Pence, A. (2015). Leading Nonviolent Movements: An Interview with Srđa Popović. Solutions 6(5): 16–19. https://thesolutionsjournal.com/2015/5/leading-nonviolent-movements-an-interview-with-srda-popovic
Idea Lab Interview
Leading Nonviolent Movements: An Interview with Srða Popovic´ Interviewed by Audrey Pence
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n 1998, Srða Popovic´ helped to found the Serbian nonviolent resistance group, Otpor! Two years later, this nonviolent movement helped to remove Serbian dictator Slobodan Miloševic´ from power. In 2003, Popovic´ established the Centre for Applied Nonviolent Action (CANVAS). As Director, Popovic´ has worked with pro-democracy activists from more than 50 countries and has become an international leader in promoting and teaching principles for success in nonviolent resistance.
It’s been almost 15 years since the group Otpor! that you helped to lead overthrew Miloševic´ . Can you reflect on where Serbia is now and how it has developed for better or for worse since 2000? The general goal of the movement was to move the country towards Europe. Fifteen years after, I think these goals have become the mainstream of Serbian society and politics. I think we’ve progressed a lot in terms of interaction and democracy. The parties that are advocating approach to the European Union are representing 90 percent of the Serbian electorate. It is a lot slower than I would expect. All this was achieved in big part thanks to the first Serbian Prime Minister Zoran Đinðic´ , who took over after Miloševic´ and led the country until his assassination in 2003. If he had stayed alive, it would probably be a faster process. In your TED Talk “How to Topple a Dictator and the Rise of People Power,” you defined the principles of success
as “unity, nonviolent discipline, and planning.” How do each of those qualities affect the success of a nonviolent movement? Every single movement is different. But you will never win without the three principles—unity, planning, and nonviolent discipline. In Serbia, it was a political unity. There were 19 opposition parties with only
of participation. Not too many people will go to demonstrations where cars are burning and the windows are smashed. And part of the story is avoiding being affiliated with potentially violent groups. I see this happen over and over where you have a bunch of nonviolent organized people being overtaken by a few dozen people from super extreme groups.
Wherever you look, the most complicated types of unity that you achieve are also the most important ones. one Presidential candidate who ran against Miloševic´ in 2000. In the Arab world, it’s more like sectarian or religious unities. In some other cases, we are talking about the gender unity. Wherever you look, the most complicated types of unity that you achieve are also the most important ones. How you build the unity is how you build the joint vision for tomorrow. How you mobilize your potential allies is what very often distinguishes the movement between success and failure. The vision of tomorrow is just a daydream without clear planning on how to get there. The nonviolent discipline is self-explanatory. When you look at the research of Maria Stephan and Erica Chenoweth, you will find nonviolent movements in the last 100 years twice more successful than violent movements. And the reason for this is, of course, the level
16 | Solutions | September-October 2015 | www.thesolutionsjournal.org
You’ve advocated for using humor as a strategy. What advice do you have for the best way to utilize humor? And are there any times the use of humor can be detrimental to a cause? We were looking at a very specific use of humor. It’s not only jokes about the bad guys. It is designing a situation. The story we always use is the Serbian petrol bottle story where we painted the picture of Miloševic´ on the petrol bottle, and people had fun hitting it with a bat. Then, the police appeared and arrested the bottle. Humor breaks fear and apathy. And fear and apathy are, reportedly, the most important factors of status quo. Also, it’s very important to understand that humor is only one of the tools and that it should be the supplement to your grand strategy and the tactics you are taking. Otherwise, you can turn into the prankster.