DEVELOPMENT

SEELEY HONDA FOUR-STROKE FASCINATION

Classic Trial Magazine has opened the door to so many interesting articles. This one is no different from how it came about, but, as always, it includes that vital ingredient: motorcycle enthusiasts. When Mike Rapley called to inform me, he had found some old negatives at home, which included the original press photographs for the Seeley Honda. So I thought about getting this piece of the Honda trials story into the magazine, but how could I make this four-stroke fascination come to life, considering certain information would be missing? Then, a few months later, a phone call from an old friend Trevor Kemp was a breath of fresh air, allowing me to bring this feature to life. Further information on the Anglo-Japanese machine was researched, and before long, we had a fascinating story coming to fruition. With the words and support from Trevor, I could start to date relative pictures. As well as my regular photographic contributors, I started to scan the many Alan Vines pictures I had. Lo and behold, some superb, unseen pictures were found from the early days. Then, good old Eric ‘‘EK’’ Kitchen came up with some colour shots from 1980 to support the ones from the other contributors.

Wanted – If Honda had produced this four-stroke HRC trials model, ridden by Rob Shepherd in 1979, it would have sold out immediately.

1980: Trevor Kemp was heavily involved with the Seeley Honda trials project. 1980: Kiyo Hattori’s arrival from Japan put the Seeley Honda in the spotlight; he was very entertaining, to say the least…

As we are all aware, photographs tell a thousand words, and it was the ones supplied by Steve Bird, taken by his late father, reminded me of when I rode in the 1980 SSDT in the company of Eddy Lejeune on the 250 Seeley Honda. I was on the John E Shirt supplied 320 Majesty Yamaha. We had a brilliant time. Recalling one of my funniest moments is when Eddy asked me the lines in some of the sections — Eddy, asking me, John Hulme, which line to take? We had a super week, and Eddy just beat me. During the week, his staple diet was Belgian waffles topped with a wide range of Belgian chocolates, and he was more than happy to share them! Most of the words in this feature came from Trevor Kemp, but I’ve also added some of my memorable notes surrounding the Seeley Honda. Here, Trevor takes up the story.

HONDA UK

My involvement in Honda trials machines began a few months after joining Honda UK as an area field manager. Later in my working life with the company, I was also involved in the off-road planning committee as a representative for Honda UK with the manufacturer in Japan. Unfortunately, after leaving the John Banks Honda Centre to start work at Honda UK, I lost my sponsored Bultaco ride that came through the dealership. Jim Sandiford, the official Montesa UK importer, had wanted me to ride a Montesa through the John Banks Honda Centre, but it never worked out due to the dealership’s commitment to Comerfords.

With my new work position in place, he kindly loaned me a new Montesa Cota 348 that had just been launched when I moved to Honda UK. As well as the Montesa importers, at that time, Jim was also a multi-franchise dealer for many brands, including Honda. After winning several trials in the Eastern and South Midland Centres, Sandiford’s placed a ‘‘Montesa success’’ advert in which I was featured. This advert came to the notice of our Sales and Marketing Director’s desk; he got

At the start of the project an engine supplied by RSC Honda was installed in a Sammy Miller HiBoy frame. This is Trevor Kemp in action on it.

Various exhaust systems were experimented with, as you can see here, as Allen Collier makes a pivot turn in the 1978 Vic Brittain Trial. 1977: When Eastern Centre Champion Allen Collier lost his Jack Hubbardsponsored Bultaco ride he took over the other development Honda.

me in the office and wanted to know why I was not riding a Honda! When I explained that Honda did not manufacture a competitive trials motorcycle, he suggested I spoke with the Racing Department to see if they could sort me a trials machine. With Rob Shepherd having the only trials support on a factory-supplied machine, this would never happen.

I continued to ride the Montesa, trying to keep under my boss’s radar by achieving some good results. Then, Ryuichiro Yoshimi (Yoshi), our technical coordinator between Honda UK and Japan, approached me and said he wanted to start a project to build a production Honda trials motorcycle and wanted me to be involved.

A JOINT VENTURE

His idea was to build the motorcycle here in the UK with engines supplied from Japan that would be built and modified by Honda RSC (Racing Service Centre). The frames would be developed and manufactured here as chassis technology and cost, particularly for a trials motorcycle, meant this would be the better route, and any unforeseen problems could be dealt with quicker than relying totally on feedback from Japan.

The design concept was that the motorcycle was to look, in essence, like the Honda RTL 360. Although the engine would look different, the fuel tank, seat unit and frame could be manufactured to mirror the bigger-engined RTL, almost like its smaller brother. The engine would be based on the well-proven fourstroke, similar to the one fitted to the Honda XL185 trail model. The engine capacity would increase to 197.74cc by a larger bore and a slightly different camshaft. The transmission and gear ratios were also changed from the original XL185 trail ratios with profiles for trials use. A heavier flywheel and new ignition were also fitted.

Honda RSC had some previous experience with modifying singlecylinder four-stroke engines for trials from the mid-70s when they produced a heavily modified 200cc version of the TL125 engine that was supplied internationally to Honda importers.

When I worked at John Banks Honda Centre, Honda Japan sent us two of these modified engines; one of which was installed in a modified Sammy Miller TL 125 Hi-Boy frame. I rode it in a few events. When Eastern Centre Champion, Allen Collier, lost his Jack Hubbardsponsored Bultaco ride, we let him ride the other one we had built. We both had some success on these machines but the lack of power and the fragile bottom half of the engine from the Honda TL125, particularly in the more significant trials events, caused reliability problems. RSC used the bigger 185cc engine for the new project, which gave us more confidence and reliability.

Looking full factory: Trevor Kemp in the 1977 Victory Trial.

1978 Kickham Trial: Allen Collier misses the power of the two-strokes as he struggles for grip on the small-capacity four-stroke Honda.

COLIN SEELEY

With the project getting the go-ahead in 1978, we then had to decide who would manufacture the chassis. As it was designed by Honda employee Mike Gilder, we looked at using some of the established trials chassis manufacturers in the UK. They had the experience of incorporating designs married to trials chassis dimensions, steering head angles, wheelbase and seat height etc. However, the powersto-be at Honda UK wanted us to talk to Colin Seeley. He had, at that time, a relationship with Honda producing racing replicas out of production Honda sport models. Colin also had excellent experience in chassis manufacturing, albeit in road racing, and came with a good reliable reputation.

After several constructive meetings with Colin about the trials project, Honda UK decided that this was the route for them to follow; 1979 would be a busy year!

Using a square downtube and top frame in Reynolds 531 steel section tubing gave the look of the RTL 360; the engine was used as a stressed member along with an aluminium sump shield. This allowed the use of a smalldiameter steel tube for the rear subframe to keep the weight down — also, a box section for the footrest hangers was used instead of a thick heavy plate.

With a beautiful-looking Honda with a red aluminium fuel tank and neatly fitted seat cover, the chassis not only looked the business, but it looked right too.

As there were no competitive production off-road front forks available from Honda, it was decided to use the Italian Marzocchi fork and yokes, which were freely available —

This engine was based on the wellproven four-stroke one that was fitted to Honda XL185 trail model. A Seeley ‘Star’ is born – August 1979.

A plastic engine protector would be fitted but was soon removed by many owners to keep the engine running cooler!

good quality components that worked well. Several Italianmanufactured wheels and hubs were looked at, but it was decided to stay with complete Honda wheels; we are all well aware that these were of very high quality compared to the European equivalents. Engine capacity would be increased to 197.74cc by a This wheel arrangement was larger bore, and a slightly further endorsed when Honda UK different camshaft would also be fitted for trials use. decided to break up a number of CR125 motocross machines that they had over-ordered and were out of date with new models coming from Japan; they also used the footrests from these models. Several other Honda components were used, including air filter components and control levers. The chain running block on the top of the swinging arm was actually a modified Honda cam chain tensioner rubber. The Girling Gas shocks at the rear were also used, and Norman Blackmore, who I knew well, got to work on developing a new unit. These shock absorbers were now being used on the RTL 360, so it made good sense to follow that route. Along with the engine, we also received a Honda RSC exhaust system. When the machine went into production, and due to cost and ease of shipping, we just brought in the outer stamping from RSC, and Seeley manufactured the centre box and welded it on the backing plate to the RSC outer stamping.

Transmission and gear ratios were also changed from the original XL185 trail ones and a heavier flywheel and new ignition were also fitted.

PROTOTYPE

I had made several trips down to Colin’s factory in Kent while the prototype was being put together. I had to curb my excitement as I could not wait to try the new Seeley Honda TL 200E, as it would be named. The complete production prototype would be ready in August 1979. At the back of Colin’s factory, there was a piece of wasteland with a few banks to try the machine on. Straight away, the balance felt right, and with slight adjustments to the front forks and rear shocks, I was impressed with how well it steered and handled. We had to work on carburetion and gearing to get it correct for the slow-speed world of motorcycle trials, but we knew we were heading in the right direction. Although it did take me a bit of time to get used to a four-stroke engine braking, one problem we did find was that the motor would not rev out freely. We found out that the seat and tank unit pushed the air intake rubber flange inwards, thus restricting the airflow to the carburettor. We went back into the workshop, and a modification on the air-filter box cured the problem immediately.

I have to say it did look pretty, just like the vision we had of the finished machine when we started. It was now a case of riding the new Honda and finding if all our hard work was worth it; I was very happy, to say the least!

Riding the Seeley Honda in the first few trials, it created a lot of interest. Spectators followed me from section to section, with everyone looking to see how it performed. At that time, the affectionate four-stroke sound from a trials motorcycle exhaust was virtually non-existent apart from the bright red Honda of Rob Shepherd as everyone was on two-strokes. We also carried out a test up at Rob Shepherd’s farm in Yorkshire, meeting a young Eddie Lejeune after travelling from Belgium to try the new Honda. He was impressive on the little 200 and even more so when he tried Rob’s 360. I even got to ride the 360 and could not believe how good it was. I thought at the time that it was sad that Honda could not make this into a production trials machine, they could have sold so many, and the name Honda would have been ruling the trials world, but it was not to be.

I had some good results on the little 200 and won a few Eastern and South Midland centre trials. I also did a fair number of National trials, including the West of England and the John Douglas. It was a very good bike for the centre and clubman rider as, being a four-stroke, it gripped well in the mud and on slippery sections. However, being only a 200cc, it struggled on some sections where you needed power.

SEELEY HONDA TL 200E

The production of the Seeley Honda began on the initial order of 100 machines. At the start, the sales were healthy and encouraging, and the first 40 models sold almost immediately in late 1979 after so much interest at the end-of-season motorcycle show. In early 1980, a second batch of 40 machines again sold well despite the high recommended retail price of £1,280, including VAT and a hefty £40 delivery charge; all orders were processed though Honda UK and their dealer network.

Another order was made for a further 150 machines in April, but the sales were slow, and Seeley was also under financial pressure, having just built a new factory. By September, the production target of 300 machines was made, but interest from Honda UK in the project was dwindling away. So, on 1st October 1980, it was announced that the Seeley organisation would take over the complete production. With 120 unsold machines in stock at his factory, Colin took over distribution from Honda UK and supplied the machines direct to try and keep the production costs down. The machine was renamed the Seeley TL 200, but sadly sales failed to pick up.

To keep the price more competitive, Colin would produce the complete exhaust system in-house instead of bringing the expensive items in from the RSC department in Japan. He could also remove the £40 delivery charge and trimmed to reduce the price to attract potential buyers, but it just did not happen. Sales were desperately slow with only a handful of the machines sold, and the door was closed on the production in 1981 though Colin would supply spare parts, of which he had a good stock, for the foreseeable future.

For a first attempt, the production prototype looked very functional. Along with engine from Japan they also received a Honda RSC exhaust system.

A design concept was that the motorcycle was to look in essence like the Honda RTL 360.

SEELEY TRIALS TIME

A young Honda Japanese rider was coming over to the UK to ride and test the Seeley Honda; his name was Kiyo Hattori. I arranged to get him a machine, and he came and stayed at my house. We went out testing a lot around where I lived, and he was very impressed with the machine. I arranged for us to compete in a South Midland Centre trial, the Bill Holt at Market Harborough, to see how the Honda compared to the other manufacturers’ machines, which would also be a good benchmark. One of the RSC Japanese staff also came to watch the trial; he was on a visit to Honda UK for meetings with the various race departments. All I remember was he spoke no English; communicating was difficult!

Kiyo won the trial, and I was second. They were both very happy. After that, we both competed in one more local event. By this time, Kiyo had started to ride in selected ACU British Championship rounds with a superb sixth in the April Victory Trial and National trials. The good news got even better when Honda agreed in Japan that they would fund him to ride the Seeley model in the FIM World Trials Championship. He would be part of a three-man Honda team including Rob Shepherd and Belgium’s Eddy Lejeune, who would ride one of the 360cc models inherited from Shepherd.

Two RSC 250 four-stroke engines were then sent to Honda UK from Japan and then on to Colin Seeley’s to be installed into the 200 model frames. The 250 featured an OHC two-valve engine with external oil pipes and was a stroked-and-bored version of the 200. It was interesting to note that very little needed modifying on the frames to accommodate the larger-capacity engines, although many other chassis components required modifying. These two machines were for Kiyo Hattori and Eddy Lejeune to ride in the Scottish Six Days Trial.

In February, Kiyo’s first world round was in Spain on the new 250 Seeley Honda to give it a shakedown, but he ran over the time limit. In Belgium, just one week later, he finished 20th, followed by an even better 18th place in Great Britain.

Kiyo’s first world round was in Spain, 1980, on the new 250 Seeley Honda to give it a shakedown before the SSDT but he ran over the time limit. No wonder Kiyo Hattori looks happy; he is on his way to his and the Seeley Honda’s first ACU British Championship points at the Victory Trial in April 1980. He was the first Japanese rider to score BTC points. Kiyo Hattori arrived from Japan in early 1980 to compete in a South Midland Centre trial, the Bill Holt at Market Harborough, which he won on the new 200cc Seeley Honda.

1980: Trevor Kemp, seen here in the East Anglian national trial, continued to fine-tune the Seeley Honda.

Two machines were built for Kiyo Hattori and Eddy Lejeune to ride in the Scottish Six Days Trial. Eddy only received his 250 Seeley Honda at the start of the event on the Sunday in the paddock at the West End Car park!

1980 SSDT: Total control from Eddy Lejeune in the rocky stream at Achlain on day two, Tuesday. 1980 SSDT: All eyes are on the new kid on the block, Eddy Lejeune.

SEELEY HONDA SUCCESS

Eddy only received his 250 Seeley Honda for the first time at the start of the event on the Sunday, in the paddock at the West End car park. He literally rode it up the road to check it was okay before taking it to the start ramp for day one on the Monday, but he was impressed.

At the Scottish, both these machines ran like clockwork all week, and Eddy Lejeune finished 12th, with it the Best Newcomer award, with Kiyo Hattori a very creditable 16th.

Straight after the SSDT, it was back to world championship action, starting in Italy when Kiyo was back on the 200 Seeley as Eddy moved back to his 360 Honda. Kiyo had been a quick learner on the world and UK trials scene as he became the first Japanese trials rider to score points in both the championships. He finished 15th in the UK and 26th in the world overall but saved his best ride of the year, in our opinion, for the super-tough national Scott Time and Observation Trial in October. A hard day for any rider, he pushed himself and the little 200 Seely Honda machine to the limit, and his reward was the much sought-after Herbert Scott Cup for the best performance by a newcomer! It was a super effort for a rider who had only arrived from Japan in February and one who could speak or understand very little English. He took the last Scott Silver Spoon, coming home in 26th position on 310 marks lost, 97 on time and 213 on observation.

1980 SSDT: At the Scottish both machines ran like clockwork all week.

As the year closed, it was announced that Kiyo Hattori would now ride the two ex-works 360 Honda machines the following year, which Rob Shepherd had ridden to ninth overall in the 1980 FIM World Trials Championship. After so many successful years at Honda, the Yorkshire rider had announced his retirement from international trials.

Trevor Kemp: “A few years ago, I saw Colin at a Honda 750 anniversary event at David Silver’s Honda Museum, where he was a judge. We had a coffee and a chat regarding earlier times together developing the Seeley Honda trials model. Colin admitted that it had been a big loss financially, but we both agreed that we were very proud of the project and what it achieved.”

Aged 84, Colin Seeley sadly passed away on 7th January 2020, but his legacy will live on in the trials world with the Seeley Honda that has now become a classic Honda — one to collect, and a rare one at that.

1980 Kiyo Hattori was back on action on the 200cc Seeley Honda competing in many UK National Trials, seen here in the Dave Rowland.

1980 HONDA SEELEY TL 200E

SPECIFICATIONS

ENGINE: Single Cylinder Air Cooled Four-Stroke; Type: Chain Driven OHC Two Valve; Bore and Stroke: 66mm x 57.8mm; Capacity: 197.74; Transmission: Six Forward Gears; Clutch: Multi-Plate in Oil; Ignition: Capacitor Discharge, Carburettor: Keihin PC 20.

CHASSIS: Reynolds 531 Square and Tubular Steel; Swinging-Arm: Reynolds 531 Tubular Steel; Protection: Aluminium; Front Suspension: Marzocchi – 170mm Travel; Rear

Suspension: Girling Gas Twin Spring – 140mm Travel.

DIMENSIONS: Seat Height: 775mm; Wheelbase: 1,286mm; Ground Clearance: 319mm; Fuel Tank Capacity: 4.0 Litres; Dry Weight: 82.6Kg.

1980 Austria: Back on the more powerful 250 Seeley Honda he finished 26th overall scoring two hard-fought points in the final round.

In the 1980 national Scott Time and Observation Trial in the October Kiyo Hattori pushed himself and the little 200 Seely Honda machine to the limit, and his reward was the much sought-after Herbert Scott Cup for the best performance by a newcomer!

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