Mat. Julitssa Davis

Julitssa Davis is a parishioner at St. Simon the Cyrene Mission Orthodox Mission in New Brunswick, N.J. and the wife of Rev. Samuel Davis.

Matushka, thank you for taking the time to do this interview. I believe you are the only woman we have managed to recruit for this series.

You’re welcome! I’m glad to help.

Tell me a little bit about yourself, your background and upbringing.

I’m originally from Brooklyn. My parents are from Panama and still live in the neighborhood in Brooklyn where I grew up. I am the oldest of four kids, and I was married at 23. I was the youngest of my friends to get married. Even my parents were older than I was when they got married. I remember my mother asking me, “Are you sure you want to get married so young?” Most of my friends growing up were from West Indian backgrounds and were either Latino or Afro-Latino. My husband’s father was my pastor when I was growing up. The church was a nondenominational Protestant church with a Pentecostal bent.

How did you first encounter Orthodoxy?

My husband and I were in Iceland when we first ran into Orthodoxy. We listened to a bishop named Veron Ashe 1 preach. He really got our attention, even though we later found out he wasn’t exactly

1. Ashe, who died in 2014, was the founder and selfstyled “archbishop” of the Mar Thoma Orthodox Church, a noncanonical parish in California. canonical. My husband led the way in our conversion. He read lots of Church history and introduced me to more of the faith. I was a bit standoffish at first, and it was the change I saw in him that made me take Orthodoxy seriously.

Did you have kids when you converted?

We had three kids when we first converted. They were 6, 4, and 2, at the time. They were so young, they really didn’t question anything or realize it was happening. So practically speaking, all our kids are cradle Orthodox.

Do you think about your kids growing up Orthodox? Do you worry about them being able to find Orthodox spouses?

Yes. Yes, I do worry about that, and I know that it will be difficult for them. There are so few Orthodox in this country that it can feel like they are all alone and no other kids are like them. I also just pray that God will bring the right people into their lives for them to marry. I just have to trust God in this, because worrying about it won’t change anything.

How did you your family react to your conversion?

My family was OK with my conversion. They were not devoutly religious. They went to church every Sunday, but nothing more than that. Once I explained why I wanted to make this change in my life, they understood where I was coming from.

There aren’t many Black people in the Orthodox Church in this country. Can you describe your experience of encountering the Orthodox Church?

When we first became Orthodox, we joined the Coptic Church. Most people were very welcoming. But I did feel like a fish out of water—partly because I was Black, but also because of how overwhelming the Egyptian culture is in the Coptic church. We would sometimes get strange looks that said, What are you doing here? It was very uncomfortable. But when we started attending Ss. Peter and Paul, the OCA parish in Manville, New Jersey, we felt very welcomed. Since then, I really haven’t felt out of place in Church because of the color of my skin.

Do you think your religious upbringing did anything to prepare you to become Orthodox?

No, I don’t feel that my religious upbringing did much to help with that. It was when I became Orthodox that my relationship with God became more serious. It became more intentional. When I was Protestant, I would go to church and pray, but not much more than that.

Everyone has different obstacles when they become Orthodox. Some are personal and others are due to their culture or ethnicity. What obstacles do you think are particular to Black Americans?

I feel that not seeing people who are like them in the Church is hard for many Black people. That makes you feel like an outsider, even if everyone is kind and welcoming. Also, not seeing any Black saints in icons, especially given that we venerate icons all the time, can feel like a non-verbal sign that the Church isn’t for you.

There are different Black sub-cultures and ethnicities. What do you think is different about being Afro-Latino, versus being Nigerian or being African American?

It’s true that the cultures are very different. I have friends who are Black American, and in my experience, it seems their family lives are different. I feel that growing up I didn’t have the same freedom they did. My parents were strict. It seemed like my friends’ parents were more permissive. At the same time, when people see a Black person, they don’t see those differences. They treat us all the same.

Do you talk with your kids about race?

We have had conversations with our kids about their ethnicity. For example, we have had several conversations with our eldest boy, who is 16, about how to conduct himself around police. We tell him to be calm, to speak respectfully, to avoid any sudden movements.

Have you experienced racism? Can you tell me about one of those experiences?

The area of Brooklyn where I grew up was filled with West Indians. I really didn’t experience any racism growing up. Only when we were in New Jersey did I experience it. Once, my husband and I were pulled over by two cop cars for no reason. My eldest son was in the car, and the police shone their flashlights right into his eyes. He was only an infant at the time. They asked us a lot of questions, like Where are you coming from? Where are you going? When he approached the car, his hand was already on his gun. They wouldn’t tell us why they pulled us over. The officers were aggressive and rude. I wanted to give them a piece of my mind, but my husband held me back. They eventually let us go. They seemed to be fishing for something wrong. Nothing much happened except that we were harassed by the police for no apparent reason. That was my first experience like that.

What is one thing about Black culture you wish other Americans knew?

Black people are not all the same! Don’t generalize. Don’t assume too much. Treat people like individuals. I get the idea that most white people’s impressions of Black people do not come from personal experience but from movies. That can give a skewed picture of reality.

What do you think that the Black converts could add to the life of the Church?

When I was growing up, the Black mothers in my church were so dedicated. There is a strong matriarchal dedication to the faith. The prayer life of those Black women was amazing, and their faith was unwavering. They could pray for hours in church. I think that’s what converts from the Black community would contribute to the Orthodox Church in this country—prayerfulness and dedication.

Interview by Rev. Matthew Brown