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THE PRETTY BOYS BABY METAL
editor in chief
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e n t e r ta i n m e n t d i r e c t o r e d i t o r at l a r g e
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DARA ALLEN fa s h i o n i n t e r n s
DONTAYA BOBB, GABRIELLE CHASE, CALIA JENKINS, DELANEY RUTH
NICK HARAMIS MEL OTTENBERG RICHARD TURLEY LAUREN TABACH-BANK CHRISTOPHER BOLLEN MICHAEL QUINN BEN BARNA NANCY GILLEN KURT WOERPEL JACK VHAY SARAH NECHAMKIN ERNEST MACIAS LUCAS MASCATELLO SVETLANA KITTO MARA VEITCH
Our Team
INTER VIEW
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SHANTI ESCALANTE BESSIE RUBINSTEIN JAIDE STILLWELL CONOR WILLIAMS ALEXA LANZA BELLA KHOSHABA
THE MORRISON GROUP ANITA BITTON DARA ALLEN MALAIKA CRAWFORD SEAN KNIGHT DONTAYA BOBB GABRIELLE CHASE CALIA JENKINS DELANEY RUTH
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Thank You To
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Nick
07
FR
MAY
2020 ISSUE
530
OM T ED HE I TO R
Haramis
I think about Jennifer Aniston a lot. Like, a lot. Friends premiered in 1994 when I was just shy of becoming a teenager. As soon as it came out, I bought l .p., the album by The Remembrants that had the sitcom’s theme song on it. I told the kids in my class that I was a Pheobe—I was weird and liked to sing—but in truth, I always wanted to be Rachel. She wasn’t so much entitled as she was uninformed. Her considerable charm came from the sense that she was like so many of us who watched Friends, still trying to figure it out.
Aniston got married for the first time in 2000, and that was something a lot of people cared about. I remember a photo from the ceremony– its black and white and in it the newlyweds look like blond Kennedys—and I remember hearing that Melissa Etheridge performed at the reception. Five years later Aniston got divorced, and that was something people really cared about. Although it had nothing to do with anything she said or did, Aniston become the apotheosis of a woman scorned in the age of the supermarket
EDITOR IN CHIEF
NICK HARAMIS
editor in chief
c r e at i v e d i r e c t o r editorial director
e n t e r ta i n m e n t d i r e c t o r e d i t o r at l a r g e
photography director executive editor m a n ag i n g e d i t o r
art director designers
d i g i ta l e d i t o r e d i t o r i a l a s s i s ta n t contributing editor copy editor research editor editorial interns
SHANTI ESCALANTE, BESSIE RUB market director m a r k e t a s s i s ta n t photography production contributing casting director c o n t r i b u t i n g fa s h i o n e d i t o r s
DARA ALLEN fa s h i o n i n t e r n s
DONTAYA BOBB, GABRIELLE CHASE, CALIA JENKINS, DELANEY
MEL OTTENBERG RICHARD TURLEY LAUREN TABACH-BANK CHRISTOPHER BOLLEN MICHAEL QUINN BEN BARNA NANCY GILLEN KURT WOERPEL JACK VHAY SARAH NECHAMKIN ERNEST MACIAS LUCAS MASCATELLO SVETLANA KITTO MARA VEITCH
SHANTI ESCALANTE BESSIE RUBINSTEIN JAIDE STILLWELL CONOR WILLIAMS ALEXA LANZA BELLA KHOSHABA
THE MORRISON GROUP ANITA BITTON
tabloid. This is the part that I usually think about DARA ALLEN Jennifer Aniston—why, as a culture, we feast on MALAIKA CRAWFORD certain parts as a culture, we feast on certain SEAN KNIGHT parts of certain celebrities, and then hit the buffet DONTAYA BOBB again and again. GABRIELLE CHASE In the case of Aniston, I think we made her into a metonym for martyrdom— CALIA JENKINS DELANEY RUTH something she never accepted, not once—because it’s easier to project heartbreak or disappointment onto someone else than it is to unpack on KELLY BRANT JASON NIKIC our own. In her, we saw mega-famous, supremely talented, ultra-rich actoryith flaws. In her, NEW YORK , against all odds, we saw someone to whom we ARACELI FRANCO can completely relate. afranco@crystalball.media
Thank You To
RUTH
NICK HARAMIS
Our Team
INTER VIEW
08
president
chief revenue officer
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As we were putting together this issue, I began MILAN . . to notice that so many of. the people on the pagFABIO MONTOBBIO es that follow have, each in their own way, been, fabio@rockmedia.it at some point, symbols of something greater PARIS, LONDON than themselves. Take Angelyne. At the age of , GUGLIELMO P. BAVA 69, the pink Corvette-driving mononymous Holgpb@kapture-media.com lywood Legend has spent the past 30-some years reminding peopleHARALUX that she is a star. She doesn’t as she tells Paris Hilton, own l.a., she is l.a.–in all LOTTIE OAKLEY lottie.oakley@haralux.com damned, sun-drenched beauty. Elsewhere in the issue, the performance artist Kembra Pfhaler MARC BERGER marc.berger@haralux.com speaks to one of her art-world heroes, Karen Finley, whose battle against ,the National Endowment ANTHONY FAIRALL for the Arts over afairall@crystalball.media the definition of decency turned her into impropriety incarnate according to her , Republican critics. (For everyone else, she beMITCHELL NUGENT mnugent@crystalball.media came an avatar of the First Amendment) Yifei Liu, the heroine of the upcoming live-action rock media s r l
managing director founder
founder and president
chief of sales
director integrated marketing
manager brand marketing and partnerships
Nick
09
Haramis
adaptation of Disney’s Mulan, talks to Awkwafina about what is means to personify the progress of Asian representation in Hollywood. Then there’s Kumail Nanjiani, the Oscar-nominated screen writer and comedian who, in order to play a sword-wielding superhero in the latest contribution to the Marvel Cinematic Universe, got jacked beyond belief–becoming, in the process, and emblem of home for comic-book nerds. And let’s not forget the magazine itself. For the past year and a half, we’ve incorporated handwriting into our pages as a design flourish. Our team reinvented Interview in a time of urgency and confusion, and that sense of tactility seemed not only to pay homage to our past but to reflect our scrappy present. But it’s 2020 now, so our editorial director Richard Turley chopped off his hands in favor of a new sorta-dystopian, kinda-utopian typeface that hopefully holds up. a mirror to the world in which we live, and where we’re heading. Or maybe we’re heading. Or maybe we’re heading somewhere else entirely. Your guess is as good as mine.
EDITOR IN CHIEF
NICK HARAMIS
STYLIST
Mel Ottenberg PHOTOGRAPHY
Brett Lloyd
SHOCK THE
WORLD
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The last place you want to find yourself is against the ropes with Ryan Garcia. So far, 20 fighters have been in that dicey position and all they have to show for it is a public drubbing. In just four short years, the undefeated 21-year-old boxer has risen to the top of the sport’s lightweight division, where he currently holds its Silver Championship belt. When Garcia, a Southern California native–who enters the ring waving both the American and Mexican flag, isn’t demoralizing opponents in the ring, he’s leveraging his unflappable confidence into a personal brand. With no signs of slowing down, Garcia did pause long enough to answer some questions from his promoter and mentor, the legendary pugilist Oscar De La Hoya.
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interview magazine
RYAN GARCIA & OSCAR DE LA HOYA
oscar de la hoya
What’s up, Ryan? ryan garcia
What’s popping with you? de la hoya
All good, brother. You currently hold the [World Boxing Council] Silver lightweight title, but there’s a possible fight with Jorge Linares in July. He’s a fourtime world champion. How do you feel about the fight? garcia
I think this is a story of the old lion versus the young lion, and I’m coming to take the pride. I’m coming to literally fuck him up. de la hoya
garcia
Okay, okay. You’re still undefeated. How do you keep from getting too confident and an ego to match?
Boxing is dangerous. Anything can happen, so you need supreme confidence. That’s why I represent myself like nobody can beat me, because I need to truly believe it.
garcia
I just focus on the bigger picture you know. I’m trying to do something more than just be a champion who wins fights. I want to shock the world, and I’m going to do that through boxing. I’m shooting for the stars; I’m not shooting for this planet. de la hoya
Where does your bravado come from? Do you feel like talking that type of game gives you the confidence to go out there and knock everybody out?
de la hoya
You’ve been very vocal about your experiences with anxiety, the importance of checking in on yourself and your friends, and paying attention to your emotions. Do your struggles with mental health help you in the ring? garcia
I can’t stress this enough: Mental health connects us all. We all go through stuff, and we’re all trying to figure it out in
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GROOMING
Dylan Chalves The Wall Group PRODUCTION
Chrissy Hampton Total Management PHOTOGRAPHY ASSISTANT
Nick Blumenthal Artworld FASHION ASSISTANTS
Abi Arcinas Ashling Massoumi
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interview magazine
RYAN GARCIA & OSCAR DE LA HOYA
our own head. Once you do, you’ll have a better understanding of yourself. It’s important to talk about it and help erase that social stigma. de la hoya
How do you work around it? If you’re having a bad day, does it make you work harder in the gym? Do you let it out when you’re sparring? garcia
When I feel anxiety and depression and doubt, I think about why I’m doing this: “Why am I going through this? Why do I wake up every morning? Why am I sacrificing my body?” And for me, it’s about a larger purpose. I want to inspire and motivate the next generation of young people. de la hoya
Who are your heroes? garcia
I love what Manny Pacquiao has done, but it goes even further than boxing. I admire people who have fought for change: Martin Luther King Jr., Harriet Tubman, Abraham Lincoln. I’m dead serious when I say that—those are my heroes. I also like Ben Affleck. I actually love Zendaya, and want to meet her. I’m just going to throw that out there. de la hoya
So what’s your relationship like with your fans and admirers? garcia
I try to be genuine with them. I try to share my thoughts and the things I’ve gone through. When I have the time, I check my dm s. de la hoya
How did you get into boxing? garcia
It started when I was 7. I was playing baseball and I was pretty good, but my team just wasn’t doing their job. It made me not like the team aspect of sports. I wanted a sport where it could be oneon-one. I asked my uncle, “Can I find a sport that’s just all on me?” He showed me a video of a sport called boxing. I was like, “All right, I’ll try it.” He took me to his garage, put a pair of gloves on me and
coat by loewe , socks from dave ’s new york , shoes ryan ’s own
right when I did that first jab, I was pretty much just in love with the sound of the mitt. That snap sent me such a rush. de la hoya
Do you ever get starstruck? garcia
I wouldn’t say starstruck, but I do get excited to meet people who have the same passion and the same goals as me, people who are trying to change the world. I couldn’t give a shit about somebody who’s not trying to do that, even if they’re a star. de la hoya
Do you see yourself as an ambassador of the sport? garcia
I feel like I can be not only the face of boxing, but a true revolutionary to the sport itself. de la hoya
You carry both the U.S. and Mexico in your heart, and you represent them both in the ring. Why is that important to you? garcia
It’s key. You need to know where you came from to know where you’re going. Otherwise you can lose yourself.
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GROOMING
Dylan Chalves The Wall Group PRODUCTION
Chrissy Hampton Total Management PHOTOGRAPHY ASSISTANT
Nick Blumenthal Artworld FASHION ASSISTANTS
Abi Arcinas Ashling Massoumi
meo s do o st t u j g n in a y h r t t I’m g more on who t i n n thi cha m p . I wa d, s be a fight e worl o h s win hock t ng to d g. n to s ’m goi h boxi he I d oug for t tn r a h tt oo ing a h t h s o t ot t. ho n e s n m m la I’ I’ p ; s s i r sta for th ing
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&
Normani Warhol
bralette and panties by dior
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After getting her start as a member of the girl group Fifth Harmony, Normani has finally been given the chance to show what she can do when the world revolves around her. Following the band’s breakup in 2018, the New Orleans native, whose full name is Normani Kordei Hamilton, took some time to recalibrate her trajectory. After collaborations with artists including Khalid, 6lack, and Sam Smith, and an opening slot on Ariana Grande’s Sweetener World Tour, she emerged last August as a fully formed pop star with “Motivation,” a throwback R&B anthem whose video featured the former gymnast powering through ferocious hip-hop dance moves, culminating in what can only be described as a basketball booty bounce. As she puts the finishing touches on her debut album, the 23-year-old singer took a minute to answer some pressing questions from the writing of Andy Warhol.
SAY HER NAME
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warhol
What are you reading right now? normani
I’ve been diving into my Bible a little more. I try to let that be the first thing I do when I wake up in the morning. I spend some personal time with god, and dive into the Word a bit deeper so that I’m able to have a better understanding of the things that have happened in this life. warhol
Who is your dream date? normani
I don’t really have one person in particular. I would love to go on a triple date with Barack and Michelle, or with Jay-Z and Beyoncé. warhol
What’s the craziest thing a fan has sent you in the mail? normani
When I didn’t win Dancing with the Stars, someone took the time to make me my own mirror ball trophy. warhol
When do you dance? normani
I dance 24/7. I could be having a conversation and my ass will be moving.
&
Normani Warhol
interview magazine
NORMANI & WARHOL
STYLIST
Mel Ottenberg PHOTOGRAPHY
Alia Penner
After getting her start as a member of the girl group Fifth HAIR Harmony, Normani has finally been given the chance to show Cesar Deleon what she can do when the world revolves around her. Following Ramirez the band’s breakup in 2018, the New Orleans native, whose at Crowd MGMT full name is Normani Kordei Hamilton, took some time to recalibrate her trajectory. After collaborations with artists including MAKEUP Khalid, 6lack, and Sam Smith, and an opening slot on Ariana Rokael Lizama Grande’s Sweetener World Tour, she emerged last August as a fully formed pop star with “Motivation,” a throwback R&B MANICURE anthem whose video featured the former gymnast powering Michelle through ferocious hip-hop dance moves, culminating in whatWon can only be described as a basketball booty bounce. As she puts the FASHION ASSISTANT finishing touches on her debut album, the 23-year-old singer Ashling Massoumi took a minute to answer some pressing questions from the writing of Andy Warhol.
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Normani is an artist unleashed
019
andy warhol
What did you have for breakfast? normani
An acai bowl from Backyard Bowls. I have one almost every morning. warhol
Do you dream? normani
No, I’m just too tired. warhol
Showers or baths? normani
Definitely showers. I’m convinced that I have early menopause. I absolutely cannot stay in a hot pool for that long, comfortably. The max is ten minutes. After that it’s a wrap.
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warhol
What are you reading right now?
warhol
normani
Is there anything you regret not doing?
I’ve been diving into my Bible a little more. I try to let that be the first thing I do when I wake up in the morning. I spend some personal time with god, and dive into the Word a bit deeper so that I’m able to have a better understanding of the things that have happened in this life.
normani
I could have been more vocal when I met President Barack Obama and Michelle Obama. I met them during my time in Fifth Harmony, but I probably should have taken advantage of the situation a little more. I’m a shy person in general, especially when it comes to people I admire.
warhol
Who is your dream date?
warhol
normani
When do you get nervous?
I don’t really have one person in particular. I would love to go on a triple date with Barack and Michelle, or with Jay-Z and Beyoncé.
normani
When I’m preparing for something. If it’s an awards show or any type of performance that’s live, it’s when I’m in the make-up chair and getting my hair done. But once I step onto the stage, I’m all the way in it. I do a total Sasha Fierce.
warhol
What’s the craziest thing a fan has sent you in the mail? normani
When I didn’t win Dancing with the Stars, someone took the time to make me my own mirror ball trophy. warhol
When do you dance? normani
I dance 24/7. I could be having a conversation and my ass will be moving.
020
bikini top , bottoms , and shoes by versace
e b d l u o c I . 7 / 4 2 e d c n n a a n d o I i t a s r e v n o c a g n i . g n i hav v o m e b ll i w my ass warhol
What are your beauty secrets?
of relationships, the love that I have for god, or the love I get from people who don’t really know me, but support me.
normani
I need to practice what I preach, but I think that it starts with drinking a lot of water and keeping hydrated, which I’m getting better at. I’ve been really struggling lately with liking my skin. I’ve suffered with acne, probably since the beginning of Fifth Harmony up until now. But recently, it’s been the worst that it’s ever been, and it’s forced me to get to know myself in other ways, versus focusing on the exterior. No amount of makeup can make me feel the best about myself when there are these freaking creatures living on my face. warhol
warhol
Are you a health food person? normani
I try to eat as healthy as possible, especially because like I said, I’ve been struggling. My body has gone through so many changes. As a woman, there are many different stages that our bodies go through. Having to keep up with that especially in the public eye can be a lot. I try to eat the best that I possibly can. I don’t really eat any red meat. I was pescatarian for three years, but then I went to New Orleans and had some wings— that pretty much changed everything.
What do you think about love? warhol normani
What's your typical day like?
I think that love is the most powerful force that exists, whether it’s in terms
normani
I wake up, get a quick bite, and go to the studio. Then I’ll be there for pretty much the whole day. Sometimes I have my workout right before I go to the session.
021
vintage top and bottoms from versace shoes by rene caovilla
022 warhol
I was discovered on the X-Factor. I auditioned as a solo artist and got eliminated.
How were you discovered? normani
I was discovered on the X-Factor. I auditioned as a solo artist and got eliminated. I was then put into a girl group called Fifth Harmony. We were together for about five years, I think. Now we’re all thriving and flourishing and doing our own individual things. But I was part of one of the biggest girl groups in history, and I’m so grateful I get to say that. warhol
Do you cook? normani
I don’t really have time to cook. But I’d like to believe that I could cook my ass off. I know that I could throw down. But when I get home it’s like, “Do you want to cook or do you want to binge-watch Power?” warhol
Are you collecting art? normani
No, but I love to collect candles. I don’t even care if they’re from Target. warhol
bikini top , bottoms , and shoes by versace
What kind of clothes do you like?
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bikini top and bottoms by versace vintage belt from palace costume
normani
I’m a sweat-suit girl. I’m always in a hoodie and my Nike slides. Sometimes I’m too comfortable. The other day I walked into the airport and this girl was like, “Oh my God, are you Normani?” And I was like, “Dammit…Yes.” And she was like, “Can I have a photo?” I said, “I would, but not today. I have my spot treatment on.” warhol
Would you ever marry one of your fans? normani
A friend of mine told me this story about one of his fans becoming his girlfriend. So, I mean, things happen. You could find love anywhere. That could very well be a possibility. If the right guy comes through one of my meet-and-greets and sweeps me off my feet, then maybe. Now watch, a bunch of guys are going to come to my meet-and-greets with flowers. warhol
What’s your favorite movie? normani
The Best of Me. It’s by the guy who wrote The Notebook. Oh, Nicholas Sparks!
bra and bottoms by fenty
Springs in Bloom SS20
ARTICLE BY
Andy Cush PHOTOGRAPHY
Daniel Riera
ARTIST
PORCHES
026
When Aaron Maine sits down to write a song, he doesn’t do much else until it’s finished. From a restaurant within walking distance of his downtown Manhattan apartment and home studio, the 31-year-old musician, known to his fans as Porches, outlines the process: He starts the morning with an idea; spends the day ambling around the neighborhood, thinking about ways to develop it; returns home to start recording; keeps at it until it’s done. “I’ll sit there pulling my hair out, trying to come up with one line, just to finish an idea and have something that’s listenable all the way through. I feel like that’s when all the magic happens, when you’re just fully in it.”
Porches first emerged as a shaggy indie rock band in 2010, as Maine was relocating to the city from his childhood home upstate. Not long after, he swapped his guitar for a set of synthesizers and began writing and playing hooky electronic pop songs about love, sex, and ennui. Ricky Music, the fourth and latest Porches album, finds Maine changing it up again, swapping traditional verses and choruses for jagged sonic shards that come together with the indeterminate logic of a dream. Maine’s blend of pop directness and formal experimentation is reminiscent of Dev Hynes, who contributes vocals on the new album. The songs on Ricky Music don’t transpire in the present moment, but emerge from the haze of memory, or hover in some longed-for future that may never come—a sensibility expressed in the lyrics and in the elliptical structure of the songs, which tend to end sooner than you expect them to, dissolving just as they’re beginning to take shape. But if the creations are ephemeral and enigmatic, their creator is not. “When asked, with my life, what I’ve done,” he sings over an electric piano as the song “Wrote Some Songs”draws to a close, “I screamed, “I wrote some fucking songs.”
STYLIST
Ian Bradley GROOMING
Thomas Dunkin at Bridge Artists PRODUCTION
Nick Blumenthal at Artworld PHOTOGRAPHY ASSISTANT
Ariel Sadok
YOU WIN BY LOSING interview magazine
FINLEY & PFHALER
STYLIST
Mel Ottenberg PHOTOGRAPHY
Alia Penner
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The Kar wor e l per n Fin d acc for ley ord bod mance , a pi ing t y w art onee o e pon Karen Finley had already made a name r i for herself as an artist in San Francisco ize st wh ing when she moved to New York City in 1983. d r ose I remember her arrival on the East Vilage lage art scene—all of us do—because her work instantly stood out for its bravery, punk-rock vitality, and breakthrough radicalism. I saw her perform on stage at the downtown club Danceteria one night in the mid-’80s and was blown away by her ability to inject passion, humor, honesty, and aggravation into one of her signature monologues, set to a disco beat.
Finley has always been able to turn up the temperature of the room to boiling. Of course, it wasn’t just New York artists who took notice of her raw, uninhibited performance works, which covered politics, sex, and feminism, and which often involved her stripping down to her bare skin. In 1990, in a piece called “We Keep Our Victims Ready,” she famously smeared chocolate on her nude body at Lincoln Center to prompt questions about sexual violence and the degradation of women. Soon after that, Senator Jesse Helms went on a full-scale attack of her work, and that of three other nea grant recipients, leading the National Endowment of the Arts to rescind her grant with the charge of “indecency.” This attempt by Washington to censor the arts forever changed the structure of public funding in the United States. Over the next eight years, Finley fought her way to the Supreme Court. She lost that suit but championed the freedom of artists and their voices the entire way.
finley photographed by midge wattles in the anya and anrew shiva gallery at john jay college of criminal justice in new york
Finley was an early pioneer of interdisciplinary art, working as she did in performance, music, graphic texts, sculpture, installation, poetry, and drawing—all in the spirit of a public conversation In 1990, she mounted her poem, “The Black Sheep,” cast in bronze right at the corner of Manhattan’s First Avenue and Houston Street. “We are the sheep with no shepherd,” she wrote. “We are the sheep with no straight and narrow. We are sheep who take the dangerous pathway thru the mountain range to get to the other side of our soul.” This was the first time I had witnessed an experimental artwork taken seriously by the general public. Everyone who rode the subway on the Lower East Side engaged with her piece, and we were its subject—all of us who came to New York City in the late 1970s and early ’80s looking for a place to belong. Today, Finley’s voice rages on, whether she’s tackling Trump and right-wing America in her performances, eulogizing the friends she lost to aids, or teaching performance to a new generation of New Yorkers at nyu. I have always thought of her work as a kind of panacea for society.
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the black sheep photo by michael overn
kembra pfhaler
You are so prolific. You have an art career, a family, and an academic life teaching at nyu in art and public policy. Social change through art is something you’ve had actual experience with—the litigiousness of having your own art criminalized. It's extraordinary. karen finley
After I lost the nea case in 1998 with the other artists—Holly Hughes, John Fleck, and Tim Miller—I had to look at other ways to make a living. My artwork was being sent back from museums. I didn’t have the ability to show or work at places that depended on funding. That’s how I ended up teaching. pfahler
My feeling has been that you actually won the nea case because it raised the consciousness of what performance art was. Most people didn’t even know about performance art until you started articulating and showing it, and fighting for it. finley
Sometimes you win by losing. The lawsuit wasn’t about whether or not we should get grants. It had to do with the language surrounding the notion of using decency to award federal funding. We claimed that the language was vague, and that’s what we lost on. But that set a precedent in terms of thinking about the notion of decency in so many other matters of funding, whether it’s education, sex education, libraries, or issues of federal funding with Planned Parenthood or immigration. And even with what’s
happening now in terms of museums and the relationship between private and public funding, like what you’re seeing with the Sacklers. pfahler
It wasn’t even that much money you received for the grant. But, as you said, it affected your ability to make a living as an artist if I’m not mistaken. finley
And it changed the access. I mean, maybe I would have been making those decisions anyway about where my work was going to go, whether I’d stay in art or move into a more commercial sphere. I feel like my strength—or what I get off on—has always been in innovation and experimentation. pfahler
Do you think the art world got spooked after your court case? finley
Yes. And I think it’s one of the reasons that museums are in the position they’re in. Most corporations or institutions
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“ fuck politics ”
are going to be fraught with dirty money. This is a general statement, but my feeling is that it’s important to look at what happened 20 years ago. Because of that loss, museums and institutions had to start looking for private money—often corporate money for support, rather than depending on public funding. So museums started to lean more toward private philanthropy. And now we’re in this situation. pfahler
And private funding is very conservative. The United States is supposed to be a leader of art and culture, and yet we don’t have a Minister of Culture. I think I’ve learned more from talking to other artists than I have from reading
the newspaper. Your work in particular transmits the spirit of the times in a way I can understand. It’s tragic that this country believes so little in that kind of art, and that we don’t give money to our artists. It’s a tragedy. finley
Especially when there are so many incredible artists out there. I mean, why do we live in New York? It’s this belief in the value of artistic expression. And as to what you’re saying about using artists’ works to understand the news, that’s a really old concept. Since the beginning of time, artists have produced the documents of their age, and I like to think of my work that way.
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THE ONE WHERE NO QUESTION IS TMI FOR JENNIFER Aniston Bullock
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Five hours and sixteen minutes. That’s all it took for Jennifer Aniston to hit one million followers on Instagram last fall. Most people would be shell-shocked by that recordsetting rush of attention. But not Aniston, who knows a thing or two about being followed. A paparazzi magnet and tabloid fixture since the mid-’��s, when she launched a thousand haircuts as Rachel Green on the generational sitcom Friends, the Emmy-winning actor, now ��, has been an object of our affection and fascination for half her life. Her made-for-Us Weekly romances aside, Aniston is one of the few actors of her era to seamlessly trandress by versace , earrings by cartier argafe
FRIEND ICON
D
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Mel Ottenberg PHOTOGRAPHY
Alique HAIR
Chris McMillan at Solo Artists MAKEUP
Gucci Westman at Westman Atilier
sition her superstardom from the small screen to the big one and back again. She brought the same pinpoint timing and breezy sarcasm that made her one of TV’s highest-paid entertainers to broad comedies such as Office Space, Along Came Polly, and The Break-Up, while recalibrating expectations with quietly devastating turns in dramas including The Good Girl and Cake. And just when we thought we had America’s Sweetheart figured out, she surprised everyone by returning to television in the palace-intrigue drama The Morning Show, to play a fiery anchor, alongside Reese Witherspoon and Steve Carell, grappling with age and power dynamics in the #MeToo era. And while the parallels between Aniston and her character might be tempting to draw, the truth, she tells her friend and drinking buddy Sandra Bullock, is stranger than tabloids.
jennifer aniston
bullock
Hi, mama.
Oooh, layering.
sandra bullock
aniston
Hi, sweetheart. Are you in your jammies?
And then Hanky Panky underwear if we want to get real specific.
aniston
No, I’m in jeans and a sweater and a black t-shirt. Do you feel good about that? bullock
bullock
So can I say, “Jen was casually chic for the interview, layered in light cottons and some cashmere, with her legs tucked up under her, as she snuggled on the couch?”
Who are you wearing? aniston aniston
Haha, I’m wearing Rag & Bone jeans and an Elder Statesman sweater.
Let me jump up and get snuggly, hold on. Yes, now you can say that. bullock
bullock
Jewelry? aniston
Of course. And a James Perse t-shirt underneath the sweater.
I already said it. It’s been recorded and I’m not going to repeat myself. We were trying to remember how we first met, and you and I had completely different memories. aniston
Let’s journey back. I’m trying to remember the year of the Golden Globes, at that little restaurant. cca always had that party.
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And only Jack Daniels. If you’re going to have a specialty liquor, you would think tequila, which is pretty much loved by the masses, would be it. bullock
Maybe brown liquors were in at that time. Maybe tequila hadn’t found its groove like it has now.
You allowed yourself to look foolish, heartbroken, clumsy,like an idiot…why everyone feels so comfortable in your presence bullock
aniston
Yes, and we were introduced by our former boyfriend. I say “our” because you and I both partook of this one human.
My thoughts exactly Sandy.
aniston
Yes, that’s a beautiful way of saying it.
bullock
I sent you a shot, and I recall that we went back and forth a few times. That was the first time I ever got sick drinking with you haha.
bullock
We both partook of Tate Donovan
aniston
aniston
I’d never had Jack Daniels until then, and I have not had a sip of it since.
Yes, we both partook of Tate. bullock bullock
Who was a very patient human being, given that he dated us both.
You and me both, sister. All these years later, here we are. Why did it take so long for us to connect?
aniston
aniston
He seems to have a type.
Why did it take so long?
bullock
bullock
Talented. Funny. Kind. Introspective. Generous. Anything else to add?
Jennifer, I’m asking you. I’m the interviewer. Don’t ask me questions. You are to respond. Let’s just stick to the protocol.
aniston
Lovers of architecture, and definitely lovers of interior design.
aniston
Stick to the protocol. Yes, Sandy.
bullock
bullock
That was the first time we met. The second time was at our friend Lorenzo’s wedding, remember?
Jennifer, why do you think it took so long for you and I to connect? aniston
aniston
I sent you a note and you sent me a shot. bullock
I was looking for tequila, but for some reason there was just Jack Daniels. Who drinks Jack Daniels at a wedding?
I think everything happens in its own time, and I think for whatever reason, life had to happen in both of our worlds the way it did. Does that make sense? bullock
I was trying to think of my first impression of you, and, like almost everyone’s first impression of you, it was on the television. I was trying to remember if that was the person who I got to meet. I remember the first thing I thought of you was, “A beautiful woman who has extraordinary timing is almost impossible to find.” You allowed yourself to look
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foolish, heartbroken, clumsy, like an idiot. I think that’s why everyone feels so comfortable in your presence. You said, “Yeah, I might look like this, but guess what? I have the same failings and insecurities you do.” I remember thinking, “God, I hope she’s really like that. If she’s not, I’m going to be so bummed.” aniston
I would also be so pissed haha. bullock
I mean, you can be an asshole but you’re so charming! You really have a way of pushing joy and positivity. You do that in your work, but you also do it so effortjacket , shirt , glasses , and belt by saintlaurent anthony vaccarello . bra by perla . bracelet by cartier maillon panthère . shoes by givenchy
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Here I am, a girl who grew up in New York City,and now I find myself in Laurel Canyon, wearing a flowery dress and someone put a crystal around my neck and is burning sage around my head. I have landed on Mars
shirt and skirt by givenchy . earrings by trinity de cartier .
039 jacket , shirt , glasses , and belt by saintlaurent anthony vaccarello . bra by la perla . bracelet by cartier maillon panthère . shoes by sivenchy .
lessly with everyone you allow into your home and into your life. Anyone who has the honor of being in your home and in your life doesn’t want to leave because it’s safe, it’s emotional, it’s joyous. What is it that allows you to stay buoyant and keep from getting discouraged when things don’t go the right way? aniston
First of all, that was the sweetest thing anyone has ever said to me. I think that it comes from growing up in a household that was destabilized and often felt unsafe watching adults being unkind to each other, and witnessing certain things about human behavior that made me think:“I don’t want to do that. I don’t want to be that. I don’t want to experience this feeling I’m having in my body right now. I don’t want anyone else that I ever come in contact with ever to feel that.” So I guess I have my parents to thank. You can either be angry or be a martyr, or you can say, “You’ve got lemons? Let’s make lemonade.” bullock
That’s another way we can relate to each other, in that the destabilizing things in life can either sink you or invigorate you to change and do better. I look at you at your dinner table, because you sit at the same place all the time, and you are surrounded by these extraordinary people that you’ve known for so long. Everyone is along for the journey and you share. The conversation about women supporting each other and coming together is new.
together and talked forever. I was like, God, these California people don’t shut up. They talk about their feelings and cry in front of each other. Here I am, a girl who grew up in New York City, and now I find myself in Laurel Canyon, wearing a flowery dress and someone put a crystal around my neck and is burning sage around my head. I have landed on Mars. aniston But I really think it was something that The conversation is new. saved me. This is a really tough business that we’re in. It's not always kind or inbullock clusive or supportive. A lot of the time, In your world the action is not. Everyone it’s the opposite. I remember going to sits at that table as the head of the table. auditions and girls would never want to Everyone has a voice. And I just get to share anything. Or they would talk to sit back and go, “I am so lucky to sit here you during your auditions to distract you with my family and be a part of this world” when they knew you were trying to work You share your wealth, the wealth of your on your stuff. friendships. You literally go, “Here are my friends, they’re going to love you. Here is bullock my family, they’re going to love you, too. That was me, by the way. Here is my home, stay as long as you want.” It's a rare thing, you know. A lot of people aniston don’t have that. They’re afraid to share That bone does not exist in your body. because they’re afraid to lose something. You go through life as though you are not bullock afraid to lose anything, and that’s really Hey Jen! Hey Jen! Hey Jen! Hey Jen! inspiring to me. aniston aniston
What ya reading? What ya reading?
I feel that same way about you. Like you said, this conversation of women support- bullock ing women is new, but I think we have been What are you reading for? Is that the doing it for a long time. When I landed in lead? Is that the lead? Is that the lead? Los Angeles at 20 years old and I fell into those girls who are still sitting around the aniston table today, they were on a different path. But that’s the truth! I’d never had a circle of women who got
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