C h a r a k t e r i s t i k »Aller« ist eine moderne, humanistische Serifenlose in der Tradition der späten Neunziger Jahre – TheSans und Co.
A
lassen grüßen! Man mag diese Art von Schriften schon sehr oft gesehen haben und eventuell auch ein bisschen fad finden, dennoch besitzt Aller ein paar Besonderheiten, die der Schrift Würze
Aller
verleihen und das Schriftbild auflockern, ohne der Lesbarkeit zu schaden.Da wären natürlich zunächst mal die nicht miteinander verbundenen Einzelteile von K und X zu nennen, die die Offenheit der
ABCDEFGHIJKLM NOPQRSTUVWXYZ abcdefghijklm nopqretuvwxyz 1234567890 (“%&’),.:;!?’
Schrift unterstützen. Besonders trendy auch der Verzicht auf den Endstrich bei a, d, b, q und p. Damit feiert ja die FF Dax große Erfolge, so schlecht kann die Idee nicht sein! Über den Kopfbereich des kleinen t bin ich nicht allzu glücklich, den ich stehe persönlich nicht so auf diesen Gill-Sans-Style, doch Schwamm drüber: Im Gesamtbild kommt Aller äußerst stabil, neutral und sauber an und muss den Vergleich mit kommerziellen Schriften
definitiv
nicht
scheuen.
Contents
Dolce & Gabbana By Tim Blanks . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5
Todd Haynes By Kate Winslet . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 15
Tom Ford By John Currin . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 25
■ Dolce & Gabbana By Tim Blanks ■
Dolce & Gabbana
is on torrents of words rather than water. English, Italian, and the verbal shorthand born of a very close
By Tim Blanks
quarter-century relationship tumble together in an idiosyncratic jumble. Pity the poor transcriber. Still, one does one’s best. The three of us are talking in a
Dolce & Gabbana The most famous duo in fashion
leopard spot–draped salon in the designers’ Milan
may not always dance to the same beat—or even in
headquarters. Lunch awaits in the zebra-patterned
the same room. But they do know perfectly well
room next door. There are big, important-looking
how to play off each other to stunning effect. And
pictures all over the walls, plus two prints of a
as they celebrated Domenico’s 50th birthday in
Steven Klein portrait of Madonna, signed to each of
Milan last September with a star-studded fete, it
them by their favorite collaboratrix. “Of course, one
became spectacularly clear that the party at the
each,” Gabbana says archly. “Dolce & Gabbana is not
Dolce & Gabbana disco is just getting warmed up.
one.” There are times when you could be forgiven for
A conversation with Domenico Dolce and Stefano
thinking such: They have that finish-each-other’s-
Gabbana reminds me of rafting—except my wild ride
sentences habit of longtime co-habitués, even if
Dolce now lives downstairs from Gabbana and his late-night disco-dollying. (Diana Ross belted “I Will Survive” at discophile Domenico’s 50th birthday bash last September in Milan, so he tolerates the bass line seeping through the floorboards.) But the two are funniest when they tartly beg to differ. Dolce loves Pierce Brosnan singing ABBA in Mamma Mia! (2008); Gabbana feels the chubby former 007 will be lucky to work again after croaking his way through “SOS.” Speaking of croaking: Domenico and Stefano are both fighting colds. Snow camte early to Milan this winter.
5
■ Dolce & GabbanaBy Tim Blanks ■
Tim Blanks:An early
problem is that all the world wants
shape in the shop to be tighter-like
to copy the American system.
before.—Stefano Gabbana
winter. How fitting when the
SG: For me, the future isn’t com-
news is so bad everywhere!
ing from the USA, like it was before.
DD: You know why? Because my
Stefano Gabbana:
I’ve been saying this for three years.
male customer is between 30 and
But business is bad everywhere. The
40—no wife, no girlfriend, living his
rich people still spend, but more
own life, and spending all his mon-
I look
carefully. The problem is the people
ey on himself.
at the TV, and the most interesting
in the middle—and women. With
interviews with financial people
men, it’s different.
SG: The money hasn’t changed,
Everywhere. It’s worldwide.
Domenico Dolce:
are in Japan. It’s a mistake to think
it’s the mentality.
things are as bad everywhere, be-
all men and women want to be sexy.
DD: This moment is interesting.
cause in Japan and China there is
In the last three seasons, when we
The worst times can be the best if
more cash than in the States. They
tried to change shapes with the
you think with positive energy.
are full of liquid assets. The big
new volume, customers altered the
SG: We started in a crisis—both
don’t sell like we did before, the cus-
the men’s and the women’s collections.
DD: Maybe we go well with crisis. [laughs] When we launched the women’s collection in 1986, there was the bombing of Libya, and all
tomer has changed, blah blah blah . . . I’ve heard this song since 1986.
TB:I felt that with your Spring collection—it was so lush,
DD: Today in Corriere della Serra
so rich. It felt very extreme. I
there was a story about this financial
wonder if you were thinking
crisis bringing people closer, making friends and family more important.
ahead to what was going to happen when you designed it.
the Americans cancelled their ap-
SG: Yes, but I’m also tired of read-
pointments. They had to leave for
ing this stupid stuff. I’m sick of it. We
SG: No. I think our customers
Switzerland to take a plane back to
said the same thing after September
don’t need anything. They just want
the U.S. And then there was the in-
11. We just continue to do our job in
something special. This is why we
vasion of Kuwait when we launched
the same way, maybe putting more
do collections—not just the Spring
the men’s collection in 1990.
energy, more fantasia, more creativ-
fashion show, but the pre-Fall and
SG: So when the shops say we
ity into it.
cruise lines too. The customers love
6
■ Dolce & GabbanaBy Tim Blanks ■
to find something in the shop they
All the magazines were saying it’s
’80s—there’s a big gap. What the
don’t see in a magazine. This is the
not about sexy, it’s about volume,
fashion system says and what the
trick about the cruise and pre-Fall
but in the end, our women said no.
fashion customer says are really two
collections. Nobody knows about
It’s always the same—all men and
different things.
them. When you go to the shop, you
women want to be sexy. In the last
really find something you don’t see
three seasons, when we tried to
anywhere else.
change shapes with the new vol-
system say in the ’80s?
vOnce I would have said that people
ume, customers altered the shape in
want something they have seen, but
the shop to be tighter—like before.
SG: Armani, Ferré, Versace, big
you’re saying that’s changed. Are people more confident?
SG: About fashion, for sure. For
TB:So that means magazines are out of touch?
TB:What did the fashion
shows, tight trousers, miniskirts . . . So we did the opposite: very soft, romantic, the Sicilian-bustier look. We stood out just because we were
three seasons we worked on vol-
SG:
Magazines do what they
so different. That sexy dress with the
ume, not shape, and in the end, you
want, but the customers don’t give
black corset was the essence of Dol-
know what the customer said? No!
a damn. Believe me, it’s like in the
ce & Gabbana. But you know, it’s an
evolution, month by month, day by
can imagine a transparent suit for
day. We love to change. My favorite
men. But at the end of the day, you
DD: I’m a customer of Dolce &
piece is the bra from 1984. [He
know what we sell? Style. The es-
points to that very item of clothing,
sence of Dolce & Gabbana is the cor-
mounted and framed on the wall like
set for women, the white shirt and
SG: [needling] Why don’t you buy
a holy relic, right under a huge Julian
very fitted trousers for men.
the shearling?
Schnabel painting] And we continue to do it. One season it’s bigger, or we change the color, the stitching, and everything. But I love looking for something different.
TB:Surely that’s disappointing for you then if your dream is big, gorgeous shearling coats
DD: When we sketch the show,
[from the Fall 2008 collection]
it’s a dream. I stay with my feet on
and people still want the black
the floor when I dream, but we are completely free . . . I don’t know. I
suit with the white shirt.
7
Gabbana. I like a lot of clothes by Dolce & Gabbana.
DD: If you open my wardrobe, it’s very boring. I have 10 black suits. One is one-button, one is two-button, one is shawl-collared. Maybe the trouser is bigger for the sneaker or finer for the crocodile shoe. So there is a lot for men.
SG: But you know what people
■ Dolce & GabbanaBy Tim Blanks ■
wear. The shearling coat is very masculine and very sweet at the same time, but to actually wear that is dif-
to wVisconti’s The Leopard [1963], especially with the spirit of the Spring shows.
ficult.
DD: We talk too much about this DD: Dolce & Gabbana at the moshearling, but it opens the mind to
ment is very strange. I think it’s the
move somewhere. And in this mo-
same for every designer.
ment of crisis, when people are
After you go out, you come back in-
afraid, if you don’t make the dream
side.
...
SG: We are so different. Eighty
TB:Once more with shearling. I’ve been thinking that you’ve been going back to your roots,
live.
percent of Domenico loves to go somewhere new, to develop an idea, and the other 20 percent goes back to the roots. I’m the opposite: 80
You come with me.”
TB:So you’re the man, and
from the future. So it’s a fight all the time. But I say, “Okay, I love your trip. I agree with you, it’s very new for Dolce & Gabbana.” But I need to do it so it’s recognizable.
TB:So he’s the dreamer, and you’re the realist?
SG: No, no, it’s not like that. He is more projected into the future, and I am more attached to my roots, and the balance is Dolce & Gabbana.
DD: I want to dance. I want to
to Milan from Sicily when
DD: I like time. Now is not like
you were only 18.
two minutes later. And it’s never like
SG: And I say to him, “No. You come here.” And he says to me, “No.
percent from the roots, 20 percent
DD: Yes, I started my second life. I love the new. I’m a very curious person.
before. Repetition doesn’t exist. I like time. Now is not like two minutes later. And it’s never like before. Repetition doesn’t exist. —Domeni-
he’s the little boy. Is that
TB:[to Gabbana] Did you
the way you were in your
reinvent yourself?
TB:Well, that’s a big fat
relationship as well?
SG: No. I was born here. I grew
existential moment.
SG: Yes. TB:[to Dolce] You reinvented yourself when you came
up here. I don’t change. I think he discovered himself as a different person. Maybe I’m more Italian than him, because I love to stay.
8
co Dolce
DD: This is the problem sometimes, because he doesn’t want to change anything. But maybe what you discover next is much better.
■ Dolce & GabbanaBy Tim Blanks ■
SG: But not all people are ready SG: We start every season with a to understand the new. You think it’s
piece of paper, two lists—“Yes” and
easy, but it’s not. People love to rec-
“No.” And always it’s “No brocade,
ognize, to feel comfortable in some-
no animal prints . . .” It’s too easy to
thing. Ninety-five percent of human-
do the brocade. We do the list be-
ity is like me. Maybe I’m stupid, but
cause we are not young. We are old
I’m like this.
chickens in the system. We’ve done
TB:That said, your Spring
this job for 24 years, you know.
in a corset, and in the end . . .
TB:The whole collection is brocade!
DD: Yes, it’s very funny. SG: When we came back from the holiday, we thought a jacket would be really nice in duchesse satin, or in
DD: And we design too much ani-
silk Mikado, but because the shape
mal print. So, “No animal print,” and
was really new for us, we felt we
“Yes a white shirt with lace,” “Yes a
needed something to make people
new shoulder,” “No brocade . . .” But
more comfortable. He said, “Bro-
finally, maybe I need some brocade.
cade.” I said, “No. Fuck brocade.” But
heavy as an empress’s closet.
SG: Or then maybe I need to do it
he was right.
TB:But if you say you’re
felt we needed something more ro-
collection for women was a startling mix of the familiar and the strange, and as brocade-
not going to do the corset and you’re not going to do brocade, and you keep coming
mantic. And it was shocking in the brocade, a geometric shape with a touch of romance. And with a bow and a necklace, you could imagine Claudia Cardinale in a remake of The
you made your women very fierce, in this strong, flat silhouette, and you made your men soft in pajamas.
Leopard.
DD: Women are more even on
I turned 50, and I’m very happy at
fashion and style, 50-50. For men,
this moment. I dreamed this job . . .
it’s 80-20 style and fashion.
Yes, okay, but if we start
maybe I’m more wise, more rooted.
[There is some city talk . . . Dolce’s New
from that point, we don’t do any-
Next year is the first year of my new
York apartment, his love of the city’s
thing new. We need to start from an
age. —Domenico Dolce
openness, in comparison to London,
back to them, aren’t these things a prison for you?
SG:
which they are equally fond of, even
opposite point. The jacket with the strange shoulder in black Mikado was beautiful, like a sketch, but I
TB:For the Spring collection,
though they find it quite closed.]
TB:Do you ever get
9
■ Dolce & GabbanaBy Tim Blanks ■
bored in Milan?
harder to manage?
SG: I don’t have the time to be SG: It’s technology’s fault. What
TB:You own your own company—nobody owns
bored. We do 14 collections, in-
used to take one day now takes
cluding D&G children. Plus all the
three hours. And the other five
accessories, sunglasses, D&G jew-
hours . . . You’re doing more, more,
els, perfume, and now makeup. And
faster, faster. Everything is too quick.
Domenico took care of the under-
Sometimes I would like to stop. I
wear this morning. I forgot. We split
love to move, but not as quickly as
SG: If you tell me I have 3,600
sometimes when there’s not time.
now. Cruise, pre-Fall, on and on . . .
employees, I’m not afraid, but I don’t
But I can’t imagine it without him
You think the customer understands
feel comfortable. But if you don’t tell
around. Oh, my God!
them? Needs them? I don’t think
me anything, I don’t think about it. I
so. Only the fashion system under-
know what we are. I know what we
stands. But I don’t work for the fash-
do. I would love to think the same
ion system. I work 80 percent for the
way I did 20 years ago, because I
customer.
don’t want to lose the sense of free-
TB:You say it’s getting faster and faster. Is it getting
your own clothes?
dom. I don’t want to change my life for this big company.
TB:It’s trying to staying pure, isn’t it?
DD: No, pure is impossible, because we have meetings every two weeks about the business all over
SG: No. I like to buy different things. [pointing at Domenico] Oh, look at the face. Look, look!
DD: Because he wants to lose money. He’s so rich, he loses his money on other designers.
you. And it’s a billiondollar business. How’s that for a responsibility?
wear them. Sometimes I think he does it just to annoy me.
TB:Do your boyfriends ever get jealous of your relationship?
SG: If so, it’s too bad for them. We are really good friends—that’s it, like brothers. We are family. I
the world. But if you use this infor-
TB:Which designers do you buy?
say Domenico is the first person in
mation like anxiety, you kill the crea-
SG: Swimwear from Vuitton, an
my life. If you don’t like it, it’s your
tivity. So, first, you are free. We have a huge company, and we make what we want.
TB:Do you wear only
Hermès sweater, this shirt by Pucci
problem.
TB:Do you think your
...
DD: He buys them and then he gives them away because he doesn’t
10
relationship is unusual?
■ Dolce & GabbanaBy Tim Blanks ■
floor and I live on another. I don’t
him that. And I waited. And on Sat-
know what he does in the night with
urday night I stayed home because
his boyfriend. And I don’t care, re-
my boyfriend had a fever, and I fell
very good example for everybody in
ally.
asleep on the sofa in front of the TV,
the world, gay and straight. Because
DD: No, listen to me. Let me tell
and then I wake up and I hear the
DD: Very unusual. SG:
Our relationship is also a
our love story continued, without sex and without living together. Why not? He was the first big love story in my life. Why do we need to cancel that? And I don’t want to forget it.
you about last night. You were supposed to call me. My boyfriend had a fever so he couldn’t go out, and you said, “Ciao. I’ll call you later. We’ll go
noise, boom, boom. I think maybe it’s the air conditioner. I turn off the TV and it’s boom, boom, boom, over my kitchen.
SG: Because Giovanna [Battaglia,
to dinner.”
TB:Do you think you’ll
SG: And I forgot and I didn’t call
end up together again?
him.
erstwhile house model, now a contributing fashion editor at L’Uomo Vogue] was there, dancing like Ma-
SG: But we do live together. No, DD: And I’m waiting for dinner. not together, but he lives on one
Yesterday I didn’t eat, and I told
DD: Boom, boom, boom. I think,
happen to you, in 10 years, say?
donna in the “Give It 2 Me” video.
DD: I don’t want to stop, but I
maybe he’s fighting with some peo-
DD: I don’t know. I only think
ple. The day after, I called him: “Did
about this afternoon. Tomorrow is
tivity stops. At the time when you
you organize a dance yesterday in
another day.
understand that it’s not your mo-
your home?” No. Nothing.
SG: In this moment you need to
ment anymore, you move aside for
SG: I had 10 people in the kitchen—friends of mine.
DD: Boom, boom, boom. SG: We drink and smoke before we go out. And when she arrived, Giovanna wanted to dance.
TB:What do you think is going to
think about now. Maybe tomorrow morning, not afternoon.
TB:Well, what would you like to happen?
think there is a time when the crea-
another actor. Like in the theater.
SG: But I would love to stay on in the backstage.
TB:You could be Clint
SG: What might happen, I don’t
Eastwood. He’s 78, still
know, but I would love to continue
directing, still acting.
my job, because this is my life.
11
DD: You need to be very intelli-
■ Dolce & GabbanaBy Tim Blanks ■
gent. And you need to not be egotistical.
brother’s book, did you think, Oh, I’m a bit like that?
TB:What about Madonna?
about money. I would love to think the same way I did 20 years ago, because I don’t want to lose the sense
SG: No, because I’m not. I’m not
of freedom. I don’t want to change
called Madonna Ciccone. My name
my life for this big company.— Ste-
herself. We don’t sell us. I sell peo-
is Stefano Gabbana. I’m a different
fano Gabbana
ple something from my hand, from
person. Every person is different in
my mind. Not my person. It’s differ-
the world.
SG: We continue in this job be-
SG: The product that she sells is
ent.
cause we love it. When we started,
TB:Do you think you have TB:Do she’s in a trap?
DD:
No. She’s Madonna. She’s
one name, one history. She’s very strong.
TB:When you read her
to be quite hard to be as successful as you’ve been?
DD:
we didn’t wish to become popular. We were ambitious, but not for money. We just wanted to express ourselves.
I don’t work for money.
DD: Every season we look at all
That’s not why I do it. I don’t care
the shows by other designers. The
designers we love a lot—I don’t want
know? But we’re not jealous.
definitely felt to me that you
to say which, but there are three—
DD: If you envy other people you
just decided, “Fuck that. I can
make me angry with myself. Why don’t I design my collection much better than this? My competition is not with the others, it’s with myself.
SG: I remember when Azzedine
never grow. I love two or three designers a lot. For me, they are new energy. But I’m old . . .
TB:Excuse me?
Alaïa, for example, did a fantastic
SG: No, we are not old in age. Old
collection in the ’80s, and I said,
because . . .
“Wow, why can’t we do this?”
DD: Why didn’t we think of this? Are we stupid? Sei un cretino?
do what I want to do now.”
SG: Yeah, because we are more mature.
DD: I turned 50, and I’m very happy at this moment. I dreamed this job—I came to Milan and my dream
TB:Because you’ve been around a long time? I feel
SG: I love Azzedine’s work, but I
like something happened a
would love to do it before him, you
few seasons ago for you. It
12
came true. So maybe I’m more wise, more rooted. When you are 30 or 40, you are like . . . [makes gasping sound] So this is my new age. Next year is the first year of my new age.
■ Dolce & GabbanaBy Tim Blanks ■
TB:Thank you very much. That was a long interview, wasn’t it?
DD: We talked about life.
13
■ Todd Haynes By Kate Winslet ■
Todd Haynes
(Bootleg copies can still be viewed on YouTube.) Haynes, who was born in Los Angeles in 1961, has
By Kate Winslet
been tweaking societal conventions ever since. As a pivotal member of the New Queer Cinema movement, he enraged conservative politicians with frank
Painstakingly constructed settings are usually
depictions of gay sex in Poison (1991), then upended
reserved for epic science fiction fantasies where
his own audience’s expectations four years later,
directors have unparalleled freedom to create digital
with the jarring hypochondriac drama Safe (1995).
environments, but there are no superheroes in a Todd
Subsequent films such as Velvet Goldmine (1998),
Haynes film—just empathetic, flawed human beings
Far From Heaven (2002), and I’m Not There (2007)
acting out their lives in minute period detail. Haynes
manage to embrace both experimental and formal
became a cult icon when his 43-minute short film
aims, like academic theses wrapped in sweeping,
Superstar (1987), the tragic saga of anorexic pop
melodramatic arcs. Throughout his career, the
star Karen Carpenter told using Barbie dolls, was
director has explored how women have navigated
banned from circulation because of copyright issues.
visible and invisible levers of power. “I’m drawn to
female characters,” he tells Kate Winslet, his self-professed “other Coen brother” and star and co-producer of his new HBO miniseries, Mildred Pierce. “And not all of them are strong characters.” Airing this spring, the five-part miniseries tells the story based on the novel by James N. Cain, of a resilient but imperfect woman who struggles to raise a family in Great Depression–era Los Angeles. Winslet recently spoke with Haynes, who was at his home in Portland, Oregon, about, among other things, Mildred Pierce, why he’s never made a film set in the contemporary world, and the challenge of letting things go.
15
■ Todd HaynesBy Kate Winslet ■
Kate Winslet: Do you
Winslet: Do you think that your
remember the experience of
expectations for movies beyond
watching your first ever movie?
that moment were amplified?
Todd Haynes: I do. I was 3 years old and it was Mary Poppins [1964] and it made an impression on me that was seismic, apparently. I fell into some kind of total creative, imaginative rapture over that movie that propelled this industry of Mary Poppins drawings, plays, performances—just an obsessive, creative reaction to it.
Haynes: Yes.
of sort of obsessional interests. After Mary Poppins, it was probably the [Franco] Zeffirelli Romeo and Juliet in ’68. I was 7, and it completely blew my mind and I went into this
Winslet: So did you
sort of Shakespeare obsessional pe-
subsequently feel let down
Miracle Worker [1962] or Anne of the
if something didn’t give you
riod. And then later, movies like The
Thousand Days [1969]. A lot of them, interestingly, were English in setting
that same internal punch?
and subject [laughs] whatever that
Haynes: No, I don’t think I was let
means. What was your first one? Do
down. Other movies along the way
you remember?
would seize me in similar ways and would usher in a whole new phase
Winslet: The first film that
I remember having a really
with me, taking care of me,
out working, whether he was
profound impact on me was
and it was just on television. It
working for a tarmac firm, or
The Red Balloon [1956].
was the experience of sitting
the postman, or doing whatever
and having that one-to-one,
he did to make ends meet. Or
very special time with my dad.
acting jobs, which were very
I was one of four siblings, and
few and far between anyway.
so one-to-one time happened
And just recently, because I
very rarely with either parent.
remembered that experience, I
And particularly not with my
sat down and watched The Red
father, because he was always
Balloon with both Mia and Joe
Haynes:
Oh wow, that’s a cool
one.
Winslet: I know. I’m kind of proud of how cool that is. [laughs] But the reason why I remember watching it is because I was ill off school and I was at home and my dad was
16
■ Todd HaynesBy Kate Winslet ■
and they both were moved to
there a specific reason why that
that you really only make
tears by it. They really grasped
hasn’t happened in your career?
a project once every what,
the concept, that just one thing, so unique and so beautiful can make you so happy and change your entire perspective of the world and your day-today existence. Would you like to direct a film set in more contemporary times and is
end of that spectrum. Where do you feel you fall?
Haynes: dogged
I think it’s due to the
single-mindedness
that
seems to be required for me to produce something as complex and demanding as a film, especially ones I’ve written and directed. And as an independent filmmaker, to develop the money and the financing and the structure and the whole process, and then promoting them and traveling with them, which is a part of the process that I’ve always enjoyed and I’ve learned a great deal from. I real-
Haynes: I continue to think about historical moments and periods as inspiration and subject matter, and yet, everything that occurs to me has some relationship to what’s going on today. I guess I’ve always felt that when you see material through a frame—and for me that period or that historical setting is a frame—it allows a viewer to make their own connections to why it’s relevant.
four years? Five years?
Haynes: [laughs] Something like that, yeah.
Winslet: Someone like [Steven] Soderbergh is known for working at a fairly fast pace and that works for him, and Baz Luhrmann is known
Winslet: I’m realizing
for working on the opposite
ly do like seeing it all through, start-
of totalizing experience for me, and
ing from the very beginning, which
it doesn’t ever feel like there are big,
often entails years of research on
long periods of inactivity between
a subject. Someone like the Bob
projects, it just feels like that’s the
Dylan subject for I’m Not There re-
necessary lifespan of a single work,
quired what I felt was almost a dis-
when you’re really the person gen-
sertation on somehow trying to get
erating it.
close to encompassing his life and story and the historical influences that affected him and his work and all of that. I feel like I’m the same with the sort of glam era for Velvet Goldmine, and all the various artists and influences that produced that moment. So yeah, it becomes a kind
17
Winslet: When you were a child, did you always want to direct? Did you ever consider doing anything else? Was there another
■ Todd HaynesBy Kate Winslet ■
passing fad or anything?
phisticated and began to see films,
the world literally through frames. I
Haynes: It was kind of a big bub-
all the films that were coming out
think by around the time I was about
ble of interest in the arts in general,
in the late ’60s and early ’70s were
8 or 9, the idea of filmmaking prob-
and in visual art all along, drawing
evoking a kind of zeitgeist of the
ably took hold. I made little Super 8
and painting and stuff, but I always
times . . . the excitement of how a
extravaganzas when I was a kid, the
loved theater and acting in plays
lens can tell a story and what was
first being my own version of Romeo
and directing, writing little plays
possible and a new sensibility about
and Juliet, and where I played all the
and directing friends in plays. And
how to tell stories visually were as
parts except for Juliet. My mom even
I think when I was about 6 or 7, I
much about what you excluded from
shot a Super 8 test roll in double
would have said I wanted to be an
the frame as what you included.
exposure, because I wasn’t sure if I
actor and an artist. And that just kind
There was a new minimalism and a
could find a good Juliet, so I dressed
of kept honing itself around film and
new shorthand in visual language
up as Juliet.
getting closer to film. I remember
that I remember feeling so stimulat-
seeing The Graduate[1967] when I
ed by, like, through my entire body,
was a kid, and as I became more so-
and I would walk around looking at
I could find a good Juliet.”
[laughs] I love the exacting
more vividly the experience of mak-
this guy up into our office and paid
ing my first feature, Poison, which
him to play this sort of perverse Jean
was done in New York City, because
Genet–influenced angel, and shot
we needed such a range of acting
him in a couple hours, and then sent
styles, so we put ads in Back Stage
him on his way with some money in
magazine and interviewed tons and
his pocket. . . . But I don’t think it’s
tons of working theater actors, and it
until you learn, until you work with
was a combination of people who’d
nonprofessionals, and get good stuff
worked in film, people who’d worked
out of that process that I think you
in theater, complete newcomers, and
really understand the whole range
not actors, and that process was so
of what’s possible and how there is
rich and exciting and interesting, and
no single style of acting. And there is
we literally, at one point in the film,
no single approach that actors take
wanted a bum off the street, and we
to their craft. And the best thing you
went to the Bowery and we pulled
learn is that you have to really listen
standards, even in an 8 year old.
Haynes:
There’s this footage
of me as Romeo on one side of the frame, and pop, I pop on as Juliet on the other, in drag.
Winslet: How about some of your early experiences of working with actors? Do you remember being struck by how unpredictable that can be?
Haynes:
I remember probably
18
Winslet: “I wasn’t sure if
■ Todd HaynesBy Kate Winslet ■
and respect each actor’s own process and own method, and that takes a kind of delicate, you know, nonimposing patience and openness, I think, to get the very best out of the people you work with.
Winslet: Hey, we were fortunate that we got along, Todd.
Haynes:
Oh my god, Kate, can
Winslet: Oh my god! That’s such a huge compliment, that has to go into this piece. Okay, some of your movies feature women as the protagonist. Do you think that you are particularly drawn to strong female characters?
you imagine? I mean it really worked
Haynes:
out, so I felt like I had my other Coen
characters, not all of them are strong
brother, you know? [both laugh]
characters. I think I’m drawn to fe-
I’m drawn to female
male characters partly because they
contained within very rigid domes-
really encountered before. I think
tic settings and suppressed by their
it’s very rare in the pantheon of
role as wife or mother, this is a wom-
women’s films and women’s stories.
an thrust out into the world, newly
I mean, you’ve played a lot of differ-
single, with two kids to raise in the
ent characters with unique, surpris-
Depression in Los Angeles who has
ing strength and grit and access to
to find her way. And the way she
their desire and erotic sides and so
functions, her unbelievable skills
forth, but I don’t know if you’ve ever
and drive and industry as a person
played someone exactly like this.
and how her own, even emotional
There was a new minimalism and a
pathologies around her daughter
new shorthand in visual language
get translated into productive work
that I remember feeling so stimulat-
and amazing success and all of that,
ed by. . . . I would walk around look-
I just find an unusual female char-
ing at the world literally through
acter and story and one I’d never
frames—Todd Haynes:
19
don’t have as easy or as obvious a relationship to power in society, and so they suffer under social constraints or have to maneuver within them in ways men sometimes don’t, or are unconscious about, or have certain liberties that are invisible to them. And those accesses to power are never invisible, they’re always a struggle. The ways that those sort of ambiguities are internalized are extremely interesting to me as well. Mildred Pierce is such an amazing example, because unlike most domestic dramas, where it’s about women
Winslet: No, I haven’t at all. One thing I realized as we were shooting was that Mildred has so much strength, but also so much weakness that she learns how to disguise and moderate. And at the same time, her weakness does come out. Somehow she manages to turn those weaknesses into
■ Todd HaynesBy Kate Winslet ■
strengths, or projections onto
what she wants for that child,
Winslet: And obviously,
her other relationships—in
but her weakness, her massive
it ultimately came back to
particular, her relationship
Achilles’ heel is the fact that
become one of the single most
with Veda [Mildred’s daughter,
she loves her to a fault, that
destructive things in her life.
played by Evan Rachel Wood].
she can’t help herself and also
It’s her strongest point
wishes on some level that she
and her weakest point.
too could be like that kid.
Haynes: Absolutely.
Haynes: Yes.
Haynes: Yeah, but along the way, becomes this incredibly productive thing.
Winslet: Yes. Haynes:
And on both sides of
Winslet: She knows how to
Winslet: Which is not a good
that spectrum it’s stuff she doesn’t
raise that kid, she knows what
thing for a parent to feel.
characters don’t see things in them-
she believes in, she knows
the audience to see for them and to see things they don’t see yet and it creates a really empathetic relationship and then that’s something that creates an element of suspense throughout this story, because she’s so capable, she’s so extraordinary in so many ways, and there are many things she does see or does come to learn about herself. But then the most persistent, or the most sort of ravaging, are the ones she doesn’t see until the end.
Winslet: I want to talk about
Haynes: No.
see. I think it’s so interesting when
selves, because it actually again asks
what has been the most difficult film for you to let go of emotionally, because I know as an actor there are key ones for me, but I wonder if it’s the same for a director.
Haynes: Each one becomes such a total physical immersion and I’m sure a kind of psychic development of my own self as I go through those films. By the time I finished Poison, the New Queer Cinema was branded and I was associated with this. In
20
many ways it formed me as a filmmaker, like as a feature filmmaker I never set out to be. I figured I would be teaching my whole life and making experimental films on the side. In many ways, the emergence that New Queer Cinema designated was an audience that had always been part of the art house audience but was suddenly distinguished as gay or queer or whatever, and that became a way to generate a product for this new audience that was aware, that was politicized, that was obviously literate and culturally savvy.
■ Todd HaynesBy Kate Winslet ■
rehearsal period on films, but
And they could take films that were
but without gay characters as the
different and were challenging and
subjects. It was still coming from
were trying out different things. But
me. It was still my perspective, it
by the same token, I was so eager to
just didn’t have sexy abs in it, you
move on from it and do something
know what I mean? I guess I fancied
quite different in my second film,
that I was ready to move on from
Safe, with Julianne Moore. We would
these films, and in fact you never re-
take it to gay film festivals because
ally are. They’re things you create,
it was the second film by the gay
they’re things you love in different
filmmaker or whatever and people
ways and they never leave you.
were like, “What the fuck is this?”
Winslet: This is my last question.
Haynes:
Haynes: All right.
Wasn’t it incredible? It was so es-
Winslet: Yeah.
we spent almost two weeks on Mildred. Were you surprised by the ways in which that may have helped you? Do you think you would like to repeat the rehearsal process on set? Oh god, absolutely!
Winslet: You haven’t always
sential for something this massive.
been in a position to have a
material, and a ten-year span of a
character’s life that we were shoot-
level of text and the level of charac-
and you’re going to have to
ing every which way, as always in
ter and backstory and relationships
low-budget filmmaking. It was so
that aren’t depicted, and exchanges
psychically grounding. The kinds of
that don’t come out in the actual
work that started to happen in those
scenes in the film, but that provide
sessions continued to develop, even
their backstory. It creates a history,
when you weren’t with other actors,
you know, that you carry with you,
but it planted seeds that continued
and keep applying, on camera.
Haynes: I found that film to be just as much an indictment of hetero-normative society as Poison was,
to take root and grow throughout the process. Having the idea of rehearsals made me think I could do everything in the rehearsal time, and basically, we never left the table. But there was so much to discuss and so much to deal with just at the
Winslet: I thought it was particularly important for the children because it’s so intimidating. Knowing that you’re playing a big character
21
Five-and-a-half hours of dramatic
learn your lines and be in a room with all these people who, you know, apparently know what they’re doing. One of the things that we were both able to share with them is how important mistakes are. And how we love mistakes.
Haynes: Yeah the misspeakings and fumblings and mumblings are
■ Todd HaynesBy Kate Winslet ■
these characters.
across to grab the orange
Winslet: But we really did
juice jug? Little things like
want to know: What did they
that made a big difference
think their character would
because, of course, it did move
do? What would they do at
so fast when we got into the
home sitting round a dinner
room and they felt as though
table? Would they reach
anything that they did was of
22
value to the whole project.
Haynes: There’s a real family life, you know, buzzing along, on camera. It’s really extraordinary. Kate!
Winslet: There you go, babe.
■ Todd HaynesBy Kate Winslet ■
23
■ Tom Ford By John Currin ■
Tom Ford
Who would fill the void, rise to the occasion, and, more importantly, have both the creative talent and
By John Currin
business acumen to fulfill the dreams of customers and the expectations of stockholders? No doubt, in Ford’s absence—shorter than some imagined,
When Tom Ford walked away from womenswear
as he launched his eponymous menswear label in
more than six years ago, he wasn’t just vacating his
2007—fashion has changed significantly. But so
post as creative director of Gucci Group, where he
has the man himself. In 2009 he delivered A Single
designed for both Gucci and Yves Saint Laurent—
Man, a poignant, wrenching, maturely expressed
he was leaving an industry that he helped shape
drama based on the Christopher Isherwood novel,
and reinvent. He’d brought a new understanding of
which revealed him to be a cinematic force as well
glamour, beauty, sophistication, and, above all, sexual
as a sartorial one. And then last fall, the man who
seduction to fashion, so when he announced in 2004
famously got out of the game because he was fed
that he was quitting to try his hand as a film director,
up with the business came back to the land he once
it sparked something of a communal identity crisis.
ruled—and did so in a sensational way. Tom Ford’s
Spring 2011 womenswear collection, presented at Ford’s Manhattan store to a select few journalists, editors, and fashion-world heavies, was the biggest show of the season that you never saw, partly because Ford decided to mark his return to dressing the female form as a way of protesting the current state of the industry: fashion as impersonal, aggressive, and aloof; fashion as playing to the critics instead of the customers; fashion as instantly accessible via the Internet to a global audience that obsesses over trends without ever experiencing the quality, the complexity, and the refinement of the clothes themselves. The presentation was Ford’s manifestolike argument for bringing back to high-end fashion the excitement, intimacy, immediacy, and sense of fun— all qualities that have been arguably sacrificed over the last decade for the mass-takeover approach favored by many of today’s designers. Ford invited only 100 guests to his Madison Avenue showroom on the evening of September 12, 2010. Playing emcee on the microphone, with photographer Terry Richardson and his team securing the show’s only visual documentation, Ford announced each look as it came down the runway worn by one of the many actresses, artists, models, musicians, socialites, and muses the designer had personally chosen to walk in the show—among them, Julianne Moore, Beyoncé Knowles, Daphne Guinness, Lou Doillon, Lauren Hutton, Karen Elson, Marisa Berenson, Natalia Vodianova, and Stella Tennant. While Ford refused all requests for media sneak peaks and red-carpet opportunities, what was evident in the collection was that
25
■ Tom Ford By John Currin ■
Ford’s continuing obsession with and glorification of the female form had not gotten tame—he brought out the slips and curves of the body with silk fringe, leopard print, suede, and leather. Ford hasn’t abandoned his second career—in fact, he is in the process of finishing the screenplay for his next film project. But as his friend, the painter John Currin (husband to another of Ford’s presentation muses, the artist Rachel Feinstein), caught up with him in Los Angeles, it was clear that Ford relished being back on his home turf, making clothes for women and making women feel the way only he can.
Tom Ford: We have to be careful. Everything we are saying is going to be recorded
John Currin: [laughs] The small acorn that will grow into a great oak of
I think a good one to start off with is about your childhood. What were some of your first memories of seeing beauty?
Ford: That would have been as a little kid living in Texas. My grandmother was probably the first per-
looked great. She always had the latest things. She was larger than life to me, even as an adult, but when I was a child it was really like she was from another planet. It seemed like she lived in a different world, and wherever that was, I wanted to go.
Currin: So it wasn’t natural
a scandal later, right?
son who I thought was beautiful.
Ford: [sighs] Ah, yes, I know what
She was incredibly stylish, she had
that’s like. You say the littlest thing,
big hair, big cars. I was probably
it gets misinterpreted.
3 years old, but she was like a car-
Ford:
Currin: Well, I’m here to
toon character. She’d swoop into
to appreciate those things until
our lives with presents and boxes,
much later in life, because I grew
ask you some questions, and
and she always smelled great and
up mostly in New Mexico, which is
26
beauty, then. It wasn’t sunsets or mountains or trees. No. In fact, I didn’t learn
■ Tom Ford By John Currin ■
famous for sunsets and mountains
tivation—the way things are folded
lier notions of what was important
and trees. That’s the reason I have a
or put in a drawer.
in life. And George has a moment
place there and spend so much time
Ford: Well, I do that myself, and
where time stands still, and he re-
there now. When I was a little kid, all
that character was very, very, very
ally feels his connection to the uni-
I wanted to do was to escape what
autobiographical and very different
verse and understands the meaning
I thought was the country and get
from the character in the Isherwood
of life, in a way, and that he doesn’t
to a city. Probably film and televi-
book. That’s really about putting
need to live any longer, and he dies.
sion had influenced me so much, I
on a sort of armor to go out in the
I never used to say that he dies, but
really thought the key to happiness
world. The character played by Ju-
I think enough people have seen
was living a very artificial life in a
lianne [Moore] was quite literally
the film by now, so I can give away
penthouse in New York with martini
based on my grandmother. It’s fun-
the ending. But as an adult working
glasses.
ny, that movie was cathartic for me.
in the fashion industry, I struggle
Currin: Your movie had some of
It was really my midlife crisis on the
with materialism. And I’m one of the
that feeling; for instance, with its
screen. [Currin laughs] It was! I was
least materialistic people that exist,
collection of small moments of cul-
working through all of those ear-
because material possessions don’t
mean much to me. They’re beautiful, I enjoy them, they can enhance your life to a certain degree, but they’re ultimately not important. Your connections with other people are important, our connection to the earth. And that’s why I go to New Mexico as often as I can. And what I find to be the most beautiful thing in the world now is nature—sunsets, trees, my horses.
Currin: I didn’t mean it pejoratively that your aesthetic is always about cultivation.
Ford: My fashion aesthetic. I guess I’ve yet to express another aesthetic.
Currin: What’s interesting in the movie is that the aesthetic is so unsexualized. It was orderly and beautiful, but with this tragic panic underneath. But it was weird how it did look like you and your world to a degree, or how most people envision it.
Ford:
Well, I think most people
27
don’t actually know me. They know the projection of me that I use to sell things. And they know me from an expression of material beauty. I’m actually very introverted. I’m very shy. I’m very emotional. I think those are human experiences that everyone can relate to. So this movie wasn’t about sex. It was about love. That was on purpose, because a lot of people equate homosexuality with sex and not necessarily with love. It was important that I keep the movie not about sex. It was about the same struggle that everyone
■ Tom Ford By John Currin ■
goes through, if you’re intelligent, at some point in your life. You ask yourself, What is this all about? Why am I living? What does this mean? Why am I here? Those are the questions George is asking himself.
Currin: If I could segue then to—
Ford: To high heels? Yes! Let’s get to high heels. That’s a great segue right into fashion.
Currin: Actually, yeah, because you are saying that
people associate homosexuality with sex—or oversexed men and sexual relationships. But when you’re making a sculpture or image of a woman, is there a sexual aspect to it?
Ford:
It is never even calculat-
ed. When I’m making an image of a woman, or dressing a woman—I have a reputation for sex and making a woman sexy, and men as well— but I don’t start out saying, “Oh, I’m gonna make this woman look sexy
or sexual.” I simply stand there and put her in front of me and say, “What can I do to make her more beautiful in my eyes? Let’s pull in the dress here, let’s do this, let’s do that.” The end result is something that other people consider sexual, but for me it’s just beautiful. My expression of beauty is something I do naturally. I love the human body—the female body, the male body. I work in a way to try to enhance the body, and so you often see a lot of the body or the silhouette or outline, and that’s what people equate with sex. But I’m
very comfortable with sexuality. It’s
ture to be considered beautiful. But
view.” I said, “Fine, we have to do it
not anything that’s ever freaked me
full frontal male nudity challenges
nude.”
out. I’m very comfortable with naked
us. It makes men nervous. It makes
bodies. Someone asked me recently
women nervous. Other times in his-
about male nudity, and I brought up
tory, male nudes have been regard-
the interviewer?
the subject that, in our culture, we
ed in a different way. The Olympics
Ford: Oh, 55 or 56. [Currin laughs]
use female nudity to sell everything.
were originally held nude. The re-
He was in very good shape. Anyway,
We’re very comfortable objectifying
porter I was explaining this to said,
we did the interview. The inter-
women. Women go out and they are
“This would make a great story.” I
viewer was straight, and I made it a
basically wearing nothing. Their feet
explained how when I come home I
point to desexualize the interview
and toes are exposed, their legs are
actually
even though I was sitting with my
exposed, their breasts are exposed.
take off all my clothes, and I wear
legs wide open, completely naked.
Everything is exposed—the neck,
no clothes until I leave. I eat naked. I
At the end of the interview, I put on
the arms. You have to be really phys-
do everything completely naked. He
a dressing gown and he put on his
ically perfect, as a woman, in our cul-
said, “That would make a great inter-
clothes, and I sat next to him on the
28
Currin: How old was
■ Tom Ford By John Currin ■
sofa and said, “Was that sexual?”
Currin: I sometimes get the feel-
acter is somewhat detached from
He said, “Absolutely not.” And I said,
ing that I look at women to objectify
that. It’s great when you have a com-
“That’s because I didn’t make it sex-
them, and I start to feel guilty. I won-
bination of the two— that’s what
ual. Sexuality is in the eyes, it’s an
der if that ever plagues you?
makes a true beauty. Some peo-
expression, it’s in a look.” Then, all
Ford: I think I detach the physical
ple are physically beautiful but yet
of a sudden, I looked at him in a very
from the spiritual. It’s my business
they’re completely uninteresting,
different way, and it made him very
to make a woman or a man beauti-
and thus they’re not beautiful. I de-
nervous.
ful, and I’m working with a model in
tach the two. And I turn the same eye
Currin: I wanted to ask if you’ve
a fitting, and I’ve objectified them
on myself: When I look in the mirror,
ever felt any remorse in your work,
to the point that they become an
I say, “Well, this eyebrow is starting
because that is something I’ve felt
object. They’re something that I’m
to sag,” or “I’m going gray right here,
before in my work. You don’t seem
modeling or shaping or sculpting,
I need to fix that.” Or “I’ve eaten too
like someone who feels a great deal
but I’m very aware that even though
much. I need to do a few more push-
of remorse about anything.
I make them physically beautiful,
ups, blah blah blah.” But that’s com-
Ford: No, I don’t.
their soul and personality and char-
pletely separate from me as a hu-
lust? Is that an advantage
I’ve got to spread her legs and fuck
man being. It’s purely the body that I move through the world in, and people react to it on the surface. So, no, I don’t have any remorse, because I separate them. Do you?
Currin: Yes. I think it’s mixed up in my lust for women, or my
of being a gay man?
Ford: I lust after beautiful women.
her.”
Currin: Isn’t that the
First of all, I love women. But I lust after beautiful women in the way that I lust after a beautiful piece of sculpture—this will probably get me in trouble—or a beautiful car. I be-
sexual desire for women . . .
lieve everyone’s on a sliding scale of
Ford: That’s why I think gay men
sexuality. There are moments where
make better designers.
I am sexually attracted to women.
Currin: Are gay men free?
But it doesn’t overpower my first im-
Are you unburdened by
as my lust for beauty in all things.
pulse; my lust for them is the same
It’s not like I ever think, “Oh, my god,
29
sticking point—
Ford:
What a well-chosen word.
[both laugh]
Currin: But the very thing that is required by art, which is to isolate and objectify and to look from a distance at something, is the thing that is
■ Tom Ford By John Currin ■
considered oppressive when men do it to women. And that’s what gets you into trouble.
Ford:
I think that’s wrong. I’m
an equal-opportunity objectifier. I think it’s the exact same thing. I’m sorry, I don’t understand why our culture both worships and objectifies beauty, and then slams those of us who participate in it. Because I make that detachment, I’m capable of objectifying a beautiful woman, but that doesn’t demean her in any
a creature who exists physically, in the physical world, who happens to be in a moment of prime.
Currin: That would seem to be a theme of your fashion work: the complete freedom from guilt. Part of the fantasy of the ad campaigns—which I think Americans look at as a leisurely European playboy—
not really hampered by guilt or remorse or worried about the unhealthyaspects of their lifestyle.
Ford: This may sound corny, but the only thing I feel remorse about is when I hurt someone, hurt their feelings, or make them feel bad. I’m obsessive about that. “Oh, my god, did I say the wrong thing? Did I hurt them? Did they understand what I meant?” But the creation of visual images or design, I have no remorse
way. She’s beautiful because she’s
is the evocation of a person
anything, because I’m very happy
now composed of immigrants, our
with where I am and everything I’ve
culture as American really begins
done in my life. Everything that’s
with the landing of the Pilgrims
happened to me, I’ve learned a les-
and a puritanical view of things. It
do they see you as one of them?
son from—or if I didn’t, I was foolish,
was a group of people who escaped
Ford: I think the Italians feel like
and I will repeat the same thing and
Europe because they felt it was de-
I’m one of them. I think that’s be-
eventually, hopefully, I will learn a
praved in a certain way, and that
cause I resurrected a brand that was
lesson.
culture still permeates. I’ve lived in
very close to their hearts, and I lived
Currin: Do you think that is an
Europe for the last 20 years, so I’m
in Italy for a long time and speak
kind of a hybrid. I feel very American
Italian. The English, who knows? As
unusual trait among Americans?
in certain ways, and in lots of ways I
for the French, the first thing out of
Ford:
feel more European.
every French reviewer’s mouth was
Currin: How do Europeans feel
something about being an Ameri-
about you? Do they see you as
tic, which I think is very backward,
I think we’re very uptight
in America. You have to remember that we’re descended from Puritans. Whether or not the country is
30
over. I’m not somebody who regrets
a stereotypical American who’s hardworking and controlling, or
can. The French are very nationalis-
■ Tom Ford By John Currin ■
honestly. I think today you have to be international and global. It’s very narrow to think in a nationalistic way. Unfortunately, Americans do the same thing, because most Americans don’t even have a passport. They don’t travel.
an oxymoron. I wonder if it’s
Currin: [laughs] I’ve never
the same way for a designer.
seen it. I’ve never been there.
Ford:
Just remember that you’re
descended from Europeans. You’ve just grown up in this country. You can still call yourself a European who’s living in America.
Currin: I’m so envious of Europeans for their history, their painting ability, their style and aesthetic, and I sometimes think “American painter” is
Currin: Northern Irish. That’s not quite European . . .
Ford: Not continental . . .
Currin: It’s not Monte Carlo. Ford: That’s not one of my favorite places in Europe.
What I know of Monte Carlo is probably mostly informed by your advertisements.
Ford: That’s not what Monte Carlo is. It’s really a lot of people who are overly tanned and have too much collagen and too much money and diamonds that are too big.
Currin: It’s like Los Angeles. Ford: On steroids.
The End 31
Layout:Michał Wojciechowski