Eileen Ingham and Jennifer Nichols discuss people who inspired them

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Eileen Ingham and Jennifer Nichols meet to discuss the men and women who inspired them

Medical immunologist Eileen Ingham and developmental biologist Jennifer Nichols have never met before. Their respective achievements in regenerative medicine have brought them WRJHWKHU :KLOH WKHLU VSHFL¿F GLVFLSOLQHV SODFH them in somewhat different communities, in conversation it becomes apparent that they share similar experiences and views on women in science and why there aren’t more at the top of the academic ladder.

Eileen Ingham investigates repair of the body’s complex machinery at the University of Leeds. Using novel tissue engineering technology she develops techniques to patch up blood vessels in a bid to tackle cardiovascular disease. Her work explores the immune system’s reaction to various manmade substances, with the aim of developing superior materials for prosthetic joint replacements.

Prosthetics and stem cell biology both form part of WKH¿HOGRIUHJHQHUDWLYHPHGLFLQH8QGHUVWDQGLQJ stem cells is paramount to yielding their restorative properties. Jennifer Nichols, based at the Wellcome Trust-Medical Research Council Stem Cell Institute, probes how stem cells are assigned in the embryo researching ways to replicate this in the lab. Her investigations have yielded a technique to generate stem cells, which Eileen Ingham

could reduce the number of mice used in research to study diseases such as diabetes.

Biological Beginnings

Both Eileen and Jenny’s love of science developed early, nurtured in environments at home and DW VFKRRO ZKHUH JHQGHU ZDV QHYHU DQ LVVXH ³, can’t ever remember being discouraged at all. I was encouraged by family, encouraged by my teachers at school, it was always very positive,”

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Rosa Beddington was a wonderful woman and a brilliant scientist. I still miss her

Jennifer Nichols

VD\V(LOHHQ³,ZDVLQVSLUHGPRVWE\P\ELRORJ\ teacher Ms Morris. I don’t think I ever knew KHU¿UVWQDPH, MXVWUHDOO\HQMR\HGP\ELRORJ\ lessons and was fascinated by the subject.”

Jenny’s formative years were also inspired by ELRORJ\EXWWKURXJKOHVVRQVLQWKH¿HOGRUUDWKHU LQWKLVFDVHWKHEHDFK³0\IDWKHULVDELRORJLVW and all of our holidays were spent somewhere near the sea. I like swimming but don’t care for sunbathing, so I’d be running around after Dad picking up stones and looking under them. I always used to collect things, bring them home and put them in jars, something Dad encouraged but my mother absolutely hated. I once found a leech sticking to me while paddling so I put it in a jar. And then it had babies. I was so excited but P\PRWKHUZDVDEVROXWHO\KRUUL¿HG0\LQWHUHVWLQ embryology grew from that, really.”

Motivating Mentors

Developmental biologist Richard Gardner gave Jenny the freedom to pursue her natural curiosity DV D UHVHDUFK DVVLVWDQW LQ KLV ODE ³+H GLG UHDOO\ beautiful work putting cells into early embryos and watching them develop.” It was here that she met a young Rosa Beddington, who had just embarked RQ KHU 3K' ZLWK *DUGQHU ³6KH ZDV LQVSLUDWLRQDO and really, really encouraging. Rosa invited me to go and work at Cold Spring Harbor on a course, which introduced me to a lot of people whose work I had read.”

Beddington conducted seminal work on embryo development before her career was cut short by FDQFHU 6KH LGHQWL¿HG D QRYHO RUJDQLVLQJ FHQWUH from which instructions are sent out to direct patterns of embryonic development. Beddington’s fortitude and skill as a scientist left a lasting LPSUHVVLRQRQ-HQQ\³6KHZDVSUREDEO\WKHVLQJOH

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All my PhD students have been girls. It’s about staying in, not getting in

JUHDWHVW LQÀXHQFH RQ P\ GHFLVLRQV , VWLOO PLVV her. She was a wonderful woman and a brilliant scientist.”

According to Jenny there are no shortage of strong IHPDOHUROHPRGHOVLQGHYHORSPHQWDOELRORJ\³,W¶V the one branch of science where women almost dominate. I’ve never felt discriminated against.” In contrast Eileen remembers during her early career that it wasn’t uncommon to be the only woman in a staff meeting. Everybody was always WUHDWHG HTXDOO\ WKRXJK VKH DGPLWV ³%HLQJ WKH Faculty’s only female amid male academics can be an advantage sometimes. People feel that they shouldn’t be putting on you because you’re the only woman.”

Guiding Eileen through her career were several noted male scientists. After her undergraduate degree in biochemistry and microbiology, Gerald Gowland became both her PhD and post-doctoral supervisor. Gowland regaled Eileen with stories IURPKLVSDVW³,ZDVIDVFLQDWHGWRKHDUDERXWKLV work with Nobel laureate Peter Medawar, and felt privileged to have a supervisor who had worked with a Nobel Prize-winning scientist. That really kept me motivated.” Medawar’s medical legacy – the basis of immune rejection in tissue grafts – facilitates organ transplants to this day.

Gender Roles

When it comes to the art of conducting good science, both women scientists feel gender has little HIIHFW³,GRQ¶WWKLQNWKHUHLVDJHQGHUGLIIHUHQFH, think there are differences between scientists and their varying motivations,” suggests Eileen. They attribute the lack of women at the top to their choosing to opt out and better manage family lives. ³$OOP\3K'VWXGHQWVH[FHSWRQHKDYHEHHQJLUOV It’s more about staying in, than getting in,” feels Jenny.

1HLWKHU KDYH FKLOGUHQ ³3HUKDSV WKDW WHOOV \RX VRPHWKLQJ´ ODXJKV (LOHHQ ³,¶YH JUDGXDWHG something like 60 PhD students now, and probably more than half are girls. The life choices they make beyond that are entirely up to them. One of the problems, especially in biological science and engineering, is that things move so quickly. If you WDNHWLPHRXWWRKDYHDIDPLO\LW¶VYHU\GLI¿FXOWWR be able to catch up on the new knowledge that has been published during that time.” For those who VXFFHVVIXOO\QDYLJDWHEDFNWRVFLHQFHWKHEHQH¿WV DUHFOHDU³7KHUHDUHIHZFDUHHUVZKHUH\RXFDQWUXO\ enjoy what you do day-to-day. When things work and you make new discoveries, it’s absolutely fantastic.”

³,KDYHVXSHUYLVHGDERXW3K'WKHVHVQRZDQGWKH\ represent most of my life’s effort in research.”

Eileen Ingham

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When you make new discoveries, it’s absolutely fantastic

Future Predictions

The enthusiasm for research that both Eileen and Jenny share is balanced by a sense of UHVSRQVLELOLW\³:H¶UHXVLQJSXEOLFPRQH\VRSHRSOH should expect to get something out of us,” Jenny remarks. Her research is becoming decidedly translational – although perhaps too quickly. ³7KHUH¶V D ORW RI SUHVVXUH RQ XV WRPDNH WKLQJV that we can actually transplant into patients. We’re going to lose some of the basic biology – understanding about how things really work and what can go wrong. We should be translational, but there should be a balance.” Eileen hopes that repairing tissues such as blood vessels, ligaments and cartilage will rely less on D FHOOXODU DSSURDFK LQ WKH IXWXUH ³1HZ DYHQXHV of basic research that we cannot even begin to imagine yet will open up in the coming decades. 30 years ago epigenetics was unheard of. It’s now becoming very important. We owe it to society to FRQVLGHUKRZRXUVFLHQFHFDQLQÀXHQFHSHRSOHDQG EULQJ FOLQLFDO EHQH¿W +RZHYHU WKRVH DW WKH WRS of their game still need to be allowed to pursue curiosity-driven research because there’s a lot of fundamental knowledge we still don’t have. Keeping a balance is critical.”

³7R PH PRXQWDLQV V\PEROLVH effort and reward, but apart from this I can also think more clearly when hill walking.”

Jennifer Nichols