Watchgeek archive 3 of invicta dubois fiasco

View Full Version : Dubois Depraz Movement?

bmaben 05-16-2010, 11:59 AM I am intrigued by this movement, but I have read some pretty poor reviews of it! I have read that it is expensive, difficult to service ($750.00 for a replacement), and not as reliable as the a workhorse such as the Valijoux 7750.

Is this worth the investment at any price? IMHO it would be better to invest in the 50 jewel Seiko Spring Drive . . .

I also have questions concerning Invictas quality issues. Will the Dubois Depraz be the white elephant in the room . . . with many going back for early servicing because they were not mounted correctly . . . or some other problem?

Flyback 05-16-2010, 12:19 PM I am intrigued by this movement, but I have read some pretty poor reviews of it!

Could you point us to a link?

Chief68 05-16-2010, 12:19 PM Expensive to replace I am sure it is due to it being so complex. In as far as the movement not being a work horse or not working properly anyone that I have ever spoke to absolutely loves it .

I bought one but if your not comfortable then don't buy it. :YES: tkromer 05-16-2010, 12:21 PM Very expensive to replace, DEFINITELY harder to service than a 7750, and also much more rare, impressive and all together interesting IMO. All movements barring some older Chinese pieces are pretty reliable, from the best Swiss to the "plainest" Chinese, they're all reliable. hobefabu 05-16-2010, 12:21 PM In todays economy we have learned not much is worth the investment unless you have some new old stock (ie) gold, diamonds and vintage watch movements. Manufacturers and distributers advertise things are worth much more than you are paying them for it and don't get me wrong sometimes it's true but most of the time it's not, so be careful and mind what and why you buy things. davidboy 05-16-2010, 12:35 PM Good post

In todays economy we have learned not much is worth the investment unless you have some new old stock (ie) gold, diamonds and vintage watch movements. Manufacturers and distributers advertise things are worth much more than you are paying them for it and don't get me wrong sometimes it's true but most of the time it's not, so be careful and mind what and why you buy things. reserveman 05-16-2010, 12:37 PM If it you don't think its worth it is different than this isn't the time to buy do to finances. If I could swing it I would. What confuses me is the blue was sold out now in limited quantitys what happened over night Flyback 05-16-2010, 12:38 PM If it you don't think its worth it is different than this isn't the time to buy do to finances. If I could swing it I would. What confuses me is the blue was sold out now in limited quantitys what happened over night Credit card kick backs. andyboy 05-16-2010, 12:43 PM If it you don't think its worth it is different than this isn't the time to buy do to finances. If I could swing it I would. What confuses me is the blue was sold out now in limited quantitys what happened over night Buyers think about that 1000.00 dollar price tag over nite, or get it from there wife an have cold feet on the purchace:):):) bpo 05-16-2010, 12:48 PM Burt, thanks asking this question. When I googled the DD module, I read similar concerns regarding service cost, and that a number of horologists won't do work on them (presumably due to the skill and experience required). The caveat here is these were mainly other forum posts, so clearly opinion and not necessarily truth. I'm interested in Mr. Horology's opinion.

Johnjr 05-16-2010, 12:54 PM Hi Burt I did a Google on the Movement and I could only find some negative views from individuals expressing their opinion and so far I couldn't find anything but Good about the Movement, Please let me know where you found the Info that I may be missing, I just pulled the pin on the Silver and it's not to late to Cancel, Thanks. emathieu 05-16-2010, 12:56 PM

These movements with the DD module are definitely more expensive to service, and only very good watchmakers can service them (and lots just end up shipping them out to DD for service, which is more times than not a full replacement). That said, I have not heard of many issues with these modules at all, and I wouldn't advise that anyone let that discourage them if they want this particular watch with this wonderful movement.

I'm personally passing, but that is simply due to the fact that I am not a Speedway guy (way too close to a Daytona for me). Even with that said, I was tempted to purchase one for a while as this is a serious deal for a watch with that movement. buddah00 05-16-2010, 01:01 PM I pulled the trigger on the silver tone mainly for the movement. I want to have a little of everything in my collection and I doubt I will ever have a chance to get this movement at a price this low again.

If I am wrong so be it but I am happy with the price compared to others with this movement. hobefabu 05-16-2010, 01:01 PM Look at the quote below from Mehdi (Mr Horology) concerning the Dubois Depraz movement.

It's a very special movement for sure. It's a base ETA 2892A2 with the Dubois Depraz chronograph module attached dial side. In my opinion, this movement is much more special then even a ETA Valjoux 7751. Jim also just said this would be under a grand, a steal for this movement IMO...

Mr Horology 05-16-2010, 01:04 PM In my opinion, being a Watchmaker myself, I don't find them any harder to service then a Valjoux 7750 or 7751. I have serviced two of them before, and they were no problem for me. Yes they do cost more to service, and to replace if needed, that is a fact. I have not heard many issues with these modules though.

Johnjr 05-16-2010, 01:12 PM Case Closed, hobefabu 05-16-2010, 01:13 PM Thanks for chiming in Mehdi.

Mr Horology 05-16-2010, 01:17 PM

These movements with the DD module are definitely more expensive to service, and only very good watchmakers can service them (and lots just end up shipping them out to DD for service, which is more times than not a full replacement). That said, I have not heard of many issues with these modules at all, and I wouldn't advise that anyone let that discourage them if they want this particular watch with this wonderful movement.

I'm personally passing, but that is simply due to the fact that I am not a Speedway guy (way too close to a Daytona for me). Even with that said, I was tempted to purchase one for a while as this is a serious deal for a watch with that movement.

Only very good Watchmakers can service Mechanical or Mechanical automatic chronograph movements period. If a Watchmaker can not service this type of chronograph with an attached module, then he would not be able to service any type of Mechanical or Mechanical automatic chronograph. All these movements are more difficult to service, but if you know what your doing, then it's very simple. bpo 05-16-2010, 01:18 PM Thanks Mehdi!

In my opinion, being a Watchmaker myself, I don't find them any harder to service then a Valjoux 7750 or 7751. I have serviced two of them before, and they were no problem for me. Yes they do cost more to service, and to replace if needed, that is a fact. I have not heard many issues with these modules though. jskelton 05-16-2010, 01:33 PM 1) Of course it is expensive to replace... it's an expensive movement. Whomever wrote that in a review as a bad thing needs to realize how dumb that sounded 2) The V7750 is the notoriously difficult movement to repair, as well as one of the most expensive auto Swiss movements to repair. This has not prevented any of us from buying one.

Enjoy your new watch... don't over-think it. nycruza 05-16-2010, 01:36 PM Only very good Watchmakers can service Mechanical or Mechanical automatic chronograph movements period. If a Watchmaker can not service this type of chronograph with a attached module, then he would not be able to service any type of Mechanical or Mechanical automatic chronograph. All these movements are more difficult to service, but if you know what your doing, then it's very simple.

And therein lies the problem.

In today's world, the "ART" of the watchmaker is slowly disappearing. Once was the time that every jeweler (in the US) had in their shop a watchmaker that could fix the vast majority of movements. Now most places send them out or think watchmaking is swapping a movement or replacing a battery.

Didn't anyone find it odd that the complaint was expensive to "replace" rather then the word "service"? Shows the mind set.

So sad :( Thanks Mehdi!

Mr Horology 05-16-2010, 01:38 PM And therein lies the problem.

In today's world, the "ART" of the watchmaker is slowly disappearing. Once was the time that every jeweler (in the US) had in their shop a watchmaker that could fix the vast majority of movements. Now most places send them out or think watchmaking is swapping a movement or replacing a battery.

Didn't anyone find it odd that the complaint was expensive to "replace" rather then the word "service"? Shows the mind set.

So sad :( Thanks Mehdi!

Yeah that's the way it is mostly today, it's about how they can replace it because they don't know how to repair it. garyh 05-16-2010, 01:44 PM thanks for the info mehdi. emathieu 05-16-2010, 01:46 PM Only very good Watchmakers can service Mechanical or Mechanical automatic chronograph movements period. If a Watchmaker can not service this type of chronograph with an attached module, then he would not be able to service any type of Mechanical or Mechanical automatic chronograph. All these movements are more difficult to service, but if you know what your doing, then it's very simple.

Agreed. Unfortunately it seems that there are now more "watch mechanics" than watchmakers around. I've discovered that in a lot of cases, the person we think is servicing or repairing our watches are actually sending them out to someone like you, and simply marking up the service price above what the real watchmaker is charging him. This is why I have a huge amount of respect for the real watchmakers that are left. :) Mr Horology 05-16-2010, 01:50 PM Agreed. Unfortunately it seems that there are now more "watch mechanics" than watchmakers around. I've discovered that in a lot of cases, the person we think is servicing or repairing our watches are actually sending them out to someone like you, and simply marking up the service price above what the real watchmaker is charging him. This is why I have a huge amount of respect for the real watchmakers that are left. :)

Yeah, I know a few guys who do that and charge the customer double.

It's sad, but they can get away with it. But there are still a hand full of real good Watchmakers out there, but they sometime are not easy to find.

Horsetrack 05-16-2010, 01:52 PM And yes. Good things and cars cost to own and or service. Not sure??? Buy a casio GeorgeTheWatchGuy 05-16-2010, 03:08 PM All I am going to say is, I own 3 watches from three different watch companies with this module in them... I have owned these watches for over 3 to 5 years now... I don't know who wrote the review that is mentioned in this thread, but I can attest to the reliability & accuracy of my watches, with this IMHO, trouble free module in them... :YES: Sure it will cost more, if you have to replace this module.. It is a very high end product... If that is a problem for someone, then they should stay away from the high end watches that come with this module in them...

BTW, I've read some excellent reviews about watches with this module in them.... ;) AWOZ 05-16-2010, 03:19 PM Thanks to all! I just pulled the trigger on the s tone. I bought it for the movement only. I want it in my collection.:YES: Flyback 05-16-2010, 03:41 PM All I am going to say is, I own 3 watches from three different watch companies with this module in them... I have owned these watches for over 3 to 5 years now... I don't know who wrote the

review that is mentioned in this thread, but I can attest to the reliability & accuracy of my watches, with this IMHO, trouble free module in them... :YES: Sure it will cost more, if you have to replace this module.. It is a very high end product... If that is a problem for someone, then they should stay away from the high end watches that come with this module in them...

BTW, I've read some excellent reviews about watches with this module in them.... ;) If it's good enough for my knowledgeable friend George, it's good enough for me! wave3214 05-16-2010, 03:59 PM all high end movements are expensive to have worked on. take a submariner to be cleaned oiled and adjusted and your looking at 500 at least. nature of the beast.

RoyalOak 05-16-2010, 04:03 PM In my opinion, being a Watchmaker myself, I don't find them any harder to service then a Valjoux 7750 or 7751. I have serviced two of them before, and they were no problem for me. Yes they do cost more to service, and to replace if needed, that is a fact. I have not heard many issues with these modules though.

Mehdi, that's good enough for me.

Bahoomba 05-16-2010, 04:07 PM Isn't the Dubois Dupraz just a chrono movement that's just a kissing cousin of the more widely used Swiss ETA movement? I'm confused as to what makes this so special. I'm not trying to be argumentative, but...I can't understand the big whoop. I do understand it's an expensive movement that's been used by a handful of top brands, but what makes it better? I'm sure someone like Jim knows all the why's and what for's.

CLEANS-HIGH 05-16-2010, 04:16 PM If I wasn't paying off some older bills I would grab one it seems like a great deal to me Oh well, maybe next time Brant 05-16-2010, 04:35 PM I would like to have one as well but need to get a few things finished up before the next big buy, Congrats to all that got one and enjoy the new baby!!!

Mr Horology 05-16-2010, 04:55 PM

Isn't the Dubois Dupraz just a chrono movement that's just a kissing cousin of the more widely used Swiss ETA movement? I'm confused as to what makes this so special. I'm not trying to be argumentative, but...I can't understand the big whoop. I do understand it's an expensive movement that's been used by a handful of top brands, but what makes it better? I'm sure someone like Jim knows all the why's and what for's.

The D/D is not a movement, it's a Chronograph module which is attached to a base movement. In the case of the Speedway, it's a base ETA 2892A2 which then has the D/D Chronograph module attached to it. Whats makes this so special is, only very high end watch manufactures use them and you don't see them very often, which is what makes it so rare. I also feel with the the ETA 2892A2 it's a bit more accurate out of the box (At least in my experiences) valmont33 05-16-2010, 05:56 PM When I was in Vegas (at a very high end watch store) picking up my Breitling 6.75 speed (http://watchgeeks.net/showthread.php?t=87596) I noticed 2 Maurice Lacroix watches in one of the cases. I asked the manager about them and he said that the owner of the store got rid of almost all of the Maurice Lacroix because they had some major problems with the movements (they used A LOT of Dubois Depraz mods).

This was about the time Shop/WOW started selling a bunch of Maurice Lacroix watches and Maurice Lacroix announced they will be making and modifying their own movements. bigwatchking1 05-16-2010, 06:08 PM buy the watch,,,,,sometimes you gotta go with your gut feelin,,,,will only inhance your collection,,, strutn45 05-16-2010, 06:11 PM All I am going to say is, I own 3 watches from three different watch companies with this module in them... I have owned these watches for over 3 to 5 years now... I don't know who wrote the review that is mentioned in this thread, but I can attest to the reliability & accuracy of my watches, with this IMHO, trouble free module in them... :YES: Sure it will cost more, if you have to replace this module.. It is a very high end product... If that is a problem for someone, then they should stay away from the high end watches that come with this module in them...

BTW, I've read some excellent reviews about watches with this module in them.... ;) Thanks buddy, you pushed me over the fence...i just pulled the trigger on the silvertone....YOWZA!!! :YES:

Sun Dial 05-16-2010, 06:11 PM Argument is done for me. If Mr. Horology says something about a movement then I am listening.

SeaVulture 05-16-2010, 06:19 PM KUMBAYAH!!

The movement alone is worth the total price of the watch.

For those who can appreciate this movement, it is a no-brainer to buy for the movement alone.

I'm hoping as many of you, that can, will buy this watch.

You'll not be the least bit sorry.

I have a 2894-2 in my Sea Vulture. It might be considered the sister to this movement.

It is a treasure.

I can't wait to get one of these.

Blade 05-16-2010, 06:20 PM When I was in Vegas (at a very high end watch store) picking up my Breitling 6.75 speed (http://watchgeeks.net/showthread.php?t=87596) I noticed 2 Maurice Lacroix watches in one of the cases. I asked the manager about them and he said that the owner of the store got rid of almost all of the Maurice Lacroix because they had some major problems with the movements (they used A LOT of Dubois Depraz mods).

This was about the time Shop/WOW started selling a bunch of Maurice Lacroix watches and Maurice Lacroix announced they will be making and modifying their own movements.

I haven't pulled the trigger on the TTV Speedway yet, but am close. Your post adds hesitation.

Thanks for the input Paul. valmont33 05-16-2010, 06:29 PM I haven't pulled the trigger yet, but an close. Your posts adds hesitation. Thanks for the input.

No problem. It was shocking to hear and even the manager said he was bumbed because he really like the design of the Maurice Lacroix watches. It is the reason Idid not purchase a big date Maurice Lacroix from WOW when it was 82% off. strutn45 05-16-2010, 06:33 PM All I am going to say is, I own 3 watches from three different watch companies with this module in them... I have owned these watches for over 3 to 5 years now... I don't know who wrote the review that is mentioned in this thread, but I can attest to the reliability & accuracy of my watches, with this IMHO, trouble free module in them... :YES:

Sure it will cost more, if you have to replace this module.. It is a very high end product... If that is a problem for someone, then they should stay away from the high end watches that come with this module in them...

BTW, I've read some excellent reviews about watches with this module in them.... ;) I haven't pulled the trigger on the TTV Speedway yet, but am close. Your post adds hesitation.

Thanks for the input Paul.

Did you read George's post, from someone who owns three.

Plus being a Reserve piece a automatic five year warranty. :D Mr Horology 05-16-2010, 06:44 PM When I was in Vegas (at a very high end watch store) picking up my Breitling 6.75 speed (http://watchgeeks.net/showthread.php?t=87596) I noticed 2 Maurice Lacroix watches in one of the cases. I asked the manager about them and he said that the owner of the store got rid of almost all of the Maurice Lacroix because they had some major problems with the movements (they used A LOT of Dubois Depraz mods).

This was about the time Shop/WOW started selling a bunch of Maurice Lacroix watches and Maurice Lacroix announced they will be making and modifying their own movements.

That was a different module, and if I remember it was a very small issue.

I still think this movement is wonderful, it has nothing to do with the brand or style for me here. Most of the watches I buy, i base my choice solely on the movement and I feel this movement is special. strutn45 05-16-2010, 06:47 PM That was a different module, and if I remember it was a very small issue.

I still think this movement is wonderful, it has nothing to do with the brand or style for me here. Most of the watches I buy, i base my choice solely on the movement and I feel this movement is special.

Thanks buddy for clearing that up. :D Blade 05-16-2010, 06:49 PM That was a different module, and if I remember it was a very small issue.

I still think this movement is wonderful, it has nothing to do with the brand or style for me here. Most of the watches I buy, i base my choice solely on the movement and I feel this movement is special.

Thanks Mehdi.

Mr Horology 05-16-2010, 07:02 PM BTW, a large user of the D/D 2021 was Hublot.

Trust me, they wouldn't have used it if it was crap strutn45 05-16-2010, 07:04 PM BTW, a large user of the D/D 2021 was Hublot.

Trust me, they wouldn't have used it if it was crap Thats what i'm talkin' about. :pals: Stingray 05-16-2010, 07:06 PM Mehdi reading your posts are always very informative! :salute: Neil 05-16-2010, 07:15 PM I don't care how hard it is to fix, a great combination and I just had to have the Silver version. I missed out on the earlier offer with the 7750. This one is even better.

NICE JOB EYAL!!

Neil Bahoomba 05-16-2010, 07:23 PM Flyback Just Google..I mean, heavens, it just pops right up... dr foose 05-16-2010, 07:25 PM love the two tone wish i could afford it right now.... please why does everybody think about price to value so much the best cost the most thats why a ferrari has a 4500 tune up and a 800 oil change and a tauras is ten bucks to change the oil jeez people.... id love to have this movement and i appreciate a new movement in the mix if you dont want this movement go get a g10 or a sw200 not to knock um i got plenty of both but jesh i saw this and thought breath of fresh air...

Flyback 05-16-2010, 07:26 PM Flyback, If we can Google, you can Google too....

That's the point, I have Googled, and I'm pretty damn good at it. There's nothing there . . . nadda . . . zippo . . . null set . . . etc.

Runnin' Ute 05-16-2010, 07:29 PM I wish I had $1000 lyin' around because I would have pulled the trigger. Don't really care for the combat, but either of the other two would have been great. (and since I became a more active collector I haven't spent over $100.) The only time I have spent as much as $180 was for a faux Submariner back in January 2005.