-- do you think that's the same as other people who aren't from here, or other people in your larger community see you and see your community? Or you think it's different?
JOHNSON:
I think it's different.
Q:
How so?
JOHNSON:
Like, the people that aren't really in our community but have visited or looked towards our community, I don't think they have as much-- well, they don't have as much experience as the people who have been in the community for years and years and years. And I think that the people really should try to give-- like they should look at the positive side of Milwaukee in our community. That's what I think. The more positive side.
Q:
How do you feel when you feel like people don't get to see the positive side?
JOHNSON:
I kind of feel like ashamed, aggravated. It's like, I start to wonder, like how are you going to judge? You shouldn't judge a book by its cover just because you hear something. You should really try it before you try and judge it. But other than that, yeah, I feel agitated.
Q:
If you could tell people one thing that makes kind of your neighborhood or your broader community, your school or the city, one thing about your community that is unique or special, what would it be?
JOHNSON:
The bond, and the amount of people that show support to everybody. We have block parties sometimes, and it's like, no matter where you are, as long as everybody's having a good time, nothing can go wrong. And that's what's unique about it. It's a lot better than what it sounds like.
Q:
Yeah. What do you think that people think of most when they think this city?
JOHNSON:
I think that when people look at this city, I think that they see what they want to see. Like the amount of injustices and the amount of crimes here, I think that's what they look at.
Q:
As kind of like thinking about that, as a part of your community, right, like how do you want people to see you?
JOHNSON:
As a leader.
Q:
Yeah?
JOHNSON:
Mm-hmm. As a smart leader that knows what he is doing, that watches out for everybody.
Q:
Are there are any like people-- I mean, I know you talked about your grandmother, it could be her, where they like taught you about being a good leader or leadership?
JOHNSON:
My teacher, her name was Dr. Robertson, I mean Mrs. Robertson. And she helped me obtain the amount of leadership that I have today. Like, she helped me a lot with that. Because at first I was like, oh, are they doing that over there? I'm going to go over there. Are they doing that over here? I'll go over there. Like I used to follow people a lot, but she told me-- she was like, now if they jump off a bridge, would you do that? And I know it's common, but I'm like, no, I'm not going to do that. What if they get hurt? And she was like, exactly. So I'm like, OK, can you teach me? And my Mama, she approved of it. She was like, yeah, she can teach you. And I think she was the best teacher that I ever had. Yeah.
Q:
Yeah? What ways kind of you feel like from having those experiences that you shown your leadership? Or just being like, in what ways do you feel like you are active in your community? Like, yeah, this is my thing.
JOHNSON:
Hold on, I'm talking about the school. But when it comes to people fighting and you want to make sure you don't get hurt and everybody else around you doesn't get hurt, like, I tend to step into the fight, especially if it's between-- well, I step in every fight. But especially if it's between a boy and a girl, because I feel like you shouldn't be doing that, especially if you're a boy and you know you're more powerful than the girl is. So it's like, what's the point of you fighting her or him? Or whatever.
Q:
Well, you know, what made you to be like brave enough to do that? It takes a lot of courage.
JOHNSON:
OK, so at this school, if somebody gets into a fight, the whole class has to go down for it. So it's like, I can't get in trouble for y'all, but I can stop y'all from getting everybody else in trouble.
I'm not trying to-- I don't want to get in trouble for them. And I don't even be cool with most of the people that's here, but I still tend to break it up, no matter what. It's just a natural reaction for me. Q:
Yeah. What kind of like when you think about the spaces in your community, and it can be like here, church, whatever the thing the place is, but places that you feel really comfortable in?
JOHNSON:
The basketball court.
Q:
Yeah? How long have you played basketball?
JOHNSON:
Actually, I started this school year. Yeah, this school year. I haven't played basketball, organized basketball, since-- well I have this school year. I just started, and I really like it. It's better than playing street ball and you getting pushed out the way or hurt or shoved or have something broken. It's way better than that, and I like it.
Q:
Is that your favorite hobby?
JOHNSON:
No. My favorite hobby is playing video games. Like, if I'm not playing basketball, I play Call of Duty or something.
Q:
You mentioned earlier that you like to draw. When did you realize that, that you were good at it?
JOHNSON:
In sixth grade I was like in art, and she told us that we can do whatever we wanted to, like draw whatever we wanted to draw. And I started drawing people, and it was like two stick people boxing. And she was, you're actually really good at it. And she taught me the basics of it and how to make the facial features, and I just started to get it.
Q:
Yeah. And so from there, what did you do to pursue that?
JOHNSON:
I started learning from my friends. Well, we used to always have drawing competitions, like to see who could draw the best out of everybody.
Q:
Just between you all?
JOHNSON:
Mm-hmm. And this girl-- like I used to always win, because my teacher taught me. And as soon as the next school year that the girl came, I got-- I instantly lost and kept losing, kept losing.
Q:
Someone new came in? And this is like seventh grade?
JOHNSON:
Mm-hmm. Can you teach me how to do that? And she was like, sure, I'll teach you. And I started drawing stuff like that. I started looking up on Google searching new ways to make eyes and hands and feet and stuff, and then it started to make me better.
Q:
Is that where you kind of see yourself when you think about the future? Like is that what you see yourself doing?
JOHNSON:
A graphic designer.
Q:
Oh, yeah? Where would you want that to take you? What would be the dream?
JOHNSON:
I think, yeah, I think I just want to do like-- if not cartoons, I'd be all right designing logos.
Q:
Yeah? Would you want to move away or stay?
JOHNSON:
Yeah, I'd like to move away.
Q:
When you think about that in the future, like where would it be? Where would you go?
JOHNSON:
Texas.
Q:
Why Texas?
JOHNSON:
Because it's hotter, and it's not as cold as here. Like I believe like the coldest it gets is like 60 or something, I think. And I like the heat, and it's way better than cold, as you can see.
Q:
Yeah, it's a cold day. What other kind of like dreams, or like when you think about the future, your aims in terms of both, not only for you, but in terms of you would want to see your community grow?
JOHNSON:
Better police officers. Like, they should be way more patient and just a little more, like-- how do I say it? observing? I think that's the world. Before they do something, they should think before they react, basically is what I'm trying to say. And they should know when to react and how to react.
Q:
And that's the way that you see that not happening now?
JOHNSON:
Mm-hmm.
Q:
Yeah. In what ways?
JOHNSON:
In what ways?
Q:
Have you ever had any encounters with like police in your neighborhood just being present, or?
JOHNSON:
Mm-hmm. Like we were driving, and the cop car raced in front of us. It was raining, and we tried to stop, and we slid, and the cop cars zoomed past and another car crashed into us. And I'm like, wow, that didn't make any sense.
Q:
Yeah. Because it kind of cut you off, you said? Is that what it was?
JOHNSON:
Mm-hmm. Yeah, another car just smacked in to the car.
Q:
Did you-- when you kind of see the news and read about ways that the police interact with the community, like how does that make you feel?
JOHNSON:
It kind of angers me, but at the same time, some of the stuff, I don't want to say is justified, but it kind of makes sense why they did.
Q:
Yeah. And in what way? In what instances is that?
JOHNSON:
Like say if the cop-- if the cop was a newbie and he didn't know what was going on in that situation, and he shot-- like he didn't know, so how would he be in trouble? If that person did something bad and he didn't know what was going on, and his blood was just rushing and he didn't know what he was doing, and he just panicked and shot. It would kind of make sense. Because you got to put yourself in their shoes. Like, you got to, oh, that's why he did that. But you still have to remember that this only happens, well, not only happen, but happens to the majority of black people.
Q:
What's that like, kind of seeing that like all over again?
JOHNSON:
It's like, it just makes me sad. But then again, it's like I'm kind of used to it, because it usually happens all the time, and nothing ever happens to the cop. Or
Q:
And you kind of talked about like how to change that, like what needs to happen. What else do you think, that people in general need to improve their communities, or be able to change? Or do they already have it?
JOHNSON:
No. No, they don't have it. I mean, people need to just slow down and be patient. Not just cops, just people in general. Like you shouldn't be able to run a red light that easily. Like I can see if it was like an accident, if you was driving and you didn't see the red light. Something like that. But you shouldn't just hit the pedal and just keep going. Like that doesn't make any sense. Now we have to weight on you to go across and we got to go.
Q:
When you think about, kind of, and it's just thinking back a little bit, because I'm just thinking about the penguin drawing. But when you think about the things that make you uniquely you, like individual, what is that?
JOHNSON:
In drawing? I think the facial features.
Q:
Or even in general, yeah.
JOHNSON:
My style. I think that not everybody does it, but like I picked it up from my art teacher. And it's like, you make the head and you don't do the little plus, the T at the bottom of the face. And then what you do is, instead of doing that, you make the eyes first, then you make the nose, and then you do the mouth. And everybody asks me why I do that. It's just, for some reason I just like doing that. I don't know why.
Q:
Oh, you make the facial features before you like continue?
JOHNSON:
Mm-hmm.
Q:
Oh, that is interesting. So you know like-- so it's like the features kind of decide what the body will be like, cause the expression?
JOHNSON:
Mm-hmm.
Q:
Do you feel like you're good at reading people's expressions or sensing that? Because, I mean, it can be hard for even artists to get that right.
JOHNSON:
Not really, no. I don't think I'm good at that.
Q:
Really?
JOHNSON:
Yeah.
Q:
Why do you say that?
JOHNSON:
Because I'm not good at drawing people, period, but I'm willing to give it a shot. That's one more thing, I'm willing to give it a shot. Because even if I'm bad at it, like I can still put the effort to try and know that I didn't give up on it and just stop and drop it and just told you, no, I can't do that. I just at least have to show myself that I tried to do it.
Q:
Is that something that you feel like came from you? Or did you have to learn that?
JOHNSON:
I had to learn that.
Q:
Oh, yeah? In what ways did you learn that?
JOHNSON:
On my birthday, my Mama-- well, this just happened yesterday, because my birthday was yesterday.
Q:
Oh, happy belated birthday.
JOHNSON:
Thank you. My Mom, she told me she was going to make some ham. She made the ham, overcooked it, and it was just nasty. We had to throw it away. And then she just made some chicken and she was like, well, at least-- as long as you try, you're not going to quit. You just know you're not going to quit. You just keep going. It's there. You got to just keep going. Because every time you fail, it's another step in progress. That's what she said.
Q:
I like that. What's like a typical morning for you at home? Like a [INAUDIBLE] where you make a year, like what does that look like?
JOHNSON:
I sleep an extra five minutes.
Q:
Nice.
JOHNSON:
And then when I wake up, I immediately have to get on my stuff. I go run to the bathroom, use the bathroom, brush my teeth, wash my face, put on my glasses, and grab my book bag and all of that. And we just go.
Q:
Are all your siblings there?
JOHNSON:
Not all my siblings, but my siblings on my mother's side. Because my dad, he's in Texas. That's why I want to go there.
Q:
Oh, OK.
JOHNSON:
Yeah. But yeah. All the siblings, I only have three other siblings that's with my mom. And we just get in the car and go.
Q:
What is that like, not having all your siblings there?
JOHNSON:
I mean, it's not hard, but it's not easy. It's like, once you think about them, you miss them. And then once they around you just, oh, why is you here?
Q:
Yeah. How often do you get to see them?
JOHNSON:
Every two weeks.
Q:
Oh, they're not in Texas.
JOHNSON:
No. My oldest brother, he's in-- I'm the second oldest. My oldest brother, he's in Texas. They're coming in about two months. And my other siblings, they live here and we all just go to our Granny's house and we go visit over there with our uncle.
Q:
Oh they stay with your grandmother?
JOHNSON:
No, their mom.
Q:
Oh, yeah. What do you want to like, is it big brother? Second oldest. What do you want to teach them? What do you want them to learn from you?
JOHNSON:
I want them to learn from me, like, that I always try, I was always positive, and I was always funny, but I did my work at the same time.
Q:
What else would you say that you would want people to know? And this isn't-- it can be about thinking more broadly, right, about young people in Milwaukee in particular. And I see young people of color that you think is not seen or could be more-- what's the word I'm looking for? This is there, but either people don't see it, or they just don't interact, right? So this is someone that is not from here or they don't have interaction in your community with young people.
JOHNSON:
That we-- all young people. This is all young people. Once you really get to know us or you really start to notice us, we're not as bad as you look or as we act. We actually have-- we are very intelligent. We are not mean at all. Like, we just want to have fun, basically, is what I'm saying. And we smart. Like, we ambitious, and whatever we want, we go for it. And I guess we just-- what's the word? We're not dumbfounded. There you go.
Q:
Yeah. You think it's important to have leaders who are around your age or more like prominent, or are more listened to, and can contribute to communities in ways that are unique?
JOHNSON:
I think people that are older than me could. I think they could. But at the same time it's like, all the stuff that people are saying about us young people, it's like, what's the point of us even doing this if we just finna embarrass ourself?
Q:
Mm-hmm. You're saying that that can be a source of like, you said, discouragement then?
JOHNSON:
Yeah.
Q:
OK, I see what you mean. Yeah. But you know it's something that you feel [INAUDIBLE]. What else there? There's like anything else that you wanted to say about your community that people would not expect?
JOHNSON:
That I think-- well, I don't think. Everybody works hard in the community. Everybody in this community tries to make sure that-- younger people, the younger men and women of the society, we try so hard to get other people's attention, for no reason. And I don't know why. And the older people, they tried so hard so hard for us. They thrived for us, to make sure that we have a brighter day in the world when we get older.
Q:
Kind of as we are wrapping up, what would you say, and this can be at whatever time, right, has been one of your greatest obstacles? And what's been something that's been like a really proud moment for you?
JOHNSON:
When I broke my finger. That was an obstacle, because I couldn't do the things that I'm usually doing. Like I got couldn't write, I couldn't catch the ball, I couldn't grab stuff without it like hurting badly. And one of my greatest thing that happened to me was when where I got accepted into [INAUDIBLE].
Q:
Oh, yeah? How did you feel about that?
JOHNSON:
I was proud. I was yelling, I was doing everything.
Q:
Yeah. What was that transition like?
JOHNSON:
It was like-- I was amazed, actually. I didn't think I was going to be able to go to that school. Because it was like the teacher was like, all y'all failing and all of this. I guess they were just
playing, because as soon as I showed them my report card, well, they were trying to scare us into doing the right thing. And it actually worked, I guess, and I got accepted into the high school that I wanted to. Q:
Mm-hmm. OK. Yeah, good. I think we can close it out, there. Thank you.