Mad About the Boy
ION Arizona Tumbles 4 Boy George
By Deon Brown
ION: Do I call you Boy? Do I call you Mr. George? What do you prefer?
George: George is good. Some people call me Boy.
ION: I’ve explained to some of my younger friends that they just really have no idea how Boy George really lit the world on fire; your look, your style. Nowadays there is such gender fluidity and people being who they want to be. I know that there were others, too, there’s Ziggy Stardust, Quentin Crisp – how does that make you feel knowing that you really kind of started the ball rolling?
George: Listen, it’s lovely, but I don’t really think about the past too much. (laughs) I mean, it’s different now. It’s everywhere now. I think one of the most fascinating things about me
actually, when I look back at my childhood and the people that influenced me, ironically, a lot of them were straight men. David Bowie, Marc Bolan, Steve Harley, obviously Quentin Crisp – but Quentin Crisp was apologetic about being gay. I think what was interesting is that someone like David Bowie, who was essentially a straight man or bisexual, whatever, but his message was so important to me. And then I think about people like Marc Bolan, who’s also another one of my glam rock heroes and they were less apologetic than gay people.
I suppose it’s easier for a straight person to be gay than it is for a gay person, particularly in rock and roll. Because if you’re just pretending, people are cool with it. You don’t really mean it. You’re like a wrestler or a circus performer. You’re not really gay. My thing was, although yes, of course Bowie and Marc Bolan were both people who were important to me, my generation grew up in the years when homosexuality had been legalized. There was a sort of freedom and we didn’t have to apologize. As much as I loved Quentin Crisp, I never agreed with this kind of apologetic stance on being gay. He said it was the worst thing in the world to be born gay. Whereas even at 14, once I realized I was gay, I never kind of felt sad about it. I’m not one of those queens who wished I was straight. I never have.
In a way, I was lucky to be born in the time that I was, but also my family as well. Although I come from a sort of working class Irish family, my family were kind of supportive. When I did finally come out, they weren’t particularly surprised, but they were supportive in a way that a lot of parents aren’t. They didn’t want to talk about it, you know what I mean? It wasn’t discussed over dinner, but they didn’t turn on me. They loved me and they supported me. In my mum’s case, she kind of encouraged me. She used to make clothes for me. It’s so different now because people, obviously, they’ve got the iPhones and the computers, and they’ve got access to things like RuPaul’s Drag Race. If you’re a young gay kid, that must be insane to see all that on TV. When I was growing up, we had, I don’t know if you know who Danny La Rue is? Well, you should Google him because he was quite phenomenal. He was this very famous drag queen that was on British TV in the ‘70s. He was a huge star and he used to dress up as a woman, but he used to call himself a “fe-man impersonator.” He never called himself a drag queen, but he was a drag queen. I grew up with that.
(singing) “He waltzes in to the West End shops. Waltzes again between two cops, she’s Fanlight Fanny the frowzy nightclub queen.” It’s hilarious!
ION: I am a happy man! I can tell everybody that Boy George sang to me! Just for me!
George: Danny La Rue, was very posh and he was just this incredible character. One funny story I’ll tell you: this is a really interesting story and I only realized this when I was writing my book. Jon Moss’s father had a clothing store in London. He knew Danny La Rue because Danny got his suits there. The day we got our Grammy, we were in this TV studio with Joan Rivers and Jon and I were fighting. And at one point, Danny La Rue, this famous entertainer, walked in in full drag, walked up to Jon Moss and kissed him on the cheek, and I was literally flabbergasted. I was like, “How the fuck do you know Danny La Rue?” And he was like, “Well, my dad’s friends with him.” I think the reason I said on the Grammys, “Thank you, America. You know a good drag queen,” was because I had that encounter with Danny La Rue that day. Why else would I have said it? It was just such a flippant thing to say. I don’t regret saying it, but I think, I feel like I must’ve just seen him and gone (*gasps*). He was really a big household star, one of the biggest stars in the entire country. So him having walked up and kissed Jon Moss – and not me, I’m serious! (laughs)
ION: Great Britain comes from a heritage of music hall performance and what we call “drag.” America was just terrified of it.
George: We had so many. Danny La Rue, Dick Emery, Larry Grayson. There were so many, but still, they weren’t out in the open. I mean, yeah, I guess in show business, they were known to be gay. And of course, my parents knew they were gay, but I called the ‘70s the kind of a “don’t frighten the horses” sort of decade. People knew that people were gay, but they didn’t want to discuss it. “We don’t talk about it,” which is very British. Also, it was just very much how people were at that time. When I was 16, if you wanted to go somewhere gay, you have to get on a train. You couldn’t just turn on your phone and meet someone or watch a drag queen performing or whatever. You had to go and find the underground. You had to dig through the undergrowth to find it.
Now, it’s a totally different thing. Sometimes I get frustrated. I wish the underground was still the underground. You know what I mean? But I think that’s just me.
I think there’s some things that – it’s not necessarily that people shouldn’t know – but there’s a lot of things they can’t cope with. A lot of the problems that we have at the moment are down to the fact that people are overstimulated. They had no idea that there were so many drag queens and so many trans people and so many this and so many that. Everyone has a platform. Everyone has their windows open and their curtains blowing in the wind, and everybody feels like they need to tell everyone every single thing about themselves, often before they’ve really worked out who they are themselves. If you went to therapy, no therapist would say, “This is what you should do. Go and tell everybody in the world.”
If you’ve got mental health issues, if you’ve got this, if you’ve got that – I don’t mean about being gay. I don’t see gay as something as an illness, but people just go and spill their guts on the internet with no care. No one’s looking after them. Not everybody can cope with it. Then they have to deal with the backlash of people who are fearful and ignorant and frightened. It’s a lot of energy being expelled every second. It must be overwhelming. Not for me, because I’m a little bit of a voyeur. I like to sit back and watch it all. I go on the internet, I watch those shows, but I’m not a clubber anymore unless I’m working. I’m always being creative now, I’m in my art studio or I’m at the studio recording or I’m on tour. I’m always doing something creative, rather than sort of just hanging out in clubs.
ION: With the experience that you have in your professional creative life, was there any collaboration that you would’ve liked to have seen happen with another artist that never happened?
George: The obvious one would’ve been Bowie. That would’ve been insane. About a year ago, I did a collaboration with Pete Murphy from Bauhaus; I don’t know when
it’s coming out. He’s kind of hanging onto it at the moment. I’ve done a track with him called, “Let the Flowers Grow,” which is beautiful. In terms of collaboration, I always find them quite difficult because a lot of the time, they’re sort of commercially based rather than creatively based. People do it because it’s good for their careers. They don’t necessarily do it because they love the other artists or they’ve got something in common. A lot of the time it’s like, “Oh, this is good for business.”
People are always saying to me, “You should work with this one …” They’re young. It’s always the same thing you hear all the time. I’m happy to work with anyone of any age, but I don’t like that idea of you should work with someone young. They’ll revive your career. It’s like, “Oh, fuck off!” (laughs)
ION: Your look and style has always been evolving. Of your own personal looks and styles of your history, which one was your favorite? Is there one that you look back on and think that was a miss?
George: I often look back and think, “Who let me leave the house dressed like that?” (laughs) Obviously, when I was a kid, I didn’t care because it was all about being provocative. It’s a funny thing with career, when you’re in the public eye and you’re being kind of judged on what you wear and stuff. Honestly, I really promise you, I prefer people not to talk about what I’m wearing. When somebody says, “What are you wearing?” I’m like, “Can’t you see?” because often when they ask you that question, what they mean is, “What designer are you wearing?” I don’t really wear designer clothes. I mean, I’m more of a stylist than a fashionista. I much prefer to make my own things. I much prefer to wear something that nobody else has got. So I’m more about creativity. But obviously, my classic, little Culture Club look with the braids and the hat, that stood the test of time. People wear it to Halloween. I often see it pop up. I mean, at the moment, it’s in Despicable Me. It’s an advert in the UK. It’s hilarious! I mean, people get it terribly wrong. (laughs)
ION: I’m glad that you’re still creating music.
George: In the last two years, I’ve released about 54 tracks. If you go on Spotify. One of the questions I get asked on a daily basis is, “Are you still grafting?” It’s an English term like “working” because we’ve got a very strange attitude towards celebrity and fame. If you’re not on the TV every five minutes or on the news or in the press, people just think you’re sitting at home listening to “Karma Chameleon.” When I start having conversations with people, I feel like I’m having to explain who I am. Often I just say
to people, “I’ve retired.”And then I get on with whatever I’m doing because I’m always working. I’m always touring. I never stop because I really enjoy working.
ION: You just finished four months in Moulin Rouge on Broadway. How was your experience?
George: Absolutely fantastic! I had the most beautiful time, but I think that was because when I did Taboo, obviously, I was an entirely different human being. In n terms of my kind of thinking about what I was doing – I was a very different person. In the last 20 years I’ve evolved a lot – in the way I work, the way I behave. Moulin Rouge was just amazing. I did 112 shows. I got an award certificate for attending and I turned around to the cast and I said, “This makes up for school.”(laughs)
One of the great things for me is that I do have this reputation that kind of dances ahead of me and it’s so not who I am. It’s quite fun to dispel that when people meet you and they’re like, (*gasps*) “You’re really nice! You’re really friendly!” because people think I’m an über bitch. I mean, I can be and I think that was more to do with what society was like all those years ago, what the press was like, what people used to say about you, and you were constantly under scrutiny and abuse. I guess I was reacting to that. I wish I knew then what I know now, in terms of being in control of my thinking and my reactions. I like your questions, by the way. They’re good. It’s rare.
ION: Should I ask typical questions like, “Who did you write, ‘I’ll Tumble 4 Ya’ about?
George: It’s funny, I’ve got a new song called “Fell Over,” which is funny because actually I wrote it six months ago. I guess it’s a grown up version of “I’ll Tumble 4 Ya” which I’m doing in the show. It’s really rock-y and it’s really fun. It’s funny because I think “I’ll Tumble 4 Ya” … “I Fell Over” – they feel like they’re related in some ways. (laughs)
ION: What is the best part of being Boy George?
George: Personally, now, I kind of understand that I have a responsibility to ‘Boy George,’ which might sound lunatic. I don’t mean that Boy George is a separate person, but how I’m treated when I’m in my civvies and how I’m treated when I’m in Boy George sort of clothing – it’s entirely different. People are very different, literally, from one second to the next. You can go into a TV station, you’re in your civvies, you get your
gear on, suddenly you’re treated entirely differently. So it’s almost like you have to kind of adjust your behavior in a way, to how people treat you when they don’t know who you are. It’s hilarious!
I enjoy being Boy George more than I used to. I understand that it’s something I’ve created and it’s not a separate character, but being ‘Boy George’ comes with a responsibility; I’m nicer now. (laughs) I’m nicer to myself. I’m nicer to other people.
If I was going to say to anyone, “What have I learned?” I think I’ve learned that happiness is in the mundane. It’s not really the big stuff; it’s the stuff that happens when you’re doing the big stuff: the laughter, the fun, the getting ready, meeting people, going out for a beautiful meal. They say the devil is in the details. Well, I think joy is in the mundane. Sometimes you wait around for something big to happen before you’re happy. One of the bad things about fame, is that you get locked into this kind of ritual of, “Oh, I’m no good if I’m not on the radio,” or “I’m no good if I’m not this. I’m no good if I’m not that.”
And learning to have fun, whatever you’re doing. I’ll give you an example. In the old days before I went on stage, I was always very fraught. There was always tension and I didn’t want anyone in the dressing room. There’s all so many rules and regulations and now I just don’t have that. I’m like, “Yeah, come in! Yeah, whatever.” I’m dedicated to enjoying myself, whether it’s being on stage or getting ready to go on stage or after, whatever it may be. I’ve stopped giving myself a hard time.
ION: You’ve had your share of ups and downs; although this word is bandied about way too much ... you’re a survivor. You’ve had some difficult, welldocumented experiences and you come out on top. I’m not trying to be gushy, but you’ve really proven what you can do when you put your mind to it.
George: I remember Princess Diana saying that to me across the lunch table, “Do you know what? You are a survivor.” I remember thinking, “I don’t want to be.” There were times in the past when – I say this in “Karma Chameleon,” – ‘Every day is like survival.’ But these days, I don’t feel like that at all. I put a lot of energy into being happy just having fun with what I do. I don’t know if you know who Alan Watts is, he’s an amazing philosopher and he really preaches that life is not serious. That it’s about having fun and sort of enjoying what you do and enjoying your friends and enjoying your family and just enjoying, – in my case – being who I am and doing all the amazing things that I get to do. I just try not to do it with a grumpy face now. (laughs)
ION: I have one last question for you. If you were a superhero, what would your super power be? Don’t just say, “Oh, be invisible, be able to fly. Try to think ... using your experience with Boy George.
George: I’m a little bit of a hippie. I’d want to cure starvation and poverty and homelessness, and just the idea of people being without somewhere to live. In London, sometimes you walk around and you just think, “God, there’s people in tents and there’s people on the streets” and it just seems so crazy. In a country like the UK where you just go, “Wow, why is this happening?” So I think I’d want to do something that matters; of course, I’d love to be invisible! (laughs) Wouldn’t we all love to do that or to hear through walls and stuff? But I feel like doing good stuff, I think I’d want to be a superhero that was a bit of a saviour – not just be able to walk through walls.
ION: I told several people I was interviewing you and everyone’s, like, “Tell him I love him!”
George: Beautiful. Well, tell them I love them back. Thank you!
Boy George will perform with the UK band Squeeze on Sunday, August 25 at 7:30 p.m. at the Celebrity Theatre, 440 N. 32nd St. in Phoenix. For tickets visit CelebrityTheatre.com or call 602-267-1600
VIP Tickets with Meet ’n’ Greet are available.
