Rationality Vs Islam by frank fubu

Rationality Vs Islam

Religious debates are very common. Not a single one ends good, but that doesn't stop people for arguing. They actually enjoy it: contradicting people, insulting, making fun or even genuinely trying to ‐ahem‐ convince people with arguments. In the following debate provided by our friend Rhino (which also does a cameo appearance!) we see our Muslim friend Abida Haling trying to have a civilized discussion with the ‐‐purportedly‐‐ atheist James Stewart, which does everything in his power to upset Abida and other Islam advocates. There are other participants in the discussion, but it's mainly Stewart and Abida driving the debate, either against each other or against the opposition in turn. The discussion in itself is far from exciting or enlightening, but it's entertaining nonetheless, provided you're interested somehow in these matters. You can see how "Rationality" be used as a cover for ignorance (and trollness) and how Muslims had a very hard time being understood, without being taken as simply "fanatics". I'm not taking sides here; either way it's hard to take these debates seriously. If you're easily offended (or bored) by these type of discussions,

DON'T continue…….reading!!!

21 de octubre de 2011 14:24

Abida Haling Yes Glenn u are right we must respect but people can be mean I still say respect each others religons even if you don't approve Mohammed Jelani the west fear of islam and muslems more than they fear of God! Tom Mathews Abida, i call my drug Quran. Because when i burn it, i get stoned. Abida Haling Tom I pity you never disrespect anyone's books religion that's all you terrorists are good at burning holy books shame on you go to hell oh but you are in he'll Abida Haling Tom you must be a sad person going on mostly peaceful posts in Facebook and trying to spread hate well your the devil himself everywhere stop drugging urself sad case :( 2

Abida Haling Tom it's not about religion you are one nasty piece of work a sad case I only pity you poor sod Tom Mathews I beleive we should burn all the religious scriptures. We dont need no religion or beleive in a divine freak. Religion, especially the one claiming to that of 'peace' founded by Mr He Who Must Not Be Drawn is the cause of all the problems in the world. Basil Atov Islam is a religion of violence. I suggest that the muslems should learn how to live peacefully from their christian counterparts and believe u me terrorism will become a thing of d past thereby paving a way for progress across d globe. Abida Haling Tom we need something to follow you don't believe it's upto you we must respect each other as humans let's forget religion for abit Abida Haling Basil don't you start respect each other that's all

Abida Haling I'm not a terrorist slot of Muslims are peace loving not terrorists very small portion same with all religions you will get that everywhere Tom Mathews Like someone said 'religion is the opium of the masses.' Tom Mathews Atheism means peace! Pedro Tochas Islàm fastest growing faith in britain: bbc "the british govt channel". http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-12075931 Muneer Dange Salam @Abida there'll be a day when they'll account to their deeds on that day they'll remember and regret which means nothing while they are too late. Allahumma A'izzal islama walmuslim wa adhillashshirka wal-mushrikeen wa dammir yahood wa a'awanunhum. 3

Abida Haling Peace is in the heart we must respect each other Pedro Tochas recentlÿ 100000 brits convértéd to Islam.http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-42 John Parker Bakhsh Arabs, Muslims, Jews they are the same people with their same god and prophets calling to kill the non-believers (kaffirs). Wherever they settle they cause trouble. They have ruined many countries including Iran and the Middle East! Saajida Gora wow... 'muslims to come out of the century old lifestyle' ... how dare u? Is God modern?????? Abida Haling Mashallah brother muneer well said :) Abida Haling John it's the outside countries that cause problems in the Muslim countries are you blind??

Abida Haling Another thing the bible says a tooth for a tooth. Eye for a eye so give and take so if Muslims do the same they are terrorists no justice Abida Haling Well John bakhsh is a Muslim name right?? Patrick Aryee muslems in britain are the most liberated and protected in the world to the extent that they stage open demonstrations on streets under police protection and they are often violent and they don't deserve this freedom of expression. Who ever wrote this should check his or her facts again, Abida Haling So Patrick when are we violent please explain

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Muneer Dange Salaam@ at Abida they've gone far all we can do is to pray for them to understand if they're among those that'll believe otherwise hell fire is there waiting for them. since when their ancestors have been trying to make this religion history? but all in vain cos Allah (S.W.A) promise to protect His region and He will we cannot stop any one from what ever he think he can do Allah knows all that happens Abida Haling Salaam brother we have indeed done our bit Allah will ask these people were you told about Islam what will they say?? They will say they mocked and disbelieved. It's never too late to change. Alot of hate for us Muslims in this world it's sad John Parker Bakhsh @Abida, everyone must have a Muslim name in Iran, that is the law or they will be discriminated against. Another stupid Islamic law people have to live under in those countries. Count yourself lucky living in the West. Abida Haling John I thank Allah for my bounties so it's written and so it shall be done. Our law isn't stupid get a real education no ones asking you to become a Muslim are they Abida Haling We are the people of the book Jews, Christians and Muslims

so the last book was the Koran but everyone set in there ways Allah knows best Pedro Tochas 14% mĂšslims in russia follow Islam under communist rule. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_in_Russia Abida Haling Some people here have abused our prophet and god I'm sorry but not having it. I haven't said nothing about anyone's gods I respect Jesus as He is a prophet but Christians have made him son of god that's ur beliefs carry on being blind but I'm not Saajida Gora But we forgetting all the discrimination of Muslims in the other countries like Africa, paris, U.S and israel.

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John Parker Bakhsh I don't believe in 'what is written or done', you are what you make yourself. This is precisely the thinking that keeps Muslims in their backward societies of intolerance towards others. I do have a real education and thankfully and it's not contaminated by any religious indoctrination either. Abida Haling Well israel/ Palestine the biggest example well well the zionists certainly not going to change giving the Jews a bad name not all of them are the same discrimination everywhere Abida Haling Let's be honest a Jew and a Muslim can never be friends. They are taking revenge on something we haven't don't hitler punished them now they are punishing us instead Robert Craig Johnston Forcing Islam down anyone's throat is not logical, not sane and not welcome. Imperialist religion and imperialist governments, cults, tribes or corporations is NOT progress! I thought we had turned that page! What the F is going on with the backwards nonsense! There's a rebellion going on around the world now AGAINST imperialist nonsense and the global rebellion is clearly pro-democracy, pro-social justice, prosustainable culture, pro-inclusiveness and tolerance, pro-accountability, pro-

transparency, pro-safety, pro-liberty. So what the hell is behind this expansionist, militant Islamic aggression? Stop it! Abida Haling Dear all no one is forcing any religion down anyone's throat that is wrong completely. Well John that's ur views I'm sticking to mine I'm blessed and happy to be a Muslim and wish the same for my Muslims brothers and sisters across the world Saajida Gora thank u Robert.... to me be my reilgion and to u be yours. Abida Haling Anyway no one can force anyone to change religion it should come natural each one to it's own

John Parker Bakhsh @Abida how can you say that a Muslim and a Jew can never be friends? They are both the 'people of the Book' according to their religious scriptures. Wasn't Mohammed's first wife Khadija, a Jew and all Muslim men are allowed to marry a Jewish or Christian woman without her changing religions? That is what I heard from the Islamic scholars. Janet Greyling Viljoen NONSENSE Abida, Just be grateful for the fact that you are living in a democratic society, I don't think you will like anywhere else.ps. Nothing wrong with being a Jew, Christian or a Muslim, just respect each other like you like to be respected by others Abida Haling Nonsense Janet I never said nothing wrong about being a Jew dear you made your own assumptions dear I respect all religions woman read my comments above I respect all religions maybe you should try it Janet I am grateful woman or can't you read Abida Haling Well John the Jews of today are different are they sorry I mean zionists in Israel I thankfully have only Christian Hindu Sikh and even atheist friends. John you know enough about Islam and you still disbelieve Pedro Tochas robért, we mùslims r ur friénds & trying to savé u people frm héllfiré.

Gulnaz Baloch Global caliphate way to go! Abida Haling Well John why go to Islamic scholars you have no respect for anyone's religion. Prophets first wife khadija wasnt a Jew dear he did marry a Jew but the Jew converted dear get your facts right John Abida Haling Well John from the prophets time Muslims and Jews haven't really got on well. We hope it changes but when all these years and now they are claiming other people land and you want me to like them. We are of the same book but big difference in faith Allah is my god Abida Haling Sajida who's side are you seem like a hypocrite but are you not a Muslim?? Well stay away from me or we will clash

Anyanzo Sunday @James, Shame on u James. It's a shame to u dat u abuse God when ur name is in da Bible. U have shortened ur life by dat better repent and cry for ur life. Pedro Tochas inshallàh caliphate will comé. thé solûtioñ to wholé humañitÿ. Pedro Tochas sajida gorà is a niçe mùslim gal. Abida Haling Bible Koran Torah I respect you all may not believe in the Torah and bible but I respect you can a non Muslim say that here I doubt it very much people talking about burning the Koran I would never burn the torah or bible may my hands burn if that happens we are different we must respect each other Abida Haling Is she pedro it's just I'm trying to talk sense in to someone and she likes there comments muslims need to unite everywhere thanks pedro Saajida Gora Well Abida... u spit fire of ignorance today... i dnt wish to

offend u but ur hatred is flashing on this page and thereby protuding a bad reflection of ISlam Abida Haling James all this anger and hate calm down Pedro Tochas jamés bùddÿ u havé no shame, u abuse our faith & allah. u will burn in hellfire with other kafirs. Saajida Gora One of the teachings of Islam is Sabr and tolerance and to insult and hurt others intentionallly is shud be sorely grieved Anyanzo Sunday @James u are possesed by demons. A nomally person doesn't speak like u. U need Jesusu Christ da son of da living God to deliver u from dat bondage.

Abida Haling Sajida I have no hate only understanding and pity you I am only talking the truth about peace and respecting each other you don't know me dear tries to reason with people but didn't work I'm sorry won't have my religion trod on I'm peace loving don't have to explain to you Saajida Gora @pedro...thank u brother.. i hav been with u on many Aljazeera Platforms and ur comments are effective and ur research thorough Abida Haling Sajida these people are swearing at Allah I have many non Muslim friends and they do not say bad stuff so Sajida you stick to what u believe I will stick to my belief and I'm not ignorant you might be but I'm not Pedro Tochas @sundaÿ, god has no soñ, daughtér, mothèr & fathér he is alone powér of universe. Abida Haling Islam is about peace read all my comments dear I have many friends can you say the same sajida

James Stewart Hrm, so I'm posessed by demons that don't exist, and going to a hell that does not exist, and in need of a Jesus who did not exist as portrayed...*yawn* This mental illness needs to be cured. James Stewart @Anyanzo: So, if he can deliver me from my so-called bondage, why can't he delver you from your failure to master the English language? Abida Haling Yes sabr is important but anyway these people will suffer at the end swearing and insulting god isn't the answer to all out there may Allah guide you ameen James Stewart Allah: The only modern god with a pedophile for a prophet. Abida Haling Well Sajida you keep ur opinion I stock to mine ok 9

Pedro Tochas sajida thanks sistér u r moré intelligént thañ me i m just a ordinary bullfighter who pùt his live in dangér for little$ Abida Haling James now that is wrong should never criticise anyone's religion and that's all I have been doing all evening defending my religion while others sleep Saajida Gora I am just a tiny slave of Allah with no friends int his world so if it pleases u to be correct then so it shall be but to walk with ur head held high and accuse me of being a hypocrite thn u may jus wnt to take another look at urself Anyanzo Sunday @Pedro, dats where u get it wrong. Da God of christians is different from da Allah of Mosilms. God has son called Jesus christ but Allah does not have a son. Saajida Gora U throw out words like Jews and muslims cannot be friends... wht kind of logic or teachings is this...definitley not from my Islam

Abida Haling Actually Sajida I'm no hypocrite you trying to be high and mighty I'm very humble dear and don't like Allah being sworn at you so so be it Abida Haling Sajida please stay away from me I don't know you and I really dislike you may allah forgive me but you are getting on my nerves Eva Cubil Rivas I am Christian Catholic but I do respect ISLAM. Respect each other. Abida Haling You might be Alisha slave but where have you defended Allah or our dear prophet today I will not have my religion been sworn at peace to you James Stewart PS: If you don't like your religion being cursed by others...maybe you should keep it to yourself. 10

Anyanzo Sunday @James, u are not fit 4 this debate. U better stage your English debate somewhere else. If u can only scrap James from your name, it would have saved u much shame. Abida Haling Sorry I meant Allahs slave I may come out agressive but I am not but don't like people swearing at the true religion we must unite not tear each other apart you don't like my opinions well that's ur choice but I am not ignorant forgive me I have hurt you sajida Pedro Tochas sùnday, how càn a super créature havé a human child, bùt its up to u & ur faith. bùt mÿ allàh is aloñe power in universe Abida Haling Sajida we don't really know each other so we shouldn't judge I do apologise but back to the topic will not hear bad words about allah Abida Haling Sajida I stick to my Islam thank I have no jewish friends but

only see what they are doing to my brothers and sisters and Palestine I know they are not the same but we all have our own opinions each one to it's own Sajida :) Abida Haling Peace to you sister Sajida Khalid Omar @james stewart dnt be stupid'alah modern god' ur born yesterday in a world of hatred against islam,jst relaxed man,respect other religion and u know what,go to ur good dreams. Muhammad Yussuf @Pedro, super creature ? Saajida Gora Sister Abida...the enemy will try to bring Islam down withs piercing words that can dagger our hearts... sometimes the wiser defence mechanism to use can also be politeness and subtility for if we choose to behave like thm then soon we shall become like them... thank u for understanding 11

Saajida Gora i guess i tactics differ but we shudnt insult each other... i forgive u and request ur forgiveness if its suitable for u. Anyanzo Sunday @Pedro, your Allah is one idol preserved by prophet Muhammad out of the 360 idiols which existed in Mecca. He distroyed 359 and left out one called Allah. Allah is da black stone housed in da Kabbah where every Mosilm must face to while praying. Abida Haling Sajida I'm tired of arguing lol if anyone sits down and notes how long I have been arguing they would laugh at me. Let them insult the truth will come out at the end judgement day isn't far god bless you Duķ Antraks Merol Paşa the truth is that the Western world will never accept Muslims. sad but that's how it is. The West tolerates anything, as long as you are not a Muslim, a Jehovah Witness or a Mormon, because then suddenly there are exceptions to civil rights.

Anyanzo Sunday @James, da topic is on religon which u luck any basic understanding on not English. I pitty ur parents who brought u up. Saajida Gora @Anyanzo... u are currently showing all readers ur ignorance by stating Allah is the black stone... Pls recheck ur notes for making claims like this u fool only urself.. Inbox me if u need to learn abt Islam... dnt be afraid u can still remain whatever ur religion u hav chosen Abida Haling Salaam Sajida all forgiven and forgotten I tried to be patient If you read back but people can be cruel these are words imagine the anger we would feel if we all that made comments were face to face Duķ Antraks Merol Paşa Anyanzo, the Black Stone is only a landmark, not itself an idol

James Stewart @Anyanzo: And you're still continuing to show us that even with schools in the ghetto, it is hard for a black man t get a decent education. For that, I pity you...but perhaps you should at least -try- and look like you know the language before making yourself look like the retard that you seem to be. Muneer Dange @Abida well done jaxakallahu khairan you've done well so far may Arrahman rahamatize you abundantly may we all die as muslims and wake up muslims by the will of Allah. but as a matter of facts those peoples are being brain washed by the jews but soon they'll understand and take the decision. Abida Haling Hello anyanzo our god isn't the black stone we don't worship idols our god doesn't need to be seen only felt allhumdillah millions of Muslims go to the Kaaba every day Allah is not a idol Khalid Omar @Anyanzo the black stone in makka,all muslim face their when they are praying to show unity,ALLAH IS OVER THE SEVENTH HEAVEN IN HIS Throne,pliz read the quran,we are guided by quran!

Anyanzo Sunday @Gora, facts are bitter. I will join u guys tomorrow (after 7 hrs) good 9nt. Abida Haling James I'm sure you don't mean don't spread hate just spread love Pedro Tochas sun, u r idiot allah exist in whole universe, kaba black hoùse is shriñe of our holÿ prophet & direction for prayer. Abida Haling Salam muneer I have a headache can't hear a bad word about Allah and his last prophet will not hear it. When I was very young someone in class swore at the prophet and I cried and I was only around ten. We will inshallah die as Muslims inshallah James Stewart @Abida: You would be incorrect about yet another aspect of reality then. Not only do I know I would do so, I have, on many, many occasions. 13

Abida Haling James I have inteligence I have Islam what do you have?? James Stewart @Abida: Religion and Intelligence are mutually exclusive. Try again. Naeem Ahmed @ james ! Learn to respect other religions! Thats one aspect of a normal human being. Abida Haling Dear James I have enough intelligence what so you have answer me?? Muneer Dange To you Muslims bothers and sisters, these people are brain washed they are not allowed to faced anything spiritual so how do you think that they'll have respect to anything? people that did not respect their parent that have birth to them just because they are eighteen years old, people that worship football, people that drink alcohol morethan any other thing people that are gays and lesbians..... Fa Inna-Lillahi wa Inna-

ilayhir-raji'un Duķ Antraks Merol Paşa And if the Christian shows lack of knowledge, the Atheist shows racism… classy… real classy… Pedro Tochas mùslims live in différent directioñs of world north, south etc. so théy neéd a centre point or direction to pray salàt. James Stewart Abida, my dear, delusional raghead. If you are a Muslim, you are not intelligent. Being muslim negates any possibility of intelligence due to the simple fact that Allah does not exist. The same can be said for any religion, I am simply targeting Islam because you are stupid enough to defend it. Muhammad Yussuf Pastafarian, what a psychopath

Khalid Omar Jst been born without any reason,die without any reason,c'omon guyz think jst dont go like that!there must be some power,challenge death and i become a HEATHEN!gud nyt guyz,peace is islam! Saajida Gora the Mtv lifestyle is easier to follow than religion thats y the population of agnostics are increasing dramaticly Pedro Tochas extremist christians more often aré atheist. bços bÿ this waÿ théy abùsé othér faiths more easily. Duķ Antraks Merol Paşa I don't deny Stalin and Mao were intellligent and probably more than the religious politicians they faced - but were they more humane? keep digging… Abida Haling James I'm inteliigent I don't drink dont smoke don't take drugs bow down to only one god I asked you a question twice now what do you have I have everything. Allah does exist and you will know of it very soon I know it :)

Saajida Gora right on brother pedro... for then they hav no God to oversee their conscious. Luka Bulatovic I may only ask in my land there are Mosques why then its not allowed Churches to be built in Saudi Arabia Mecca and Medina? Abida Haling James no need to swear is there are you a pastafarian or a rastafarian??? Lol

James Stewart Abida: Your question is nebulous and loaded with religious dogma. You suffer from a mental illness and couple it with a complete lack of education. Your grammar is atrocious (I'd think a Deity would have brighter, more articulate spokesmen, wouldn't you?) and frankly...I've seen smarter arguments from Cerebral Palsy sufferers. What do I have? I have a mind capable of experiencing the real world, and dealing with my own troubles, without having to fall back on some mythical, magical, man in the clouds who doesn't exist. A.K.A. A properly functioning brain. You should try it. Khalid Omar 'allah dnt exist'its only u and ur immagination,wake up @james stewart Pedro Tochas thésé xtian athéists r hypocrite . théir atheism is onlÿ for islam & theÿ onlÿ targét islam bÿ their abuse. Duķ Antraks Merol Paşa Atheists cannot have a proper idea of universal values and ethics; even if they say they respect "human rights" or something similar, they only do so because that is the law of their civil codes not because they think it is intrinsically good. and the codes, of course, change with governments and in democracy they are an expression of the will of the majority (which can be wrong at times). every time they try to build a universal idea of ethics, they stumble upon having to recognize that values either are arbitrary (and therefore all values are equal) or they have to come from a higher order.

Abida Haling James I'm typing quickly so I can finish this argument with you nicely and go to bed quite frankly. I do not cate about your religious views only what you have?? My brain functions ok thanks for caring no alcohol in my system not a drop Pedro Tochas jamés u showéd ur trué colors. jùst visit japan & latin america to léarñ trùé meanings of atheism. James Stewart @Abida: You're such a moron it's almost painful. Intelligence has nothing to do with the consumption of Alcohol, it has to do with one's ability to deal with reality and face difficult, sometimes unanswerable questions without a magical backdrop. Something you are completely lacking. Now please, if you're leaving, go already and by the power of whatever god you believe in, I pray you die in your sleep.

Abida Haling Luke Saudia arabia is for Muslims only I thank Allah for banning the non mulims from there for people would do terrible things in our holy city long live Mecca and medina that's your answer Luka Muhammad Yussuf @James, what is the thing you love most ? Luka Bulatovic In my land there are mosques,why Church cant be made in Saudi Arabia? let some Muslim respond me Pedro Tochas jamés whén u beliéf in nothing theñ whÿ u r target only one faith? James Stewart @Pedro: Just call me The American Taxpayer since I seem to be sponsoring your education: Definition of ATHEISM 1. archaic : ungodliness, wickedness 2. a : a disbelief in the existence of deity b : the doctrine that there is no deity

Muneer Dange @James can you answer me this please? when people died what will happen to them? Duķ Antraks Merol Paşa James - how do you know the real world exists? is that not an act of faith too? and whoever said anything about a man in the clouds? Islam does not believe in a god with a human shape or any physical shape (and that would constitute idolatry); continue showing your bright ignorance. Eric Eides Of course Duk, that is merely your opinion of Atheists and cannot be proven true or false. Thank you for sharing =) Abida Haling James if I do die in my sleep then that's gods will rather die in sleep than some other way. You have proven to be a disgrace to mankind you stupid ignorant fool. Meet you on judgement day amen 17

Abida Haling Dear yussuf James likes hating peoples religions and swearing at the only god there is he's a loser god he's a nasty piece of work Pedro Tochas jamés, i m spanish speaking, eñglish is not mÿ mothér tongue if i call u a u.s cerdo & mono i doñt think u will like it. James Stewart In order of importance: @Muneer: The body decays, is processed by bacteria and other scavenging life forms. Slowly, over-time, recycled by the planet itself as it has been since the dawn of life on this planet. As for the 'spirit', there is no such thing. It's a construct of our over-active creative centers in our brains. @Pedro: Because only one faith is being actively defended in this comments section. I attack Christians, Jews, Taoists, Pagans, it doesn't matter. They're just not here right now, speaking up like idiots. @Muhammad: Your mother. (Oh, did you really expect a serious answer to that?)

Khalid Omar @look james the problem with u is that the litle science u have in ur smal brain and the kind of alcohol u drink make see ur right,but when we talk of God its something beyond ur little imagination,if there is no God why people die,ALLAH say in the quran if there is no God simply chalenge death,litle science make a person atheist but deep study of science make a believer! Saajida Gora @james ... one question for u ... hw did the order of the universe come abt... do u believe in the big bang theory or maybe evolution? Luka Bulatovic James atheist can explain anything except what is life lol Abida Haling James what a clever dickie you are or you think you are? Your a joke james a big joke racist 18

James Stewart @Duk: Allah is often portrayed as a male figure in many of the Islamic writings as well as his constant patriarchial behaviors. Therefore, according to proper english grammar, referring to him as a masculine figure is appropriate. Continue showing -your- ignorance. As for my understanding of the real world? It's amazing how we have these biological developments known as 'senses'. They're amazing. They allow you to see, hear, taste, smell and feel all sorts of things. Pedro Tochas jamés, ù u.s gùÿs can nevér be trùé atheists. ùr soldiers kill pple in thé namé of jesus in afgan, iraq & othér states. Saajida Gora @james ... the universe operates in a uniform laws of nature...y does this exist... wud u enlighten me with ur views... wud luv to hear another perspective Muneer Dange If you live with the belief that there is no God that means you and donkeys are mutually inclusive.

Duķ Antraks Merol Paşa Eric - the (few) Atheists I know who I can say are good people do recognize that values are arbitrary, that they themselves respect and defend human life and dignity because it feels good to them, not because they can argue it is intrinsically good. It's those who think there are universals without a higher order who come to justify actual evil. Abida Haling James spread your hate somewhere else. Your not wanted on this page ;) James Stewart PS: Khaled - How can we possibly believe you actually studied -ANYTHING- when you can't even spell simple words like 'you' or form a proper sentence complete with punctuation? Get an education.

James Stewart @Saajida: Ever taken a glass full of water and shaken it? If not, try it. One thing you'll notice is that as soon as your shaking falls into anything even close to a rhythm, the water will begin swirling in the cup. The universe is the same way. When the big bank sparked off, all sorts of energies and forces were going all sorts of berzerk, but as the spread of the universe itself continued, things fell into an order that worked. Just like the water, settling into the swirl. Chaos Theory + Adaptive Evolutionary physics. :) It's an interesting concept. Muhammad Yussuf @James , You thought i will be offended, sorry . i thought you will say your wife or pasta. It is clear that you are beside yourself. Muneer Dange if someone think that there is no God thank you for the discovery but simply stop your self from aging using your scientific intelligence. lol James Stewart @Muneer: Medical Science has already extended human life to roughly twice what it was 100 years ago. Research, try it some time. Theodros YeshiArega aren't those peaceful mosques ''made enough

damage'' brain-washing kids to be suicide bombers to earn virgins in heaven:) Luka Bulatovic There is spirit James,how then you explain counciousness(if its correctly spelled English is not my first language)?If we are like machines-computers as Hawking said how then we are all different?machines work all by same system Muneer Dange @ This is said in the book of muslims that is quran a book with over thousand years James Stewart @Luka: Learn something about genetics, adaptive evolution and Darwinian theory. Then return once you've answered your own question. Muneer Dange @ jame really i can see the case study michael jackson. lol 20

James Stewart If you're trying to be funny, try harder Muneer. You're about as entertaining as an amputee mime. Muhammad Yussuf ''Have the disbelievers not considered that the heaven and the earth were a joined entity, and we separated them and made from Water every living thing ? Then will they not believe ? Quran 2130 NOTHING MYSTERIOUS WITH BIG BANG. James Stewart Quote from the Quran = unworthy of consideration. We're talking about facts here, not fiction. keep up if you can. Pedro Tochas jamés, do u know abt câtherine schwarz? Muneer Dange @ James darwin theory is another theory of brain washing. Luka Bulatovic Science cannot explain genetics thoroughly,even if we simply ''shut down'' when we die genetic code is something wich is not

material and it creates wonders James Stewart @Luka: Actually, the Genetic code is nothing but a compilation of specifically organized proteins...therefore it -IS- physical material which decomposes with the rest of the body. You really didn't study much in school, did you? @Muneer: Thank you for proving you don't have a single point worth validating with a counter argument. The entire world (Minus the idiotic religious extremists) agree with Darwinian theory and it has been scientifically proven for over half a century. Goodbye, idiot. Muhammad Yussuf @James, which part of that quotation is against established science ? Pedro Tochas jamés, she is also añ atheist frm germañÿ, bùt a trùe atheist not hyprocite xtian atheist like ù. 21

Luka Bulatovic Counciousness cannot be just work of a proteins,if genetic code would decompose nothing would be left for offsprings to inherit.Love is not material,justice is not material,courage is not material,faith is not material James Stewart @Muhammad: Well, lets see, the concept of a Heaven. The concept of a sentient controlling power and the fact that it is derived from a book of fiction, thus rendering it unworthy of consideration. Muhammad Yussuf Quran 51- 47 '' and the universe we constructed with strength and indeed, we are EXPANDING IT '' James Stewart @Muhammad: Again, unworthy of consideration due to it's source and the assumed existence of a conscious, sentient, controlling power. Fail harder please, this is hilarious. Pedro Tochas ok guÿs bye, i m goiñg for a football match. dont wasté ur

time with this ameriçan xtian extremist 'james hypocrite'. James Stewart @Pedro: Do us a favor and pick up an English dictionary before you return. You seem to fail to understand such words as hypocrite, christian, atheist and quite a few others. James Stewart Proof of The truth: All arguments dissected and dismissed...Allah-trolls have dispersed. Muneer Dange @ James thank you for calling me idiot. but i see no reason why you're here where people of religion are having their words you come with your washed brain trying to interrupt i think you're not suit here dog. talk to the finger.

James Stewart @Muneer: Because this is where the religious slime are located and where there is the most need of a reality check. As for calling you an idiot...well...if the shoe fits. Fact is, there is nothing that can counter scientific fact. And scientific fact disproves any religion. Care to keep being shut down? Muhammad Yussuf '' It is not allowable for the sun to reach the moon, nor does the night overtake the day. but each, in an an orbit, is swimming.. Quran 36- 40 EVERYTHING IN PERFECT ORDER . Saajida Gora The greatest scientists have been struck by how strange this is. There is no logical necessity for a universe that obeys rules, let alone one that abides by the rules of mathematics. This astonishment springs from the recognition that the universe doesn't have to behave this way. It is easy to imagine a universe in which conditions change unpredictably from instant to instant, or even a universe in which things pop in and out of existence. Hawaii Blythe Oh Ooops did I press paste again.. "Religion is a severe mental illness created roughly 6000 years ago, at the same time as the Earth. Since then, religion has been one of the biggest sources of drama,

faggotry, and unwarranted self-importance in the world today, secondary only to the internet". (Encyclopedia Dramatica) Luka Bulatovic Science is religion too ,in fact it was born out of religion.Early scientists saw in science the way to get closer to God not to counter it,they were right it was them who gave you models and systems for modern scientist to brag about Ahamed Tosin @james, how long does it take for an organism to evolve cuz as far as i know, man has not changed for a looong time... James Stewart @Luka: False. Science is an organized system of exploration. Religion is an organized system of self delusion. Very different. @Ahmed: Millions upon hundreds of millions of years. Humanity has only existed in it's current state (Homo Sapiens) for roughly 200,000 years. Less than 2/10ths of a million. 23

Duķ Antraks Merol Paşa James - that the Arabic language has grammatical gender and therefore Allah takes masculine agreements is of no importance. Language refers to things, not things to language. Or are Turks and Indonesians hermaphrodite because their language doesn't have grammatical gender? Are German little girls asexual because "Mädchen" is neuter? I know there are senses. Do you know there also hallucinations? How do you know which is which? Answer: an act of faith. And finally, if spirit doesn't exist, then why would you respect human (or animal for that matter) life and wellbeing more than a totally inanimate object? See, this is just where all Atheists start advancing their own arguments of faith or appeals to Daddy Government. Luka Bulatovic Then how do you explain James that some of the most successful scientists in human history believed in God? Saajida Gora scienctists works hand in hand with the Quran... 1400 years it was impossible for science to know wht prophet Muhammed (s.a.w) knew

James Stewart @Duk: 1) I am talking about translations into other languages. If the genderization is continued in a language which does not support it, that is the choice of the author. That choice allows the identification of Allah as a masculine figure. Not my fault you idiots can't integrate into other societies properly. 2) Hallucinations are easily identified as such through shared experiences. 3 people see the same bunny hopping across the road, one can be sure that bunny exists. (Don't bother with mass hallucination theories...they've been debunked so many times it's not worth doing it again.)

And 3) Who says I do respect human life in any way shape or form? Life is not precious. It's an accident of chemical chance. However, it is possible to understand that certain 'morality' judgements, (Don't kill, don't rape, don't steal, that sort of thing) are in the best interest of society as a whole, without including some nonexistent cloud fairy. And the fail continues...*yawn* Duķ Antraks Merol Paşa Scientific fact does not disprove any religion. The Quran and science are not in contradiction - and as science advances, they find even more common ground. James Stewart @Duk: False. In every way possible. Every single piece of evidence argues against the concept of intelligence behind the creation. The most basic logic disproves the concept of a caring, sentient creator. Daily experience disproves both. Scientific evidence has dis proven every story in every religious text that it's bothered to take on... Continue to fail bro...you -REALLY- need to do more reading. Duķ Antraks Merol Paşa Hawaii - kind of self-contradictory to call something a "mental disease" when the overwhelming majority have it. That's like calling hunger a mental disease. James Stewart @Luka: Persistent brainwashing as a child is -VERY-

difficult to shake for one...and for another, you're very, very wrong. The VAST- majority of Scientists in all fields are atheists or agnostic. Luka Bulatovic Agnostic is sceptical but dont reject cuz he is not sure with all his science Muhammad Yussuf @ James, ''we have already sent our messengers with clear evidences and SENT down with them the scriptures and balance that the people may maintain Justice, And we sent down IRON ,wherein is GREAT strength and benefit for the people....'' Quran 57-25. Do you even know that Iron is an extracelestial element ? Saajida Gora @James ...hw may i ask did u become an agnostic or aethiest

Sauliha Amatullah Atheism- the belief that there was nothing, and nothing happened to nothing, and then nothing magically exploded for no reason creating everything, and then a bunch of everything magically rearranged itself for no reason what so ever into self-replicating bits which then turned into dinosaurs. Makes perfect sense! James Stewart @Muhammad: Every element on the periodic table is extracelestial. But you wouldn't understand something as complex as the formation of planets, gravitational pull or the chemical changes that certain elements go through when exposed to certain forces over extremely long periods of time. @Saadjia: -EXTENSIVE- research into religion and it's origins. Admittedly, my area of expertise is Christiantiy, since that's the religion I spend the most time advocating against...but Islam is easily as bad, as are the different pagan belief structures and Judaism. Duķ Antraks Merol Paşa James 1) ok, I can agree with that.

2) the very existence of the other 3 people to confirm the story is itself an act of faith. the only observer you can be sure of is yourself - everything else is an act of faith. Come on, this is at the core of Western philosophy!! 3) "dont kill, dont rape, dont steal" are beneficial for the society as a whole but not for the individual - a typical freerider problem. the individual is best off by breaking the rules while everyone else complies. so it still doesn't make sense to follow them unless you assign them intrinsic values. 4) evidence does not argue in favor or against intelligence. if intelligence is transcending, it's by definition outside the system being examined, just as much as you can have an ant farm or any culture you like in your home or lab but (unless to intervened constantly) you wouldn't find evidence of your existence from the viewpoint of the ants. 5) child brainwashing can't be that difficult to shake or there wouldn't be so many gays who were raised by hetero parents. 26

Saajida Gora maybe u have been reading the wrong books...did u consider tht Duķ Antraks Merol Paşa James - then you should know that the Quran doesn't make the claims the Bible makes (esp. regarding astronomy and biology) that have been criticized and refuted over and over. James Stewart @Duk: And that changes something? Just because one religion has more to contradict, doesn't mean that Islam is somehow off the hook. Counter arguments failing? Try deflection! James Stewart Anyway...I've made my point and I rest my case. Au revoir my poor deluded sheeple. See ya on the other side. ;) Muhammad Yussuf @James 'All elements are extracelestial' Sorry , I actually took you seriously , where did you get that from ?

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