14 minute read
Dating Dialogue
What Would You Do If…
Moderated by Jennifer Mann, LCSW of The Navidaters
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Dear Navidaters, Iam engaged to a guy who I really like, after dating in the shidduch world for five years. (For the sake of this letter I will call him Noam.) We got engaged after dating for two months – and I did not have a chance to meet his parents. When we made calls we heard very nice things about them “baalei chessed, pillars of the community,” etc... Looking back, it seems like he was purposely avoiding interactions where I would end up meeting his parents. I am from an out-of-town city. At one point, his parents were stopping over in my city for the day. I proposed the idea that he come to town and we all go out together but he insisted gently that they did not have much time and were only here on business (am I paranoid to think that they were scouting out my family & home??).
After getting engaged and meeting them, I really see a bigger picture. His parents are completely emotionally stale, fancy, stuck-up people. I would not be surprised if they had some sort of psychological condition based on their behavior at our l’chaim. We were having the l’chaim, which was the first place I met them, and they were extremely standoffish. His mother had a sour expression on her face the entire time, and the father would not do anything to make himself look comfortable. They seemed to be looking down at everybody, would not touch the food my parents offered them, and gave very stale “mazel tovs” to our friends and family.
This is their oldest and very independent son, and I am the youngest in my family with lots of nieces and nephews. The noise level seemed to bother them as well.
I really don’t feel comfortable around his family – and think they are straight up rude. Should I say something to Noam? I am truly happy with him as a partner but I’m nervous I will regret it now that I met his family.
Thoughts? *Shevy
Disclaimer: This column is not intended to diagnose or otherwise conclude resolutions to any questions. Our intention is not to offer any definitive conclusions to any particular question, rather offer areas of exploration for the author and reader. Due to the nature of the column receiving only a short snapshot of an issue, without the benefit of an actual discussion, the panel’s role is to offer a range of possibilities. We hope to open up meaningful dialogue and individual exploration.
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The Panel
The Rebbetzin
Rebbetzin Faigie Horowitz, M.S.
Shevy, you owe it to yourself and to your relationship with Noam to bring up the matter of his parents. You must realize that communication is vital to a relationship, and you have held back from engaging in communication about his parents. The hesitation to put this matter on the table tells me that you noticed warning signals that something is off and that Noam avoided introducing you to his parents before the l’chaim. In most circles, meeting parents before an engagement is announced is de rigueur. It’s not just a social nicety; it is a sign of respect for the role of parents in Jewish family life.
Your radar is functioning well. But I wonder why you did not talk about family heretofore. You may have been anxious to get engaged and not risk the expected commitment. You need to learn to address orange and red flags with communication. You probably could benefit from some professional support with self-understanding and communication skills.
Nonetheless, the time is now to put this on the table. Do it gently and carefully even though this is a very important discussion to have. This is much more important than arrangements. Do it face-to-face. You may open with your observations that Noam’s family did not seem so at ease at the simcha.
You need to talk about his family, his relationship to them, their relationship to you and your family, and more. Heading towards marriage without it is very unwise. I suspect that a lot of issues will surface in this conversation. Get help. Stat.
If you navigate this big challenge with improved communication, sharing, and maturity, and with help, you will have greater insight as to how the two of you can support each other going forward in meeting the challenges that life will inevitably bring. You will have proof that the two of you have what it takes to succeed as a couple.
The Shadchan
Michelle Mond
You are a very astute young lady, put into a very difficult position. Before getting to the details which put you off, I would like to make an observation. Reading your email made me wonder if you trust and respect Noam. Do you see qualities in him that will make a quality husband? You say at the end of your letter, “I am truly happy with him as a partner.” I challenge you to think about what this is based on. Are you happy that after five years you have finally met someone who wants to settle down with you? Or are you happy to be marrying someone with stellar qualities which makes you want to be his partner? There is a big difference between the two.
The reason I ask this is because you seem to be hurt, above all, by the fact that Noam hid his family from you until after engagement. You even go as far as wondering if the family was in town spying on your family. This hints to a lack of trust, which is not a good thing to go into a marriage with.
Before all, assess whether you respect and trust Noam. I also wonder, where are your parents in all this? You made no mention of them and I wonder why they allowed an engagement to happen before a Meet-theParents session, which is standard.
If you trust this man wholeheartedly, your next step is to approach the topic with him in a mature and respectful manner. Firstly, look out for the red flags: Is he letting you speak? Is he getting defensive? Is he brushing you off or making you feel “crazy’’ for thinking he would do such a terrible thing as hide his parents from you? If he does any of the above, it is grounds to be worried, and you should speak with your parents, a therapist or mentor about the entire situation for more accurate guidance.
If he is understanding, compassionate, patient, and genuine, that’s a good sign! Perhaps his parents are just nebach and socially off, but he himself is extremely with-it and on the ball. It could be he was genuinely scared that you would judge him based on his parents. You must, however, get to the bottom of why he was not straightforward with you before the engagement and recognize that this was wrong.
In reality, if you and Noam have a great relationship and are on the same page about his parents, things could work out. You might not love going there for Shabbos, but your relationship with Noam is what will be what’s most important.
The Single
Rivka Weinberg
Shevy, I am sorry you are going through this. It must be extremely difficult to enjoy someone and his company, but then have that image tainted by that individual’s family. It is important for you to remember that you are marrying Noam, not Noam’s family. Yes, in-laws make a tremendous impact on a relationship, but keep in mind that Noam is not his family. It is clear that they are so entirely different because if they were similar, then you would not be shocked by his parents’ behavior.
In shidduchim, we look into a single’s family background and ask questions, as we should. However, unfortunately more times than not, we fault the single because of the way he or she grew up. Is it fair to hold it against the single if his or her father went to jail for a white-collar crime? What about the single who comes from a family of a certain hashkafa but that individual has moved more to the right? Or, my favorite: an individual who comes from a home where they are “standoffish” and “rude,” and this person has worked hard on him or herself to avoid acting in such ways. We cannot always hold every person accountable for his or her family.
In a very calm and non-judgmental manner, on a very high level, tell Noam how you feel. Granted, I do not think you should use the wording written in your question describing them as “emotionally stale, fancy, stuck-up people.” Assuming that Noam has social skills, he is probably aware of his parents’ behavior, which is why he avoided having you meet them. Yes, if this is the case, he should have expressed how he felt and not just dodged the topic. However, if it is something that is difficult and embarrassing for him, have compassion and be there for him.
If you are going to marry Noam, then you must have open communication and be honest with one another. At the end of the day, you and Noam will decide how much of a role (or not) both of your families will play in your married life, so do not focus as much on his family as you should on him.
I wish you much hatzlacha!
The Zaidy
Dr. Jeffrey Galler
Iam shocked that anyone would consider getting engaged without first meeting with, and spending considerable time with, potential in-laws.
In any event, it is not too late. Before you consider making any wedding plans, please insist on spending a few Shabbosim with your chassan and his family. Accept no excuses whatsoever. None. Whatsoever.
When you meet them, please observe carefully. Were their actions at your engagement party merely the result of jet lag? Are their family interactions happy, loving, and healthy? Or, is there some unhealthy family pathology present that will negatively affect your own marriage and family life?
Remember that even if you plan to live far away from your in-laws, they will be a major part of your life, and the lives of your children, for many years to come.
And, please re-
Pulling It All Together
The Navidaters Dating and Relationship Coaches and Therapists
Dear Shevy, Thank you for writing into our panel! The beauty of open and honest conversation is that you will likely receive the answer you are seeking. If I were to look back on all the Navidaters columns, my bet is that the vast majority of them center around questions like yours: “should I say something?” This is under? standable as vulnerability is never easy. We also don’t like the idea of potentially losing someone or making the wrong decision or having to start over. There is a lot to lose when we are honest, I guess.
I believe you owe it to yourself to say something to Noam. Your intuition tells you that something is rotten in the state of Denmark. And I want to come alongside you and validate your intuition. Something indeed seems to be off.
People come from all sorts of complicated or embarrassing family situations. What concerns me is not so much that Noam’s family may be strange or off or rude, but that Noam may have kept this from you. It is the secrecy and manipulation surrounding hiding his family from you that bothers me. Now, in all fairness to Noam and for the sake of exploring his potential behavior, the shidduch system truly gives people with difficult family situations a hard time. He may have been rejected many times over due to his family and learned from this that he must hide his family. I’m not excusing his behavior (and quite frankly, I have no idea if any of this is remotely on target) but only trying to understand it. Do not throw out the baby with the bathwater just yet. If you haven’t done so already, please speak with Noam right away. Simply tell him how you feel. Ask him questions. And always, always, always, (and one more “always” for the cheap seats in the back!) trust your gut! While we don’t want to make him feel as though he is under interrogation, you have every right to ask him whatever questions you’d like, so come prepared. The only path forward through this heaviness, in my opinion, is if Noam is agreeable to this conversation and makes you feel comfortable during the conversation. At this point, though he may feel uncomfortable, as a mature adult about to get married, we need to see his maturity level now. He should be comforting you through this conversation and making you feel good about asking him whatever you need to ask him. If he shuts you down in any way or makes you feel as though your questions are silly or unnecessary, if he “poo-poos” you or any of your concerns as to why you never met them before, that is not a good sign.
As much as you can, approach this conversation from a standpoint of curiosity rather than rebuke. It’s time to be very real with Noam, and in return, you will hopefully get some real clarity. My gut tells me that something hasn’t been shared with you. It’s time to find out what that is. And Shevy, you deserve to be in a healthy relationship where communication and honesty flow freely. Let’s see if that can happen with Noam.
member: Painful and heartbreaking as it may be, it is far better to “disengage” now, rather than get out of a bad marriage later.
And now, for some lighter thoughts. For all single women who are planning to spend a Shabbos with their potential in-laws, consider it a red flag if your potential mother-inlaw:
Talks about you with her family, in your presence, in a language that you do not understand (Hungarian? Russian?).
Expects you to regularly prepare and serve her son food that you cannot spell (Crêpes suzettes? Hors d’oeuvres? Foie
gras?).
Critiques what all the other women wear in shul.
Or, if any family member flosses at the dinner table.
Good luck.
All the best! Jennifer
Jennifer Mann, LCSW is a licensed psychotherapist and dating and relationship coach working with individuals, couples, and families in private practice at 123 Maple Avenue in Cedarhurst, NY. She also teaches a psychology course at Touro College. To set up a consultation or to ask questions, please call 718-908-0512. Visit www.thenavidaters.com for more information. If you would like to submit a dating or relationship question to the panel anonymously, please email JenniferMannLCSW@gmail.com. You can follow The Navidaters on FB and Instagram for dating and relationship advice.
