ASSOCIATION NEWS

AC Corner with Antwan Campbell

Dr. Carolyn Ball, CI and CT, NIC Affiliate Chapter Liaison

Carolyn

Hi, my name is Carolyn Ball, and I am the Affiliate Chapter (AC) Liaison here at the Registry of Interpreters for the Deaf. Typically, we have an article called The Affiliate Chapter Corner for the RID VIEWS. I’m very lucky to have the President of the North Carolina RID AC, and he was willing to sit down with me and be interviewed. The NCRID president’s name is Antwan Campbell, and I appreciate him being with us today. Do you mind introducing yourself, Antwan?

Antwan

Hello everybody, as you mentioned, my name is Antwan Campbell, and I am the President of the North Carolina AC. I’ve been working for almost ten years now on the board here in North Carolina. Before I was the president, I was the secretary for about six years, and then I became the president. This year marks my eighth year on the Board, and I’ll officially be done in June 2022.

Carolyn

You have been involved with North Carolina RID for a long time, and I applaud you. What has made you feel that it’s important to be involved in your AC as you have been for eight years?

Antwan

It just so happened that I met some wonderful interpreters at some workshops here in North Carolina RID, and then I became involved in the AC. I had learned a lot being involved in our AC, and I became addicted, and I wanted to improve the interpreters in the area. I specifically wanted to focus on BIPOC interpreters and educational interpreters because those are the areas I wanted to focus on. The reason for the focus was because I had seen my brother grow up, and we signed as a family, and he was fluent in ASL. However, I saw that his interpreters were usually female, and it didn’t match who he was. So, I thought a lot about this. I also wanted to become an interpreter so that the Black community members could see more Black interpreters. I also wanted the population of Black Deaf students to see that they could have a Black interpreter. So, those are the same reasons I have been encouraged to expand to have more BIPOC interpreters in the community.

Carolyn

I didn’t realize that your family signs. I didn’t know that you had a Deaf brother. How did your family learn ASL?

Antwan

Well, my family really is very different from most families who have Deaf siblings because we all learned to sign. My brother, I’m the oldest, and he’s my younger brother. I learned ASL about the age of 5 so that my brother and I could communicate. So, when I went to college, I learned that there weren’t other people like my family who signed, which was so strange to me. I wondered how they communicated with their families. We learned to sign when my brother was very young, so I thought that was what everyone did. I don’t remember how I learned to sign when I was five years old, but I think we started to learn because of my mother, as she had taken some ASL classes. My brother had learned ASL in preschool, so we learned signing simultaneously. That was why I went to college and got an interpreter degree.

Carolyn

Where did you go to college?

Antwan

I attended Gardner-Webb University (GWU)

Carolyn

Is that College in North Carolina?

Antwan

Yes, Gardner-Webb University is on the western side of North Carolina, where I went to get my degree.

Carolyn

You just mentioned two important things. First, you mentioned that most of the members are white female interpreters in our organization. Also, you have felt strongly that it’s very important that we have BIPOC interpreters in the organization. I was wondering: do you feel that as an organization and in your role as the North Carolina AC President, those two areas have been some of the things that you’ve been able to improve in North Carolina?

Antwan

We are working to improve those two areas, and as our AC President, I’ve been involved more in the BIPOC Community. I have worked hard to expose students in the Historically Black Colleges and Universities (HBCU) to learning ASL. Also, people would be able to learn ASL in high school here in North Carolina. So, we have ASL classes, but part of the problem is that the ASL classes are in the white community. So, I’ve gone to the BIPOC communities and contacted high schools to encourage them to learn ASL early. Then, they’ll become interested in becoming an ASL interpreter. I see - a little bit - that our population has grown in the BIPOC Community, but we need more.

Carolyn

Because you will be leaving North Carolina RID in June, have you been able to reach your goal of recruiting more BIPOC interpreters to be involved in the North Carolina chapter?

Antwan

I believe firmly, and I’m hoping that the board will have the same feeling that I have that we need to recruit more people in the AC. We also need new leaders to get on the board, and we can’t have the same people, the same old geezers that have been on the board for such a long time. We need new ideas, new enthusiasm, and young people to be involved as leaders in the chapter. As a board, we want that I feel that the board will continue our endeavors.

Carolyn

And now I’m wondering if the situation has improved for your brother. Are there more Black male interpreters of color? Is he in college, or what’s he doing right now?

Antwan

Well, my brother, right now it’s about 50-50, I would say. We’re seeing more BIPOC interpreters working, and I’m happy about that. Also, I see more Black Deaf people getting together and associating together. The population of Black interpreters is growing here in North Carolina. We have a very large Black Deaf community. Oppositely, when I was growing up, I didn’t know about the Black Community, and now we’re seeing more and more exposure to the Black Deaf community, and I think that’s very important.

Carolyn

Because you’re going to be leaving as the president of North Carolina RID, I wonder what do you think your impact has been? What do you feel like your legacy has been as the president? And what do you hope that people will remember you for as the president of North Carolina RID?

Antwan

I hope that I will leave a legacy that people will be able to see that we can have male interpreters and that I represent the BIPOC Community. That we can have more speakers at conferences and workshops who are Black, and that those speakers will be side by side with a Black interpreter. I hope that that will happen, and I will continue to work for that long after I’m off the Board.

Carolyn

After you leave as president, what will you do? Will you continue to support your affiliate chapter? What will your involvement be with the affiliate chapter?

Antwan

I will continue as the past president for one year, but I won’t be stopping to help and volunteer. I’ll still be involved with the chapter. I must be involved; there is no way that I can’t be involved. That is not my style.

Carolyn

Right now, what is your main role as an interpreter? Are you a freelance interpreter or an educational interpreter? Where are you working currently?

Antwan

My job is at the North Carolina Division of Education as the Interpreter Coordinator. I’m over all the educational interpreters and work on improving the skills of educational interpreters (for example: with their EIPA scores). So, educational interpreting is really my focus, and I love that part of my job. I do freelance sometimes.

Carolyn

How do you think we could get more educational interpreters involved in our organization and get more BIPOC interpreters? It seems like being a leader in that area in your role as president of North Carolina RID.

Antwan

Both are very important, and I think that we can partner together. But one thing that needs to happen is that the organization needs to stop having a separation between freelance interpreters and educational interpreters. We shouldn’t have that separation. Whether educational interpreters or medical interpreters, all interpreters belong to the organization. I think that we need to bring all interpreters together. Also, we need to recognize that certification for educational interpreters is different because of the kids. So, I think that we need to work together and collaborate in that effort.

Carolyn

You recently mentioned HBCU, and you had a marvelous idea of how we, as an organization and Affiliate Chapters, can provide information about the interpreting field to students before they graduate from HS. How did you come up with that idea?

Antwan

It’s kind of funny because when I was in college, I had to write a paper, and even then, I knew that I was going to become an interpreter because my brother was Deaf. I would ask other people if they were interested in becoming an interpreter. I thought if we started talking to people in high school about becoming an interpreter, we could give them more exposure to ASL. Because I didn’t know about interpreting, many people don’t know that they can become certified interpreters. So, I think that it was how I started thinking that we could help get more BIPOC interpreters. It was then that I turned my focus to the HBCU colleges and the BIPOC community. We needed to expose them to ASL and to signing so that they would become interested in the profession. I think we haven’t done that enough. And that’s how it all began and how we wanted to expand the profession so more students from BIPOC communities would know about the profession.

Carolyn

I love that idea, and maybe RID should set up an ad hoc committee and do exactly what you are talking about. Perhaps that is what you should do when you are no longer the President of NCRID.

Antwan

Yes, that might be possible and a big responsibility also.

Carolyn

Have you seen more interpreters in the education setting that are BIPOC, or do you feel you are the only BIPOC interpreter?

Antwan

I don’t know. I would say that I have seen more BIPOC interpreters, but not enough. I think it’s improved a little bit, but you’ll probably see two or three BIPOC interpreters in most of the schools. I’ve noticed that deaf students are about sixty or seventy percent of the school population. Yet, there are only two or three BIPOC interpreters. So, the students don’t see themselves. Where are their interpreters? Where’s their voice, and where is their interpreter that will match their needs. Most interpreters are white women, and there are a few men. There are at least two or three male interpreters in the school system. Many times, there aren’t any male interpreters in the education system, and I think we need to improve that as a field and as a profession. I see more BIPOC interpreters in education that are women, and I think that’s good, but it’s not enough.

Carolyn

How can we improve that in the ITP Programs? I know we don’t have all the solutions, but how can we get more educational interpreters and men [in the programs] too? What do you think we could do to improve that in our profession?

Antwan

I think that you’re right. I don’t have all the solutions, and I wish that I did. However, I think an idea that I have is about the teachers themselves in the college system. We have got to have more BIPOC Educators. Right now, those in the ITP programs that are teachers are white. All my teachers were white when I went to college, and I didn’t see any other Black people. There were very few students in my class, and I graduated as the only Black person in my ITP program. I think there were two other Black students, so there were only three Black interpreters all together in the last few years. I feel like I need to have models of interpreters that are like me. We need to recruit more BIPOC educators. If that happened, it would be like a ripple effect. We would have more Black educators, ITP students, and HS students, and then the pool would just keep expanding.

Carolyn

You mentioned that 60-70% of the children are Black, where you interpret. Are the teachers themselves white? As an interpreter, do you feel alone or isolated in the school system?

Antwan

Most of the teachers are hearing teachers, and they are white. There are some Black teachers, and that’s good, so I recognize that there are more Black teachers like me. More in the high school and elementary schools, and I think that’s great. We need to have more Black teachers in the educational system and the interpreter settings. I believe firmly that Black Deaf students need to see Black role models that they can model and learn from. Having role models is very important.

Carolyn

When you are interpreting in the schools, how do you feel when the Black children see you and are amazed and astonished that they have an interpreter just like them?

Antwan

I always remember the first time that this happened. I went into the classroom, and the student was puzzled and said, “you are Black just like me. “yeah, I am Black,” and the student said that was the first time they had had a Black interpreter in their classroom. I felt so good and inspired - and a little bit sad - that that student was in the fifth grade, and that was the first time they’d ever seen a Black interpreter. My heart also hurts, so I feel good about it, and yet, it is so sad that this student and other Black students have never had that exposure to a Black interpreter. When will the students meet an interpreter who is like them? When will they meet a BIPOC interpreter? Or even when will they meet a group of BIPOC people. Sometimes I feel like even the adults have never seen or had a Black interpreter. When I go to an appointment, the deaf people say, oh my gosh, you are a man, and you are Black, and they’re adults, and they’ve never seen a Black interpreter. I think there are maybe two or three Black interpreters, which is just not enough, and it hurts me.

Carolyn

Do you think we don’t have more Black male interpreters because we have done something wrong in our field that we need to improve on as white interpreters? What do you think the reason is, ITP teachers? Do you think there is another reason?

Antwan

First, I think that you said what we are doing wrong. I think that’s not the word that we need to use; we need to change that perspective and look at it differently. Historically, interpreting has been a woman’s job. Because there’s never been exposure to male people or BIPOC people, we’ve got to have more exposure, and I think more men will become interested in the field. It’s the same with teachers. A long time ago, all the teachers were women, and men were not teachers. But now you see more and more men that are teachers. I feel the same way with interpreters. If there is exposure to men that interpreting is a profession, then they will want to become involved in this profession. Most of the men are not exposed to sign language or the field of interpreting. They go to work, and they have no idea that interpreting could be their job. So, the key to recruitment is exposure to the profession. Then, I think that things will improve. How we go about that exposure is the question.

Carolyn

Thank you for helping me with the term that I used when I said what we are doing, “wrong,” that you helped me to see that it’s nothing that we have done wrong. So, thank you for helping me to see that. Not wrong, but we need to look at things differently or change the perspective of how we look at things.

I think sometimes we don’t have enough communication and talking together to learn from each other and learn how to communicate together more effectively. We need to be able to communicate and talk about and share openly. As you said, we need to communicate, and we haven’t communicated enough about this topic. So, we need to learn how to work together and discuss these issues together.

Antwan

I agree with you. I agree with you, and if we learn to talk about these things together, we won’t say we’ve got to learn to resolve things more easily and not worry about criticizing each other that if we don’t talk about these issues a lot, we can’t improve. So, we need to learn to talk about this together.

Carolyn

What do you think about the vision of RID now, we have our first BIPOC President? Is that exciting for the organization, or what do you think about that?

Antwan

I think it’s very exciting. We have the most BIPOC and diverse Board than we have ever had. I hope that moving forward it will be the same. I hope that we will continue that and have more exposure. Also, I think that the BIPOC population will see that these things are happening in RID, and that’s good and that

there’s potential. But we need more communication and more dialogue and to have more diversity. We need to continue this, and I hope that there will be more BIPOC people that won’t say,” Oh, I can’t do this next year.” Knowing that we have a diverse Board shows that we can do anything. It is for these reasons that we can do it. I think that that will help, and it will help things to be better, and I’m very excited about the transition to see what’s happening about the future of RID.

Carolyn

You have been a perfect example of North Carolina RID as the AC President. I know the chapter, and the membership has learned a lot from you. I wish we could emulate you as the North Carolina RID president and have the other ACs follow in your footsteps. Maybe we could clone you to help other AC presidents be as wonderful as you are. I admire you and that you have served in your AC for so long. I really appreciate it, and I’ve always enjoyed working with you. You have such a positive attitude. And I just want to thank you for your service, who you are, and your commitment to RID and this organization.

How could we help other affiliate chapters to have your type of commitment?

Antwan

I think that’s a hard one to think about, and I think that’s a heavy question because working in there is a lot of different struggles. Trying to get more people interested in serving on the board and membership is a struggle. I think the reason for that is that some people think they can’t be an affiliate chapter leader or feel that they are new and don’t have enough experience to be a leader. But we’ve got to encourage all people and let them know that they can be involved.

I’m not special; I just wanted to be involved, so I’ve tried to communicate with people and let them know that you can be a leader and if they have their ideas, tell me what those ideas are. I’m not going to criticize them. We need to be supportive of each other and encourage each other. I think that will help other members of the affiliate chapters. I know that affiliate chapters are struggling to fill board positions, it’s hard, and it takes a lot of time and effort and a lot of work to be involved. I feel that if we could divide all that work up and have more people to share the responsibility, it would be great. Being on the Board is fun! I enjoy it so much, it’s busy work, but we have fun and laugh a lot. I’ve made lifelong friends being on the Board. Because we expend so much energy, but it’s amazing what we can do together

Carolyn

I think those are amazing reasons for each Affiliate chapter to be on the board. I wish that each AC could feel just the way that you have expressed.

I want to thank you, Antwan, so much for talking with me. Is there anything you want to say or the last tidbit of information or advice you want to add for the affiliate chapter leaders or any RID member across our organization before we close?

Antwan

Well, I think one comment that I’d like to make is to remember that all interpreters need support and that we must work together for what is best for the deaf community, for the members, and what is best for everyone. We can work together and improve all of what’s happening at the organizational level and support each other.

Carolyn

Thank you so much, Antwan! Thank you for all your time, and I really look forward to seeing what your next great adventure will be, so we’ll have to see what your next great adventure will be.