Issue Fifty
Also inside: Monobloc Crack Cloud Fcukers Ebbb TTSSFU Blue Polar triage The Itch Mên An Tol
fontaines d.c.
So Young x Rough Trade roughtrade.com
We’ve made it to the middle of 2024, and with it comes our fiftieth issue of So Young. We are grateful to every contributor, collaborator, band and artist who has helped us reach this milestone and given so much support to our independent print magazine. There probably isn’t a better way to celebrate than having the most exciting band in the world right now, Fontaines D.C. on the cover. They’re a band who have featured inside our pages many times, as well as live stages we’ve curated and gratefully, on our celebratory compilation too. With new album ‘Romance’ on its way in August, we sit down with the band at an Irish pub in London to chat through the rise to this point, the influence of new genres and giving fans everything they came for, night after night. It’s a pleasure to welcome Crack Cloud back to the pages of So Young. They’re a band we’ve all had obsessive moments with, so having them back, with a new label in Jagjaguwar supporting, makes this a very exciting time indeed. With new album ‘Red Mile’ coming in July, we reconnected with the band to discuss the Mojave, working with a label for the first time and the obsessiveness of their collective. NYC’s Fcukers are within an exciting moment, filling venues, empty swimming pools and any other unconventional space they can think of. The three piece are at the forefront of an exciting wave of indie dance music and they know their roots. With more miles in their legs and more music in the tank, we checked in for the second time to hear what’s been going on and dig into the DJ’s, movements and genres which inspire them the most. Heading back to the UK, and to London, Ebbb have been making some impressive waves over the last 12 months. Landing somewhere between industrial and ambient, Ebbb have created a sound which feels truly unique to them at such an early stage of their career, and its with that it becomes no surprise that they’ve now signed with Ninja Tune. Ahead of the release of their debut EP, we sent over some questions to dig away for a few extra details from the mysterious trio.
Staying in the capital, The Itch have been playing countless shows in all the great small venues in the city. Until recently, the band had solely built their reputation upon their live shows, but now, with a debut single in the world (‘Ursula’) the noise is travelling further and wider. We gave Georgia and Simon a call to chat about their rotating band of talented musicians and their brand of disco rock. TTSSFU, is the solo project led by Manchester’s Tasmin Nicole Stephens. Alongside her commitments to punk-rock band, Duvet, Tasmin has recently released her debut EP ‘Me, Jed and Andy’. TTSSFU’s gothic wash of shoegaze has been turning heads up and down the country over the last few months and we spoke via video call to see what’s been going on and how the solo project grew from secret iphone demos to an upcoming summer full of shows to packed rooms. EP’s are always an exciting first dive into a new band. Not intended to be the finished article, but enough to be introduced to a band’s first ideas and get excited. ‘fox hours’, the debut EP from triage has served that purpose and then some. Following tour dates with bar italia, and recording with Stereolab’s Andy Ramsay, the five piece are beginning to make their mark. Meeting up in London, the band answered some quick fire questions to get warmed up before letting us into their inner workings. Another EP we are excited for is the debut from Blue Polar. Since playing our We Are So Young night at Sebright Arms, the bands impressive single ‘Blinded’ has found itself on repeat in our heads and we needed to know more. Inside, we chat influences and the creative hub in which the band has been built upon. Finishing the features is an interview with NYC’s Monobloc, a band who have found themselves building their audience in Europe before back at home. With plenty of groundwork and opening slots under their belt, the group are ready to step things up. Starting with a support slot with LCD Soundsystem.
4 Blue Polar London’s Raining
35 Ebbb Playing with Extremes
7 TTSSFU Secret Soundcloud
40 The Itch Disco Rock
11 Fontaines D.C. Romance
43 Mên An Tol Folk is the Soul
24 Monobloc I’m Just Trying to Love You
50 Fcukers Empty Pool Party
32 Crack Cloud The Mojave
53 triage Daylight Robbery
London’s Blue Polar began as a childhood friendship, the
We’re all very different musicians, Tiger has been a
school friends grew up together and as they grew, so did
Classically trained Cellist from the age of 8, Joe is big
their tastes in music, eventually moulding into an alt-rock
into the production side of things and dance music, and
band formed of artists, poets and actors. Their music
Me and Jamie come from a slightly “Punk” background I
brings together the feel-good alternative guitar riffs of
guess…though I don’t think we could ever call ourselves
the 2000s with mellow and raw lyrical themes of nineties
Punk. I’d say the cross between our backgrounds has a
singer-songwriters. On a rainy Wednesday afternoon, I sat
large influence on our sound.
down with lead singer and guitarist Jake Scott where we discussed the band’s upcoming EP, his own collective and
We’ve seen lots of classically trained musicians come
everything in between.
together with rock musicians recently...
How did Blue Polar come together in its current
Very much in the Post-Punk scene, almost every band has
formation?
some unconventional instrument in there. We’re still a guitar band but our influences still come from other types
Well to start, Blue Polar is Me on Vocals and Guitar, Joe
of instrumentals too! Maybe one day Blue Polar will be a
Anders on drums, Jamie King on guitar and Tiger Braun-
full-on orchestra post-punk 8-piece outfit.
White on Bass. I, Joe and Tiger have been best mates since we were nine years old and we’ve played in really
Naturally the band will progress the longer you’re
shit bands for years, our first band was a jazz band called
together who knows what’ll happen?
“Bazz Jand”. In 6th form we came together with Jamie and we made Blue Polar.
Already I think we’ve progressed so much, compared to our first single the music we’re making is the music we
As a frontman, who would say your biggest inspirations
want to make. Our writing style has developed too. We
are in terms of stage presence and personality?
started gigging very quickly once we formed the band so we made music to get the crowd going, but now we’re
One of my main heroes from when I was twelve was
making music that tends to our influences more. It’s
David Bowie, even though I don’t think my performance
music we can get behind more and it feels like a general
style is anything like his. He was very theatrical and
expression of what we’re aiming to share with people.
studied in mime and I don’t do any of those shenanigans.
Still, we think we’ll develop more but we’ve found our
Another one would be Julian Casablancas though he’s
way of writing and our character and it’s all very exciting.
kind of got just a natural pissed-off look on stage. I’d say I’m somewhere in between those two, I try to take myself
Feels like a natural time to ask about who those
not too seriously and keep it light-hearted.
influences are?
I can hear echoes of The Strokes in your guitar riffs…
Well, I think it goes back to us having our own individual personalities in the band, which also translates to our
Thank you! I’d say there’s a mix of a lot of different
influences. I think the most obvious influence which
sounds, mainly because we’re all very different in our
you can hear in our sound is The Strokes, they’re a big
tastes. I know we were just talking about me being the
influence on us there’s no hiding from it. Our producer
frontman, but I like to think of Blue Polar as all of us. I
Gordon Raphael recorded the first two Strokes albums so
just started writing lyrics, and naturally, it felt right for me
we’re also similar to them production-wise. Going back
to sing them.
to Joe being into dance music, that has an impact on his rhythms and drum sounds.
Words by Peter Martin, illustration by Hanneke Rozemuller
4
Tiger as a jazz musician loves big band jazz and bebop
You also run a collective yourself called ‘Far From’
but also early Smashing Pumpkins. Jamie on guitar is
putting on events throughout London, how did that
more into Pavement, Fat White Family and My Bloody
come about?
Valentine. I’m getting more into Dean Blunt, bar italia and Far From began as my art account on Instagram but once I
Ethan P. Flynn.
stopped posting art on there and when Blue Polar needed a ‘London’s Raining’ has some of my favourite lyrics
headline gig in sixth form, I turned Far From into this fake
from your releases so far, they’re quite mellow and that
club night to get booked at venues. We played a couple
reflects in the instrumentation too. Was that the goal
of shows like that but then life took over and I stopped
thematically when you were making it?
doing that. At the second show, we had a band called Cardboard play and it was the first time we’d played with
That song came from a rough time, it’s very raw. That
a young band that we liked and got on with. Long story
version specifically is recorded by me in my shed with
short, a year later me and their drummer Dan started Far
a tape machine. It’s a sloppy recording made in one day
From again with me and Dan co-managerial roles of the
and I think that reflects in the track. We took it to the
collective.
studio and created a grand version with strings piano and a spoken word bridge, but we decided our favourite version
Tell me about the type of events you’re putting on.
was the original shed version as it’s the most honest and We wanted to make something fun and different and
raw representation of the song.
the idea is that they’re a crossover between different It definitely reflects the sadness you get on a rainy day
art forms. So there’s music while art is being projected,
and you certainly achieved that feeling through the
other people’s videos playing at the same time. The main
production and lyrics...
idea, as cliche as it is, is to bring together as many young creatives as possible to make some cool shit. We put on
It was the first track we recorded for the EP and was
a bikini mud fight recently and we want to put on silly
a turning point for being more raw in our sound, even
things like a hot dog-eating competition or bingo just to
though it’s an odd one out on the project. Some of the
spice things up and create a better experience watching a
other songs on the project have less structure compared to
band. The exciting thing about Far From is that it could be
this and ‘Just Like My Dream’ has notions of Pop, it’s a
anything, we can do whatever we like and also facilitate
good middle ground on the EP. It’s a mellow break from
our friends to express themselves.
the shouty and upbeat tracks. Our recording style is also very symbiotic with our live formation, Gordon wanted
Seems like a very genuine project by very genuine
our recordings to be us four in a practice room facing each
people.
other to make it as authentic and honest as possible. Me and Dan have both equally been fucked over by ‘Just Like My Dream’ is an absolute delight to listen to
promoters taking a big chunk of the ticket sales and we
and has a massive chorus, it’s certainly the sing-along
know what it’s like to be in a band, it’s mutually beneficial
track in your set, was that one of those intentionally
and we pay our bands well. It’s a growing community of
written songs to get people moving?
people coming together and it’s just fun.
Not exactly, it’s a song from the start of the band. We
Any closing words?
were seeing if we could write more of a catchy song and it kinda stuck. We love the energy of the track. It’s a feel-
Keep an eye out for our EP coming up, it’s the best
good kind of theme even though the lyrics are kind of sad.
representation of our sound!
It’s so much fun to play live and we hope that translates onto record.
5
Blue Polar
TTSSFU is the solo project of Mancunian multi-
I had asked PREGOBLIN if I could support next time they
instrumentalist Tasmin Nicole Stephens, despite already
were in Manchester, and I weren’t being serious, but then
playing guitar for underground favourites Duvet, Stephens
Alex [Sebley] was like “I actually have a gig, and if you
had been building up to releasing her own music for years.
want to support you can have it”, but then it hit me that I
Having been writing since she was fourteen years old,
was actually going to have to play.
it took a jokingly pitched and then nervously accepted slot supporting PREGOBLIN to coax TTSSFU out of
If you first started putting your music out when you
the shadows of Soundcloud and onto the stage, what has
were sixteen, when did you first start making music?
followed is an abundance of excitement and a packed summer gig schedule.
T: I’d say that I got really interested in it at around fourteen, I actually managed to track down some of
Considering creating music on her phone in her room
the first recordings the other day on my iCloud, at that
made up a major part of her formative years, Tasmin’s take
point I really wanted to be the next Kim Gordon and it
on bedroom pop-rock has a particular personal charm that
just weren’t working out for me. There were also some
has claimed the favour of many. 2024 will see TTSSFU
attempts at becoming the next Lou Reed in there as well
welcomed on support tours with the likes of Mannequin
but I just had to be realistic and realise I have quite a high
Pussy and Soccer Mommy, and has also brought with it
pitched voice and that was not going to happen. I always
the announcement of their place in the top five for Green
knew in my head that I didn’t want to start releasing
Man Festival’s Rising Competition, giving them the
anything until I thought it was alright. It was also a
chance to open the beloved festival’s main stage in the
massive secret for a while, I wouldn’t record anything
Brecon Beacons this Summer.
until everyone was out of the house because I just thought it was so stupid and embarrassing to be sat writing songs.
For Tasmin, creating music is something that she has always done, and now with her band behind her and her
When you’re fourteen though literally everything feels
solo music officially out in the world, she can go all in.
like the most embarrassing thing, so it’s still a massive step to start uploading music, did you put it under your
How are you, how is everything going, what have you
name too?
been up to in the last few weeks? T: There is an old Soundcloud account with my middle Well everything apparently! We’ve been doing so many
name called Tasmin Nicole, maybe I thought that no one
gigs, it’s been such a change to what I’m used to, I never
would realise that it’s still me, I thought I was being smart
used to do anything with my own music except randomly
but I weren’t. Then I started posting under TTSSFU, I
put it out on Soundcloud. It’s been making me feel really
think I did want attention but I didn’t, I wanted people to
good to actually do it, I didn’t think it would happen.
tell me what they thought of it. Ages ago, before that, I had one called The Tall Whites? After the alien? That was
How long have you been playing with the people in
really bad…
your band? Was there something in particular that made you ready Well the band only really started last year about December
to start sharing your music?
time, but my lead guitarist Paddy came across the music a while ago so has been asking me about it for years, he’s
Again, it comes back to my family. When I knew that my
probably been learning the songs in his own time for like a
mum and sister had come across it I’d literally run away,
year or so. We always texted about it but then wouldn’t do
but once I realised it was something I really wanted, I had
anything with it until I got the PREGOBLIN support slot.
to force myself to get over it. When they came to my first show I think they were a bit scared of what I was gonna do?
7
Words by Amber Lashley, illustration by Aleksandra Georgieva
They know a different side to me so they were like “what
So many people have that moment where they first
if she walks on stage and starts being really weird?”.
find out about The Factory, Andy, and Edie Sedgwick, and become obsessed with that era, it’s sort of a rite of
After that first show were they like “fair enough”?
passage.
Yeah! I think they were pretty impressed, which is good,
…because the stories are crazy, there’s nothing like that
but they were like “what’s going to happen now?”. I don’t
anymore I don’t think, there’s nothing that shocking! I was
think they knew what my point was at that time, especially
exactly the same, you read it and it’s like “wait what? That
because I was saying I’d only do the one show, but that’s
happened?”.
not happened at all. I read Patti Smith’s Just Kids and I remember seeing It’s been the complete opposite really! With your
her talk about Max’s Kansas City and how there was
EP ‘Me, Jed and Andy’, I find it really interesting
an area reserved for the people affiliated with Warhol,
when people use other people’s experiences to explain
everyone in there including Robert was trying to get
or relate to their own, but to use someone else’s
to that area. It’s crazy that you can contextualise these
relationship is a completely different spin on that. How
characters through all of the different accounts.
did you find putting together that project? I guess there was a structure there already because it’s a real
They’re all kind of linked, all of what I call the ‘actual
life story…
icons’, people who really did pave the way. They all sort of knew each other. When you figure that out it’s weird, as
I mean, I think you see exactly what I tried to do with
you say it’s like do we think of them as real people or just
that. I’d always been a fan of Andy Warhol’s work but
characters?
I never knew about Jed, I never even knew Andy had a Are you into pop culture in general?
relationship. When I came across the documentary about them I was just blown away by how Andy behaved, and I saw a lot of myself in it, which maybe isn’t a good thing?
I think so, anyone would tell you this, I get obsessed
I hadn’t been inspired by anything like that in a while
with people and when I do I have to learn everything
and I instantly started coming up with ideas of how to
about them to the point that it becomes my entire life.
talk about Andy. There were so many different feelings to
My friends get annoyed by it because once I’m obsessed
dive into, and obviously with my own experience of being
with something it’s all I’ll talk about, and they probably
insecure, I felt like it was a good outlet to put all of that
don’t care half the time, but I need to tell everyone what I
into him instead of me. It’s a lot easier to hide behind I
know about these people. It could be anything from films,
suppose.
to celebrities and music. Once I get a grip on something I can’t stop until I know everything about it.
Of course, and he is such a character as well, I feel like there’s such a strong idea of who he is in almost a
I saw the Green Man Rising competition as well!
fictional sense.
Congratulations!
I think he thought of himself that way too. Going off of
It’s insane, John Maus is doing Green Man this year and I
what I know and what I’ve researched, he kind of became
posted about it saying “someone needs to find me a way to
like a joke to himself, he wouldn’t let anyone see who he
get to Green Man”, and then that competition was posted.
actually was in my opinion. I think he was really frail on
I think my manager Maria actually signed me up for it,
the inside. He seemed like a bit of an asshole too but I just
when we found out we were in the final five we were all
thought it was so interesting.
in the car driving to Hebden Bridge, it was such a nice moment! We had the Strokes on and it was dead sunny and
It is really interesting because you can question
I was like “Guys! What’s going on!”. It felt like a movie
whether or not those qualities are on purpose?
moment.
9
TTSSFU
Those of you familiar with the Fontaines D.C. catalogue will be outright shocked by their fourth album ‘Romance’. For those who aren’t familiar, well where the fuck have you been for the last five years? Their latest groundbreaking single ‘Starburster’ has shifted the sonic and aesthetic world of the once modest Irish five piece into what is now a universal supergroup. Adorned with hair dye, fluorescent clothing, and an all-round Nu-metal vibe, Fontaines D.C. are a kind of 90s-esque postmodern powerhouse. With influences from Korn, The Smashing Pumpkins, Andre 3000, and Shygirl, ‘Romance’ witnesses, as we discussed, the band returning to their adolescent tastes for music they left behind in their twenties. Simply, they’ve looked back to see the future.
Today I meet with the group in the darkest corner of an
When did that feeling of imposter syndrome subside?
Irish pub in London. “It opens nice and early, you know,
Surely not until after you’ve had a successful second
for a couple rollovers”, I’m told by guitarist Conor Curley,
record…
who struggles to conceal a grin beneath his sunglasses. I ask whether they come here a lot. “A bit, like”, chuckles
C: Maybe, although we had a smokescreen of a second
drummer Tom Coll. It’s clearly an understatement.
album during the pandemic. People had to digest ‘A Hero’s Death’ in a different way as everyone was stuck
Littered around the pub are a range of elderly Irish locals
at home, experiencing massive changes in their lives, and
and a lovely Maître d’, all of whom, over the next few
suddenly they had this piece of music to engage with. It’s
hours, will come and greet the boys by their first names.
hard to tell when that feeling went away to be honest.
I jokingly ask the bartender whether the band work here; “no, but they’re here all the fuckin’ time!” It’s a
T: I feel like our third record [‘Skinty Fia’] was similar to
humorous, and quietly endearing moment as I consider the
our second in the sense that we never got to tour it in the
band’s continually distanced relationship to Ireland over
UK.
the years. How does the preamble to ‘Romance’ feel compared to Their fourth, and highly anticipated album ‘Romance’,
the build-up before your other records? I’ve never seen
searches for what else there is to be passionate about as
hype like this before, it’s insane.
they move further away from their homeland. Perhaps today, it is these similarly dislocated Irish pub-goers
T: Yeah, this feels different, for sure. Bigger.
who, like Fontaines, find a glimpse of home in the dark reflection from a Guinness. We start our conversation right
C: Yeah, and I think all the visuals that we’ve released
at the beginning of their career, and end, many pints later,
have shocked people into giving the album a bit more
on the here and now – basically, I want to know what it’s
attention than before. It’s more graphic and mysterious
like to be the biggest band in the world right now. As for
than the first three albums which rested more on classic
what we discuss after I stop recording, well unfortunately
alternative rock and roll tropes. Everything up to this
for you reader, that’s for my grandkids only…
point has been in-keeping with that specific genre. This time there’s a lot of anticipation because everything is
I’ve been thinking back to the time I saw you at the
different.
Brixton O2 just after you released ‘Dogrel’ in 2019. The other day I was sitting in the park close to a Tom: That seems like a lifetime ago, it’s crazy.
group of roadmen, for lack of a better word, who were blasting your new single ‘Starburster’ from a
What’s your lifestyle like now as opposed to back then?
UE boom. I feel like this track has reached far beyond what everyone thought your audience was.
T: It’s quite similar in a way. We’re still touring lots, C: No way! Really? That’s mad. I’m glad I didn’t witness
followed by short periods of time off.
that because I would have had the most uncool reaction Curley: The difference for me is that back then, I was
to it.
constantly thinking like, when is this going to end! I was just waiting to pack up and head back home at any minute,
What’s been the perception of your fanbase until now?
to be greeted with a “nice try though…!” Now it doesn’t seem that way. I think it’s inevitable that we’ll be doing this for a long time.
13
Words by Leo Lawton, illustration by Cameron JL West
T: Umm, I guess people like you! We had a show in
Musically, ‘Romance’ is stylistically a much more
Brooklyn a couple weeks ago and our reception felt
approachable record. Might that explain this
different there this time. America has always been a few
broadening of your fanbase?
steps behind here in a way, but this time we were met with C: Yeah, and because we’ve established such a strong
a really diverse crowd which was exciting to see.
foundation for our sound over three albums, we’ve been a C: Our fanbase has changed from just people that we
lot more adventurous with ‘Romance’. We’ve added more
would have in our own friendship circles, you know. Now
‘mainstream’ elements without selling out. To most people
we’re bringing in a younger crowd, maybe. When that
we are just an alternative rock and roll band. This album
happens, you realise your music is going further than your
has been an entirely different adventure.
own personality.
T: Over the last year or two our influences as a group have
T: Yeah, I was listening to a lot of drum and bass at
broadened massively. From electronic stuff to hip-hop,
that time, which massively informed the drum sound on
it’s been fun to delve into new styles and explore new
that record. It’s a funny thing with us as a group, once
technologies. It’s been a whole new world for us.
someone steps into a different musical realm everyone else goes with them!
Even when interviewing for ‘Skinty Fia’, Tom, you’d said that you weren’t listening to much guitar music.
I want to go back to the drum sound on ‘Starburster’. It reminds me of that huge, spacious sound Zeppelin got on ‘When The Levee Breaks’. Tell me about recording with producer James Ford.
T: James is such an accomplished drummer, and he has
It was a big conversation between James and I, you know,
a great mind when it came to recording the kit. He was
let’s do the John Bonham thing! We recorded drums at the
meticulous about tuning the drums to specific notes.
bottom of a stairwell, and so it’s got this echoey, ‘When
Everything sat in a strictly notated world, which has been
The Levee Breaks’ feel to it.
really cool for me to watch and learn from. A lot of the And how are you going to emulate that live?
album is heavily processed, we ran the drums through distortion boxes, which was class. And you’re right about Led Zeppelin, who were a big influence.
T: I’m using a lot more electronic stuff, delving into that hybrid drumming world, which is new for me. We haven’t really done it yet so we’ll see how it goes!
15
@cameronjlwest
Right now, you’re in between tours. What does time off
T: Toward the end of every touring period there’s an itch
look like?
to get writing again. It’s never a conscious conversation, it just happens. We’re very bad at resting. The mundanity
C: Time off is catching up with those you miss when
of touring the same set for fourteen months can get a bit
you’re away. Trying to make memorable times with loved
intense, and a bit like Groundhog Day, so you need that
ones knowing that you’re going to be gone for another
kick of excitement for the next thing.
year. Our lifestyle is intense a lot of the time, so it’s nice to see family and friends. Other than that, I also have a
It seems mad that you can get to a stage where touring
studio which I rent, and in which I write music all the
feels like Groundhog Day.
time. For me, that’s where the sanity is. It’s just so hard to record demos whilst you’re on tour. It’s hard to keep that part of your brain ticking over you know.
T: Don’t get me wrong, touring is amazing! We’re good at
That’s why the antidote is writing something new; the
complaining about it! It’s all I want to do, but when it’s so
cycle begins again, and I start to view older songs as ideas
intensive, it can get heavy.
between the five of us at a different point in time. It gives them new meaning too. The older I get, the further away
C: Performing is exhausting. Night after night you’re
I get to the mindset of writing a song like ‘Big’. When I
trying to replicate a song for someone who is so connected
go back to playing those older songs I feel like a different
to you, and you want to give everyone the full experience.
person. On that first album, every muscle in our bodies
It’s shit to complain about it, because it’s the best thing to
was so tense!
be doing in the world, but there’s an emotional cost from putting yourself out there like we do.
T: Yeah, I was just playing as hard and fast as I could,
C: Definitely. To be able to write an amazing song with
you know. A lot of that tension and aggression came from
three chords on an acoustic guitar is the hardest thing.
wanting so hard to prove ourselves. You become more
Take The La’s for example, who were incredible at writing
relaxed once you have a few records under your belt.
simplistic songs. That’s the coolest thing to me, not complex shredding, but making people feel things from
There’s something to be said for the simplicity of the
simple structures. That’s what ‘Boys’ has achieved more
three-chord riff, like on ‘Boys In The Better Land’,
than any Fontaines song.
right? Do you enjoy continuing to play that song at each show?
17
Both: Yeah, definitely, 100%.
T: I hate being let down by a band who don’t perform the
Touring with Arctic Monkeys was a wild experience to
song which I really like. If people are paying money to
get my head around. You do get desensitised to it after a
come and see you, you owe it to them.
while, which is wild.
C: We’re all avid gig goers as well, so we’ve always
C: When I watch other bands play big arena shows, I get
constructed a show based on what we would want as fans.
nervous for them. Sometimes my palms get all sweaty. I
It’s always a mixture of old and new.
think it’s my own nerves stored up that I won’t let myself feel for our shows. When you’re so tuned into having to
How does it feel to walk out on stage at an arena show?
step out there, you completely ignore thinking about the crowd. Shove it deep down inside you, unhealthily or not!
T: I never thought it would be my life. It’s mental. Any pre-show rituals?
C: We’re like strange football players who don’t know
It kind of started during the Arctic Monkeys tour. A lot
how to warm up! A lot of jumping and shouting “woo!” at
of modern hip-hop, Deftones, Korn, Smashing Pumpkins.
each other…
Our ears were pricking up to different production styles and we liked the idea of approaching our songwriting as a
I wanted to circle back to ‘Romance’ a bit, and ask
band through a different filter.
about your influences for this record, which include Korn, Outkast, and Shygirl. Tell me a bit about these
T: The 90s influences on the album go way back to when I
new, and probably surprising references.
was a teenager. Something happens in your late 20s where you start circling back to the shit you were into at that age.
C: Yeah, it’s all music that we were listening to backstage
It’s really fun! I feel like I had rejected a lot of it in favour
before shows.
of ‘cool shit’ that you discover in your early 20s, like Can or Neu for example.
I can hear the 90s influences especially on ‘Sundowner’
Well, it’s one highlight amongst many off what will
which you sing on, Curley. Those mellotron lines
certainly be the biggest album of this year. Tell me
coupled with your shoegaze-y vocals give a kind of
about working with XL Recordings and moving on
Broadcast vibe, who you actually introduced me to via
from Partisan Records.
your What’s In My Bag. T: Partisan were fucking great, they put so much trust in C: No way! Wow, fuck yeah! That song was inspired by
us starting out as a band from Dublin with only six songs.
them a lot, man. I was also listening to Massive Attack
We owe so much to them. We just wanted to do something
and Portishead as well, which is all in the same realm.
different, you know, have a change. XL are such a historic
I think trip-hop is an exciting place to put yourself as a
label, with an incredible lineage. It was an easy choice to
songwriter, as you can lean into loads of different styles
go with them. Plus, we’re not a major label band.
and methods. It’s kind of just a cool way of being omnigenre. 19
cjlw.co.uk
Photo by Kalisha Quinlan
The music industry is a strange and unpredictable place,
T: *laughs * Yeah, yeah it’s gonna be really
where landing in the ears of a single listener can change
embarrassing… I guess we will never run into them
a band’s entire trajectory and lead them to places they never dreamed of. New York’s Monobloc are no stranger
Are you nervous?
to the industry’s fickle tricks of fate, emerging out of years of experimentation and discovery for its members,
T: I don’t know, we’ve never really played a festival
resulting in a project that is astoundingly intriguing and
before. We have been playing a lot of shows for sort of
self-assured.
industry people lately and it kind of feels like going up for a school talent show or something. So I’m really yearning
Forming out of the ashes of beloved indie rock project
to just play for normal music fans again * laughs *
Courier Club, Timothy Waldron and Michael Silverglade formed Monobloc with a desire to take everything they
Had you guys played a lot of live shows as a band
had learned to date and turn it on its head. Completing the
before you released your first single?
lineup with the addition of Zack Pockrose, Ben Scofield and Nina Lüders, the group began to experiment with
T: Yeah, we basically recorded our demo and used that to
their sound, freely throwing ideas around and seeing what
form the band. We played live for about six months before
stuck.
releasing ‘I’m Just Trying To Love You’ because we were really nervous that if things went well and an opportunity
The resultant debut single ‘I’m Just Trying To Love You’
arises and then we just kinda suck live. Because we’re
broke through in a way they never anticipated. Suddenly
friends who’ve known each other for a while but we’d
Monobloc were launched into a world of hot tips and
never all played together, so we just played like crazy
industry chats, captivating audiences with their confident
with nothing out, just using connections from friends to
and unshakeably cool sound. We spoke to Michael and
be the first of three on a bill. So that six months was sort
Timothy about their whirlwind of a year and where they
of in the trenches, fixing everything, melding as a band.
think this wave of momentum will take them next.
And then when we felt like we were ready we put the song out and then stuff happened so it’s good that we learned
Lovely to meet you, I just saw that you’re playing the
*laughs *
LCD Soundsystem show, that’s pretty cool! And now you’re playing these showcases Timothy: Yeah, that’s gonna be wild. Honestly they’re one of my favourite bands. When I was 18 I got an LCD
T: Yeah, now we’re playing with LCD Soundsystem, so
Soundsystem tattoo because I thought it would be cool
that’s… fucking wild
and… it’s my most regrettable tattoo because I always said I was never going to get words tattooed on me and I got
It’s kind of funny really. We self put out ‘I’m Just Trying
the name of their DVD ‘Shut Up And Play The Hits’. I
To Love You’ and were very focused on the US and
thought it was really cool in the moment and now I’m like
growing in New York. And then somehow, which we’re
“uh, I’m gonna have to try and hide it from James Murphy
not really sure how it happened, there was a guy in Paris
if I see him”
who heard it, and then there was one person in the UK who heard it, and they were both in the industry.
You’re gonna be backstage hiding it
Words by Eve Boothroyd, illustration by Laura Simonati
24
They didn’t know each other but they really pushed us and
Do you find that as you build the lore and image of the
were like “can we show people this” and all of a sudden
band it is effecting your approach to making music?
it felt like the UK and France cared about Monobloc way more than New York did. I don’t know… we’ve been
M: I think with the songwriting process we have kind of
doing this for ten years so we’ve seen all of the pathways.
done it since the beginning. With this band we have a new
Like we’ve done the “let’s hop in a van and play to no one
approach to songwriting where it’s kind of made with the
forever” thing so this feels kind of... not real, like it’s a
vision of it being received down the line in mind. Each
bit.
song basically has a concept that is paired with it, which ties into the visuals too… everything is kind of connected
Is there anything that you learnt from those previous experiences that you brought to this project?
T: Yeah, when a song is being created you’re instantly thinking “how is the video going to look, if we’re playing
Michael: Kind of everything I think. Me and Tim played
this live how is the room gonna feel”. We set a lot of rules
in a band before and that was kind of where we made a
with the songwriting, we’re very minimal with everything.
lot of mistakes and learned what to do and what not to do.
The way we actually write the songs is that we throw
And then when we started Monobloc we had the vision
everything on the canvas and make this really muddy
from day one like “this is the Monobloc sound, this is
mess of a song, and then we sort through the madness and
the Monobloc visual direction, this is how we wanna
slowly carve it down into what needs to be there. I took a
do everything.” I think that is why it is connecting with
painting course once that changed my whole view of it…
people the way that it is, because we had all this time to
I’m very bad at painting but I was kind of like “wait, you
kind of figure out what a band with the two of us is
guys aren’t doing everything perfectly you’re just painting over it and blending later on?” and I realised I should start doing music like that, and being less rigid from the start.
T: For the first time in Monobloc it felt like the idea that we were trying to present was being fully received and that’s been the first time that has ever happened for us
What was the process like behind ‘I’m Just Trying To
where it is such a clear identity. I think a big thing is
Love You’?
playing on things that are very “classic” and then toying with them, putting something in there that shouldn’t be
M: I think with that song it was the first one where we
there but makes sense to the modern viewer.
used one of our guidelines for songwriting which is having a lot of depth and texture with minimal instrumentation.
Do you see this as something beyond a music project?
If I remember correctly I think that was when we kind of came up with that line because there are synths and
T: I always say for a live band that it’s 50% visual 50%
violins and drums but the bassline is the same four notes
music, because the audience are watching the people
on a loop and one of the guitars is also a loop. So we were
play. It’s always been really important to me and I have
kind of taking these really simple parts and looping them
kind of gravitated towards bands that put a lot of work
in really interesting ways and got this song we really liked
into that and gives you a nice world to live in, like a kind
from that. So we took these ideas of writing and started to
of ambient cushion around everything. I just really like
apply them to other ideas we had.
creating the lore…. So I guess in a way we are trying to create things musically and visually, but at the end of the day we are a band, we’re not trying to be gallery artists or anything
25
Monobloc
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Speaking to Zach Choy and Aleem Kham of Crack
Z: A couple of us have moved back to Calgary, Alberta.
Cloud through a digital aid about coming to terms
Red Mile absolutely is the local reference, although I
with the histories that precede them, both personally
don’t think that we had really intended on that being a
and musically; considering the nature of home and
focal point or an influence on why we came up with the
the inspiring emptiness of the Mojave Desert. With
name. There’s a certain extraction to it, a certain kind of
their upcoming release, ‘Red Mile’, Crack Cloud have
inside notion that we got a lot of joy from, but it’s not
reflected and looked inwards; after years on the road and
necessarily what we are interested in broadcasting as
changing dynamics within the collective. The album came
far as emphasising Calgary specifically. Maybe there’s
together organically and with urgency, with consideration
something arbitrary about what we consider home. Just
of past experiences, cementing their shared feelings
the existential-ness of trying to identify what that is.
and discoursing possible contingencies; a spiritual
When you’re touring five months of the year that becomes
symbiosis. The signature of Crack Cloud is clearly written
especially something that you’re contemplating. That lack
throughout, without reproducing their previous sounds,
of stability definitely inspired both the move as well as
this album is different – succinct and fervently direct. It
the sound of the album and our approach to everything. I
sonically floats with softness, removing reticence, the
would say everything was in unison of each other in a way
music becomes an honest cleansing that is in harmony
where it’s only in retrospect, do we realise that everything
with lyrics which are spat to the front. Merging collective
kind of had a relationship decision wise, artistic wise.
woes and universal emotions, ‘Red Mile’ is a tribute to Signing to Jagjaguwar, does that change your
humanity in our current conjecture.
philosophy as a collective or your creative process? You’ve previously said that interviews are whack, as they tokenise candid conversations. How can I,
Z: Creatively it hasn’t changed our trajectory in any way,
interviewers, the media in general create respectful,
they’ve been incredibly supportive. I think that they
honest environments?
knew what they were signing up for before they even propositioned us. It is just sustainability at the end of the
Zach: I think it’s just a paradox altogether that we
day. Ultimately what made us come to terms with trying
voluntarily participate in. The issue is that we aren’t who
to reconcile with the industry in a more normalised way.
we were a year ago, two years ago, three years ago. So,
There’s definitely a method to our madness that for better
we are just signing up to cement our feelings, our just
or worse has constituted how we have made things. The
general sense of the world based on the experiences that
label helped us concentrate our energies in a way that is
we have at the moment, but it is a cringe thing when you
healthier and more conducive to living a life outside of
look back, for lack of a better description. It is part of
the creative process which is important. So, pragmatism
life and there’s no shame in it really; we have reconciled
really.
with the whole institution, and like why we decide to do these interviews. There’s something beautiful if not
At a gig I went to, you said – “this is a project built
fallible about documenting the moment; the same can be
on gratitude”. How has the meaning of making music
said about art in general, the sounds that we create and our
changed for you? Is it still a confrontation with
visual identity is always changing, so why shy away from
rehabilitation and collective recovery?
spoken-word and thoughts, even if they’re fleeting. It is a way of archiving our experiences and what this generation
Z: The collective rehab thing, that was kind of an
looks like from our corner of the world.
experiment, and it didn’t exactly manifest in the most utopian ways that you would hope for when you look at
Between the Mojave and relocating back to Calgary,
Crack Cloud as a concept or an entity from a distance.
the Red Mile. Did these changes enable the album, or were they consequences of its creation? Words by Teddy Maloney, illustration by Yuka Masuko
32
We’ve gone through a lot of turbulence and I think that’s
A: Yes, I’d say maturity, instilling the idea of starting from
something natural to growing up. With the history of
scratch and the willingness to be vulnerable.
where a lot of us come from, that intersectionality of
Over there the desert is very barren. Every morning I was
hosting a wide range of personalities there has been
forced to deal with everything that was in my mind and
a lot of flux. I would say being creative is always a
that absolutely went into the music, that introspection.
gratifying process, in the same token a confrontational process, sometimes I wonder if those emotions need
Z: There’s a reason why it has the association that it
to be separated. Maybe how I would describe Crack
does. Like you say, that elemental effect on how we were
Cloud, never a linear eureka process. There is of course
writing, discoursing with each other; it slows you right
a privilege to even have a platform to broadcast these
down, that’s what we were really looking for after a
things. In the beginning it was just a journal entry of sorts.
turbulent year prior to.
For it to proliferate in a way, it is being influenced or The album references tropes of being a rock n roll star,
enjoyed by other people is always surreal.
how can the modern era reimagine the rock star? Aleem: To add to the aspect of gratitude, to wake up the next day is one of the biggest blessings I think we all
Z: This album, a lot of the subtext is very much an
share.
investigation of the constructs that we derive from, that we are actively engaged with. Going with the intuition
Once an outwards lens in ‘Tough Baby’, what
of history and culture, our own sense of self and trying
instigated the return to inwardness, an inner
to follow it in a way that is curious, aware and takes into
reflection?
consideration the whole history.
Z: I think the timing of ‘Tough Baby’ had a lot of sway
Being in a collective, does that stem from a collective
on how that album was constructed. ‘Tough Baby’ was
organisation structure you made initially or the music
a Covid Baby, it was infinite time. I think maybe a lot
itself makes the collective power structure possible?
of ego, in terms of nothing was feeling like a restraint on how we were interfacing with the medium, music
Z: I’d say it comes from an obsessiveness. The way its
specifically. It’s kind of self-deprecating to continue to
configured at this point, we all have a really good sense
reiterate but we have been doing this for a decade, some
of each other’s sensibilities. It is a synergy or a symbiotic
of us are entering parenthood. There was this urgency to
relationship with each other where we can communicate in
check ourselves, in terms of self-restraint this time. The
these very specific ways. I think that this album is a true
inwardness that you speak of really comes from the prior
execution of that.
year of climaxing on the road, a lot of inner turmoil within the group, a lot of changes as far as reconciling with the
A: This is an investigation, an experiment and meditation
idea that throughout life the people that you love the most
on the history of where we come from.
aren’t always on the same trajectory. All of that played into a bit of frugality and timidness, kind of like an ego-
What is the purpose of Crack Cloud? What, if there is,
death that preceded the album; not really knowing what
the political or philosophical message for the youth?
the fuck we were anymore, artistically speaking. There was something really beautiful about Joshua Tree, where
Z: There’s an intuition, but I think especially now more
we predominantly recorded the album. It’s a literal desert
than ever we are reluctant to associate or prescribe any
landscape, complete isolation and that environment really
idealism or ideology to ourselves.
reinforced those feelings for us. A: It’s the quote, “You belong somewhere, find out where You mention quite clearly the elemental effect of the
you belong, it is your choice”. I’ve felt extremely thankful
Mojave, did it aid in making the decision to create a
to meet everybody who has and continues to collaborate
more ‘stripped back’ album?
with us. That’s where I feel like I belong, and I don’t fucking want to do anything else.
33
Crack Cloud
Across the span of little more than a year, London three-
We like the idea of playing with extremes and the
piece Ebbb have been moving quickly. Starting out, as
‘unexpected’. We like bands that create an intensity
many do, playing to rapidly filling rooms across London’s
through guitar music, but we liked the idea of combining
grassroots venues, it didn’t take long for the band’s name
more delicate / melodic elements with high intensity
to take its hold on UK/Europe-wide festival bills and for
production and the added heaviness and energy of live
labels to clamber on top of each other for their prized
drums.
signature. Eventually putting their names with Ninja Tune, the band’s debut EP ‘All At Once’ lands this summer,
Having all had experience previously in bands, what
letting the proverbial cat out of its synth-lined bag, and
were the major lessons you’d learnt from trying to
doing its darned best to ensure that one of the best kept
‘make it’ with previous projects when kicking things
secrets of the last 12 months might not be so well kept any
off with Ebbb?
longer. Their almost immediate rise has been impressive but hardly surprising. Founding themselves on a heart-
I think the lessons we’ve learned are purely musical.
stopping live show, the blend of Ebbb’s three distinct
We didn’t think about anything apart from creating the
moving parts is as magically compelling as it is daringly
music we felt we wanted to hear ourselves. In terms of
unique. Scott MacDonald’s pounding drums bore into
our previous experience, I think that it’s the gelling of
the earth and dig up the biggest, most dazzling jewels.
our very different musical backgrounds that has created
Lev Ceylan’s glittering, sublimely orchestrated, “Fat
something we feel is singular.
Free” productions veer this way and that: as concise and tightly wrought as imagist poetry (songs never stray much
Publicly, you made a point of staying mysterious -
longer than 3 minutes) but as bold and momentous as any
not showing your faces online, until you had a track
time-honoured epic. And lastly, by no means least, Will
released. What were your intentions behind creating
Rowland’s dazzling choric tenor, floating above it all like
this illusion of an ‘enigma’?
a skylark, adding a wrenching sense of humanity to all the synthetic calculations whirring beneath him.
We wanted it to be solely about the music - for people to have to come to the live shows to see what it is all
Part synth-pop, part-art-pop, part techno, part who-gives-
about, and make up their mind based on nothing but the
a-fuck-what-it-is-this-rules, the band describe themselves
performance.
as “Death Grips meets Brian Wilson” but in all honestly, Ebbb’s real truths lie in the ears of their beholders.
Did you expect the Ebbb project to take off as quickly
Sometimes it sounds like the prettiest thing in the
as it has done? Or did you have these ambitions from
unknown universe, and at other times - as I might shout
the outset - to gig loads, pitch demos, not release
semi-drunkenly in a friend’s ear during one of their sets -
music, etc.? In many ways, it’s the current model of
it sounds like absolute ‘filth’. To shed further light on this
progression for a lot of London indie bands at the
elusive tale, we emailed Ebbb a few questions for them
moment.
to chew on. And in return, we learnt what links them, The Smile and JPEGMAFIA, plus much else besides.
We’ve been really pleasantly surprised by the quick progression of things. I guess anything external to the
I’m interested in how the idea for this project began.
music is out of our control - we’ve just focused very
The ‘ice’ and ‘fire’ tension between cold, clinical
carefully on building a set list and live show we believe
electronic beats and Will’s ethereal vocal lies at the
in.
core of what makes Ebbb tick. What brought these two elements together?
There’s a discrepancy between the hardness of your live shows, and the delicacy of your recordings.
35
Words by Elvis Thirlwell, illustration by Victoria Nikolova
They feel like distinctly separate experiences. There’s
It’s easy to get carried away and sometimes less is more.
no live drums on the EP for instance. Is this a gap that will continue to be maintained, or something you’re
Despite operating in a genre that often lends itself
looking to close heading into future releases?
towards longer, more developed compositions, your music is striking for its very brevity, with tracks never
We love the idea of the live show and the recorded
longer than 3-4 minutes. Why do you think you are
medium being a separate and a distinct experience. It’s
drawn to a shorter, more conventionally ‘pop’ song
cool to give headroom for extra intensity live.
form?
Are there other acts you look up to as achieving this
To build on the previous answer, we’ve always liked the
particular balance well?
songs to be snappy. We like the idea of writing ‘fat free’ music, in which every second counts, and there’s no
It seems a lot of artists who have a more electronic
wasted moment in a song.
approach to recording face the conundrum of how to convert their music into a live set. We respect different
Let’s talk more about the ‘All at Once’ EP. What would
approaches; FKA Twigs’ use of sample pads in the past,
you say are the themes overarching the record?
Björk who’s played with a live chamber orchestra here and there, and the simplicity of someone like JPEGMAFIA’s
There aren’t any particular overarching lyrical or musical
live approach. We’re happy to have got to a point where
themes on the EP. It’s more a showcase of who we are, and
rather than feeling we are simply ‘fixing’ the technical
the kind of musical territory we like to delve into and will
issue of translating an electronic track to live, we get
continue to on future releases.
creative satisfaction out of the process. What kind of decisions did you have to make when The live shows have progressed quite far since you
deciding which songs to put on your first major release,
started out, especially your performances Will, which
and which ones to put to one side for later? What kind
have noticeably grown more energetic and wild. How
of ‘experience’, or impact, are you hoping to achieve
have you developed your approach to being the vocalist
with the 5 songs you eventually chose?
and effective ‘Frontman’ of the band? We wanted the EP to be as well-rounded as possible, I feel like I’ve definitely grown into the role, and perhaps
and for each song to represent a different side of us. We
I didn’t know how to respond physically to the music at
wanted to keep the listener on their toes as the EP often
first as it was new territory for me. I’ve previously been a
veers into the unexpected.
frontman in bands, but always whilst playing keyboards, so never had the freedom to flail around. I guess the
What’s been the craziest, ‘pinch me’ moment of the
ultimate goal is to rid myself of all self-consciousness and
last 12 months. Things have been moving very quickly.
just respond to the music in a natural and instinctive way.
I first saw you last summer playing the George on a sunday to like 30 people, and now you’re supporting
What were the main difficulties or challenges in
the Smile. What the fuck?!
committing Ebbb to record for the first time? Yeah obviously The Smile is a big one - we are very Ebbb started off as a recorded project with us making
hyped. Securing a record deal with Ninja Tune was a huge
demos in Lev’s room, and we decided to play live after
moment, and just getting the opportunity to play bigger
we’d recorded several songs. We feel the songwriting has
stages across the UK and Europe.
definitely grown and become more coherent as time’s gone on. Because the EP is electronic and therefore so open-
What are you most excited about for the rest of 2024?
ended in scope, one of the biggest challenges is knowing when to stop adding layers and musical ideas. 37
Releasing the EP and seeing what follows! Ebbb
As much as musical trends may go through changes at the
Can you tell me a little bit about the themes behind it
speed of light, people are always going to want to have
and what resonated with you about Ursula Le Guin’s
something to dance to. While the music that London duo
The Dispossessed - why did you want to write a song
The Itch make would sound foreign in a ballroom, it finds
delving into that?
itself a comfortable home in the dingy basement disco, with its consistently pulsating rhythms and decidedly 80s
Simon: It’s not like sci-fi has much of an influence per se,
synths that vibrantly bounce around.
but I think Ursula Le Guin stands out to me for being in a genre that’s saturated with dystopias and doom-and-gloom
Much of why The Itch have enjoyed such a bright start to
prophesying on the state of the world. It’s quite interesting
their existence is down to the kinetic relationship of its
that she writes a lot about attempts at utopia, and with the
two members, Simon Tyrie and Georgia Hardy. Friends
state of the world right now being in such a bad way, it
since their teenage years, they’ve spent almost a decade
seemed interesting to me to write from that angle rather
flirting with various ideas and projects together that have
than focusing on the negatives.
all shaped where they find themselves now, and their pursuit of this sound is paying off in remarkable fashion.
Do you feel it’s interesting seeing utopian fiction that was written 50 years ago and comparing it to what we
With just one single in ‘Ursula’ to their name so far,
actually see now? Do you think there are similarities
the majority of buzz has arisen through their live
between what she wrote and we’re experiencing?
performances, which have come thick and fast and featured a rotating cast of additional members. It’s clear
S: I mean not necessarily, but I did feel there were
that there’s a more grand vision at play here and that
parallels to be drawn with that book in particular because
we’ve only been privy to a fraction of it so far, but the
the protagonists are striving for a better world and
band were eager to discuss everything that’s happened so
constantly coming up against cultural hurdles with this
far and what can be expected down the line.
other planet. I’m not gonna delve too deeply into the book’s plot, but I do feel like there are always parallels to
‘Ursula’ has been out for a couple of months now - how
be drawn there because there are always people trying to
have you found the response to putting out your debut
change the world for the better and always being met with
single?
ridicule and hatred.
Georgia: It’s been really good. We weren’t sure what the
There’s some satirical commentary in the unreleased
reaction would be considering it’s a seven minute long
songs. Have you always found that a style in which you
song, but we wanted to just show another side to the band.
enjoy writing?
The live show is very dancey and fun, but we wanted this first single to show that there’s a seriousness to the music as well.
Words by Reuben Cross, illustration by Cassady Moll
40
ST: It’s not really that much of a conscious thing. It’s
It’s like the famous Mark E Smith quote, “if it’s me
just a habitual reflex. Maybe that’s just the first place my
and your granny on bongos, it’s The Fall”.
brain goes to a lot of the time without even realising it’s a satirical point of view. Half the time if a lyric comes
S: I’d like to think that we’ve been a bit less chaotic
across as funny, it wasn’t even my intention.
than Mark E Smith, but yeah, [the rotating lineup] isn’t something we want to spend 20 years doing. One year is
Some tracks definitely do feel like you’re poking fun at
enough.
things in a tongue-in-cheek way… The two of you came together in your hometown and ST: 100%, it would be hypocritical the way that we talk
you’ve said that you immediately started exchanging
about the people we’re targeting. We’ve made music in the
ideas. I wondered what those were and how that
past that has kind of fallen into post punk and whatever,
evolved over time to draw you towards the music
and it’s almost less of an attack on other people and more
you’re making now?
of a kind of like slapping myself in the face kind of thing. If you over-listen to stuff and if you overdo something
S: We’ve collaborated on loads of different things;
yourself, you get sick of it. Sometimes it’s just healthy as
obviously music and putting on club nights and movie
an artist to just move on.
nights. We’ve always had a lot of ideas and it’s something we want to carry on doing. One of the first club nights we
Through moving on from previous projects, what kind
put on was a jazz night, it was kind of beat-inspired and
of creative freedoms have you found yourself with?
that was one of the things we bonded over. At that time we were listening to different kinds of stuff - Georgia was
G: I think we just wanted to do something with a bit more
really into Deftones and stuff like that, and I was more
diversity that could be a bit more malleable to change.
into Pitchfork-y stuff like Four Tet and Radiohead. It was
We had an agenda with the last band and we felt like we
good sharing that knowledge and I think that’s also a big
achieved that, but we wanted to do something we can
part of why it’s ended up being the defining sound of what
see ourselves doing long-term that has the ability to shift
we’re chasing, which is this disco rock kind of thing.
genres and perspective as we go along. Playing live we just wanted it to be more of a party and work with lots of
Going back to the live show - because you’re going
different people. For the first like six months it was new
for that disco rock thing, do you have a preference on
members every single time. We’d confirm shows and then
the sort of places you’re playing or do you feel that
just see out of our friends who was free and who was up
your music is quite flexible in terms of where it’s best
for it.
suited?
Do you think that’s partly why people have been
S: We’ve only done one headline, but going forwards we
getting so excited about the live shows because they can
want to try and do more venues suited for dance music.
expect something completely different every time?
When we played Electric Ballroom recently, it went down great and it felt like we were at home playing on
S: I don’t really know what people expected, but everyone
that stage, but equally I think we’d love to play sweaty
that’s played with us has been amazing. We’ve been really
basements and clubs.
lucky to play with lots of really great musicians, so no matter who has been playing with us, it’s always been a really great event. It’s almost a shame we can’t physically have every single person that’s ever played with us on stage because they’re all so good.
41
The Itch
When writing the songs, was there anything in
That’s not saying we don’t want to work with other
particular that ran through as a common influence?
people, because we do, but I think we would never just hand over our recordings to a producer without our say.
G: I think when we were writing these songs we were
I think pretty much all of my favourite music is produced
listening to a lot of Caroline Polachek and Alex G. In that
or co-produced by the artists themselves. Music that has
stuff we were finding really exciting production elements
the artist’s touch the whole way through makes a bolder
that inspired The Itch’s sound a bit more.
statement a lot of the time.
S: Their focus is quite studio-centred whereas our focus
Anything else that you’re excited about for this year?
has obviously been live, but something we want to look into with the album is separating it from the live side.
S: We’re just really excited to crack on with releasing more music into the world, connecting with more people
How much have you learned through what you’ve done
and hopefully collaborating with different people as well.
so far about how you want to set the studio side up?
We’re keeping a tight lid on what we want to be doing right now, but we’re generally excited about the way
G: At the minute, we record and produce everything
things are going.
ourselves which I think is quite important.
@cassadymoll.studio
42
It’s becoming increasingly common for artists across the
Bill: We’ve been rehearsing pretty intensively for around
British Isles to lean proudly into their heritage. There’s
six months and the songs that are in the set are the first
been a vivid sense of majesty and wonder as names like
things we’ve written. We’ve gone through a period of
Lankum, Brogeal and even The Mary Wallopers have
chucking things out and putting new songs in, but we
crept into mainstream spaces, proudly bringing all of their
wanted to have a solid half an hour of music before we
musical roots and traditions with them. During a time
played live. We wanted to do a handful of shows to make
when there’s an awful lot to be worried about in the world,
sure it all clicks as a band. But there was an element from
it’s been a breath of fresh air hearing something unifying
the off that it did feel like it was ready. The first show we
and celebratory.
played was at The Old Dispensary in Camberwell and it instantly felt good.
Having laid their foundations for their band in and around a Camberwell boozer, it would be a disservice to say Mên
It’s the old saying of where all good ideas start, but you
An Tol are the latest gang to find joy by picking through
guys came together in the orbit of a certain pub right,
their roots. That’s perhaps because their approach feels
was it quite an natural process then?
less deliberate and a little more organic than that. With vocalist Bill Jefferson plucking the band’s name from a
Tom: So we’ve all been very closely linked to this pub
famous landmark in his native Cornwall, the soul of his
in some way or another whether that’s working there or
writing was found early on in his journey as an artist after
living above it. All of the songs stemmed from here. Our
he learnt his craft playing folk sessions in and around the
first song and mission statement ‘NW1’ was written when
local pubs.
we were living in the flat above it. That song started in the building so it all centred around that. It was just the place
“That’s where I found my love for music and writing
where we all hung out and worked, we all became mates
songs,” he explains. “Those old school folk songs really
through that and we didn’t overthink anything, it was just
tell a story and there’s no fat on there, there’s nothing
about getting to know each other and start writing songs.
wishy-washy about it. I think that’s where the love and the artistry of writing a song comes from.” Though there’s
I guess it afforded you guys a bit of freedom away from
no recorded material out there to date from the five-piece
the pressure of rehearsal spaces and studios across that
who are completed by Felix Knox (Mandolin), Max
sixth month incubation period?
Silvey (Bass), Robert Wiseman (Guitar) and Tom Stevens (Drums), when it comes, you can’t help but feel it will
B: Yeah, it would literally be like ‘oh, I start at half four,
take them straight to the mainstages, and as we find out,
let’s get a couple hours of practice in before that’. We
they’re about to back themselves as well.
weren’t necessarily all in the same room together from the beginning, people would come and go and we’d work
It’s hardly rare for a band to arrive without any
through stuff. It has worked well, we’ve been able to
recorded material, but judging by the direction of
make a living while staying in London but also have this
your live shows, you’ve been working hard behind the
creative outlet to express ourselves through.
scenes…
43
Words by Rhys Buchanan, illustration by REN
It does take a certain type of person to work in a busy
It does feel like music that’s capable of connecting
boozer, it gives you a bit of life experience and you
on a mass scale - almost like The Levellers or The
need to have a bit of work ethic about you to do so…
Waterboys in front of thousands of hippies at Glasto in the nineties…
B: Totally, even just working in this pub it’s almost like a national service. You’ll meet some people on a busy
T: We’ve always said that we want to go straight onto the
Friday or Saturday night and you can just tell they’ve
big stages playing to as many people as possible and we
never had to do a day’s work in their life. It definitely
don’t feel shy about saying that. We want to do it because
grounds you, but on the flipside you also overhear great
it does feel like it’s right and people are connecting to it.
stories and you deal with people all of the time. You get
I also feel like the timing is quite good for this type of
the sense of a community which you don’t get when you
music, it feels quite unpretentious and it doesn’t buy into
just work in an office somewhere, so that really feeds into
trends. We’re not trying to sound like anyone else on the
the writing process.
London scene. I mean we love bands like The Verve, Oasis and The Sundays but then also all of the folk stuff. We’re
A lot of band’s across the British Isles are leaning
trying to be the band we want to see.
proudly into their heritage at the moment from Ireland to Scotland and Wales, but we haven’t necessarily
At the same time it does feel like a band of the now as
heard it from an English standpoint as of yet which is
well?
really interesting… BJ: We’re trying to write a song as good or better than B: I think we’ve all got a deep respect for all of these folk
some of our influences. Sonically of course they’re going
artists from decades gone by whether that’s Irish, English,
to chime through but then when you bring the likes of a
Scottish or whatever. I’ve always felt like someone needed
mandolin into the mix, it starts to have our own stamp on
to come at it from an angle of how that music would have
it. That instrument really frees us up because we don’t
sounded then to people. At the time traditional folk music
have these big cliched guitars in there as a textural thing.
sounded exciting and new and just like music, not some
It helps us build up a landscape and an atmosphere without
fun pastiche. That was our angle, we wanted to write
these rogue parts for the sake of it.
songs that people could relate to and sing-along to that are about people. Our listeners might not pick up on the folk
Even away from music, with the emergence of zines
element in the genre sense but it’s kind of the soul of the
like Weird Walk, there is a growing appetite to get
music rather than the dressing.
out there and connect with England and its traditions. It’s a reminder there are elements of this country to
It doesn’t feel forced or on the nose, it’s almost like
explore and be proud of away from all of the crap…
a deeper thing, did you become aware of the fact you were all on the same page quite quickly?
B: That’s completely hit the nail on the head really - with songs like ‘This Land’, it can all be a bit doom and gloom
B: I think we did, one of the first things we spoke about
at the moment and it’s an embarrassment to be English
was the music of Mick Jones. I don’t think I’d met anyone
with so much shit going on. I mean that’s good but I don’t
who could name individual tracks and name specific
think you need to hear about it through art that much. I’d
things that we like about him and his music. I guess it is
rather find a bit of escapism and optimism and celebrate
deeply rooted in our tastes in music. We could quickly see
it for what the country is as well. Almost with a young
where the power within the band was. It was about leaning
generation we can reclaim this country and celebrate that.
into those strengths and that gave us a real momentum. We
There is a unifying message behind our music and we
basically wrote ‘NW1’ and that set the tone of where we
want to promote that for sure.
were going.
45
Mên An Tol
What do you make of the more politically-driven punk bands then… B: I mean you can always just choose not to listen to it but it’s not for me. It’s also a bit reductionary as well, it’s better to talk about things in a more nuanced way than just shouting newspaper headlines. It’s like, we all get it, but we don’t need anymore white angry men in bands shouting about it. T: It’s also often celebrated as if people are saying something really profound. A lot of stuff like that does feel like a bit of a cop-out, like you can write a few words and then just bark it. We’re not trying to say ‘we’re cleverer than you’ or anything, we just hope to offer something that people can grab hold of and take into their hearts. We want to appeal to everyone. When you’re making such soul-stirring music you almost have no choice but to say something a little more nuanced or different, was lyricism going to be important from the outset? B: With the likes of ‘This Land’, the melody just felt quite grand so it needed to have something bigger backing it lyrically. It’s about this unifying feeling of people coming together. It’s about this country and how good it can be. There are bits of melody in there that come from an old Scottish jacobite tune as well, we try to take those melodies and messages and work it into something. It was in the DNA of the melody to really make it about people. Just to round up on, what’s the action plan, hopefully you’re not going to keep us waiting for recorded material for a year like many have recently? T: Yeah we’re hoping to get one track out in the next couple of month’s at least. The whole thing has been quite considered, we’ve taken our time to get the songs to where we want them and play the shows we want to do, all on our own terms. So we’ve waited a little bit but now it’s about getting going so watch this space!
@drawren
46
In a world where phones serve as their owners’ eyes at
What music are you drawn to on these nights?
gigs these days, there’s a malaise amongst audiences whose views are now blocked by a sea of screens. But for
J: We’re all drawn to a lot of stuff that inspires Fcukers.
Fcukers, they simply encourage one to look elsewhere, to
Anything from 90s house, to Italo to Balearic to soul.
find spaces free of flashing red recording circles and white numbered time stamps. If it makes people happy, each to
You’ve spoken a lot about 90s house as an influence,
their own.
but there are so many facets of the genre, even in the United States alone. Can you go into specifics?
This nonchalant emphasis on personal fulfilment informs all facets of Fcukers. Shanny Wise (vocals), Jackson
J: One thing that’s been forgotten in this generational
Walker Lewis (production and live instrumentation) and
overchange is how important New York house was in the
Ben Scharf (beats) didn’t start playing together for fame
90s. House is from Chicago, techno from Detroit but NY
or celebrity - they want to create music that shines a light
dance music in the 90s was heavily inspired by freestyle
on the forgotten niches of 90s New York house music and
Puerto Rican music, and then hip-hop house after that. A
have a good time whilst doing it.
lot of people forget Armand van Helden was a 90s New York DJ first - he just had more chart success across the
Electronic music has been rising on the tides of the indie
pond. Same with Todd Edwards. Other DJs from that
mainstream previously dominated by guitars. Though the
period include Louie Vega, Todd Terry, Kenny Dope and
word ‘indie’ might make music listeners scrunch up their
Junior Sanchez. Who are we to say that we’re carrying
nose in disdain (nb. such disdain is often accompanied
on that legacy? What we can say is that we’re shedding a
by an unfortunate case of memory loss regarding the
light on that music. It’s also important to remember that
individual’s adolescent music tastes), it seems as though
other NY DJs like David Morales and Roger Sanchez were
the growing acknowledgment of electronic indie music
in serious rotation at the Haçienda!
is serving to reinvent this word as a big, Fat (Dog) complement. Just think about Jockstrap, Mandy Indiana,
Even our production references this music, albeit
Lice, Fcukers. People need to dance, to let themselves go,
unintentional. After meeting Junior Sanchez when he
whether that be a solo or communal mission. Either way,
remixed ‘Mothers’ and ‘Devils Cut,’ we realised that
Fcukers’ are here to further that journey.
our analogue way of recording was exactly how DJs like Basement Jaxx were doing it in the 90s.
What makes for a good night out? Jackson: Going somewhere with good friends where the music’s the most important thing.
Words by Poppy Richler, illustration by Cécile Cuny
50
If you think about those two Fcukers tracks remixed by
J: For me, when you look back on music you’ve made
Junior Sanchez, then also about James Murphy’s ‘Los
a while ago, the happy accident is that the song even
Angeles’ which you remixed, what’s the key to a good
got written. In ‘Mothers’ there’s a sample from ‘Cosmic
rework?
Dawn/Eighth Dimension’ by Salami Rose Joe Louis, but if you asked me how I did that today I probably couldn’t
J: It’s funny because it flips. When you’re getting your
tell you. It would sound completely different. We’re lucky
own track remixed, you want it to be a beefed up version
because there’s been a dance and house music comeback
- you don’t want someone to shred it to pieces and do
over the past few years. Especially when we put out those
an Andrew Weatherall/Primal Scream gutting. But when
first two singles, they were on the earlier crest of that
we’re remixing someone else’s song, I like to gut it and
indie house wave.
barely keep anything. For example, in that James Murphy track, the only stem I kept was a single vocal loop that
Compared to your previous releases, your most recent
didn’t even come from the chorus. But it also depends on
track ‘Bon Bon’ seems heavier in terms of the bassline.
the song - if there’s a hot bassline, use that.
Does this signify the direction your music is moving in?
Speaking of other people’s songs - what was it about
J: We definitely pivoted a bit. With our EP that’s coming
‘Devil’s Haircut’ by Beck that made you want to
out in September, we wanted to show a different range of
reimagine it?
music. Another influence for us is Big Beat from the 90s artists like Fatboy Slim and Groove Armada. I’d be lying
J: Me and Shanny were hanging out one night, talking
if I said ‘Superstylin’’ by Groove Armada isn’t a reference
about ‘Homie Don’t Shake,’ our next single. It has a bit
for that track. We’ve always said to ourselves ‘fuck it,
of a ‘Devil’s Haircut’ riff and that got me wondering if
follow our curiosity, anything goes.’ This new EP also has
there was a good house remix of the song. All I could find
a veiled Caribbean vibe because Shanny goes to Jamaica
was a lot of down tempo edits. I was also watching this
a lot.
documentary on Dadaism, and Duchamp’s Fountain made me think of the relationship between readymades and
Shanny - compared to your indie projects in the past,
remixes: with remixes you’re repackaging something that
is there a different way you approach writing lyrics for
already exists. It was 4am and I was watching this video
electronic music?
of Underworld live, asking myself - what if we just added piano to the middle of the Beck track for no reason?
S: Yes and no - for everything there’s always the thought of intention. But with Fcukers, the lyrics are a bit more
Last year you booked a gig at Baby’s All Right in
outside the box compared to previous work I’ve done. I
Brooklyn as an impetus to finish your debut tracks
like using different words and sounds, different syllables,
(‘Mothers’ and ‘Devil’s Cut’). Does that time pressure
instead of focusing on a poem or story. It’s fun because
come across in the songs and were there any happy
with Fcukers there are no rules - we make songs that are
accidents happen as a result?
fun, and that fun comes from the lyrics too. They don’t have to make too much sense or be grammatically correct.
Shanny: It was very much a ‘hey can you come over we need to finish the track ASAP. Fuck we need an album
Was it always clear how this music would translate into
cover, what can we do?’ So we went to the passport photo
a live setting?
shop, took one photo, thought ‘ok that’s good’ and then it was done. There was no time to overthink the process in terms of both the artwork and recording.
51
Fcukers
Ben: It wasn’t ever obvious, but the main things we had to ask ourselves were firstly about which bits we had to copy and reinforce, but then also how to push or pull the song in different ways to make it more exciting on stage.This was different to the writing process which was very much first thought, best thought. Is it right to say that you prefer to put on ‘parties’ as opposed to ‘gigs?’ J: 100%. From the outset, all three of us had come from indie band backgrounds. There’s this venue in New York called the Mercury Lounge - the city’s oldest venue where everyone plays. I’ve worked as a sound engineer, booker and DJ, and I remember realising that you don’t have to play at 9pm at Mercury Lounge. You can find an empty pool and play there at midnight. As soon as you get your head out of the conventions, there are no limits. And in the nightclub world, those conventions don’t exist - do crazy shit and hopefully people come. B: It’s like world building - when Jackson chooses these crazy venues, he’s literally creating a map of unconventional venues for our fans. Your gigs clearly make people move, but what songs get you moving? S: ‘Catch Ya!’ - Omar S. J: ‘So In Love With You’ - Duke. B: Any 70s disco soul. What are you up to next? S: Up to no good!
@girlsandparks
52
Emerging from London’s shadowy burrows, a new band of
E: I haven’t done it in a long time, but I used to be able to
five scurries through moonlit alleys. With their debut EP,
bounce a cigarette off the top string of the guitar into my
‘fox hours’, triage sinks their teeth into a constant tension,
mouth.
capturing gothic slacker rock that can only be described as teetering on the edge of disorder. Primarily recorded at
S: I can make a back bridge.
Press Play Studios under the guidance of Sterolab’s Andy Ramsay, ‘fox hours’ was nurtured in the anxious company
O: I can drink and just not get drunk.
of nocturnal life and into the quietude of dawn. In the wake of releasing said EP and fresh off a tour
What was the first album you owned?
supporting friends bar italia, I had the pleasure of chatting with Emily (vocals), Siam (vocals/guitar), Orazio (guitar),
O: It was either ‘Room On Fire’ by The Strokes or it was
Bella (bass), and Dave (drums) to delve into the beginning
actually a bootleg of the Gorillaz first album.
chapters of triage. S: Mine was probably ‘Seeing Sounds’ by N.E.R.D As this is your first interview as a band, I thought we could start with some quick-fire questions to help ease
E: Growing up, I didn’t really have access to music easily.
you in. What was the last thing you listened to?
I had two CDs, and one of them was—they were both gifted to me—Miley Cyrus’ ‘The Climb’, her debut album.
Bella: Kurt Vile’s ‘Wakin on a Pretty Day’. Nine minutes long. Great guitars. Great song.
B: My mum gave me all her vinyl and then took it back, but I got really into Talking Heads because of that.
Orazio: High on Fire. D: Mine was when my older brother bought Skepta Dave: ‘Fake Train’ by the post-hardcore band Unwound.
‘Microphone Champion’. I was religiously listening to
We’ve really gotten into them recently.
that back in 2009.
Siam: ‘The Heartfelt’ by Figurine
Who’s the loudest, and who’s the quietest in the band?
Emily: ‘This Sad Movie’ by Con Dolore. Such a great
O: I guess we’re all quite quiet.
album! ‘The 7th’ is my favourite. B: Hmm, I don’t know about that. Have you got any party tricks? O: Maybe you might be the loudest. Maybe Bella’s the loudest.
53
Words by Will Macnab, photo by Fraser Collier
B: I don’t like that, but I think you’re probably right.
O: I was actually very, very drunk. I didn’t do my party trick that night.
Can you all agree on one album as a band favourite? Was there a point where you each felt like, “Yeah, this E: We’ve all been listening to ‘Beat’ by Bowery Electric.
is going to be something”?
B: That was a tour favourite.
E: From when Siam, Orazio, and I first started making music in the flat, we just worked quite well together. It all
O: A Flix bus favourite.
happened quite organically.
That was great; thank you. Could we start by talking
S: Yeah, from our early rehearsals. I think we sounded
about how you all met and how triage came about?
very ardent, even from the beginning. But the tour announcement was what confirmed it for me personally.
E: Siam and I were friends, then last summer, Siam, Orazio, and I all got together and started making music. It
B: Once we started doing shows, we did maybe three,
just evolved from there.
and then bar italia asked us to support them on their New Year’s show. That’s when we started to feel the momentum
O: I knew Siam through mutuals for a while. That summer,
building.
I met him at a gig, and we were like, “Oh, let’s start making music together.” Siam suggested we do it with the
Right, when I was first listening to you, apart from
three of us, as he had already been doing stuff with Emily.
maybe heavy ‘90s influences, the two bands I could
A month and a half later, we wanted to do gigs, so Bella
draw parallels to were perhaps HighSchool and bar
and Dave joined.
italia. I then saw that you supported the latter on tour.
D: I had known Siam for a while too. He mentioned that
E: Siam and I have been friends with them for a couple
he was starting a band. And then asked me to play for the
years now. I think they came to our first show and
first show.
expressed that they really enjoyed the music. They’ve been huge supporters of us ever since. It was a nice
E: And we were then just looking for a bassist, and I
dynamic to go on tour with them. It felt natural.
realised, Here’s my best friend Bella; they can play bass. As such a new band, you must have learned a lot from B: I’d actually met Orazio and Dave at a party, which
being on tour with them.
neither of you remember.
54
Can you agree on a collective favourite?
E: They were just really wonderful! They have been touring a lot and have a lot of experience in general. For example, Nina was really great about giving advice to help
D: Maybe ‘daylight robbery’?
care for your voice when doing so many shows. E: Yeah, it’s one of the first we all made together. D: We played two shows, one on that tour and one with The Midnight Audience. For the bar italia show, we played
Something that I love about it is this really
early on, and everyone came really early just to see what
uncomfortable dissonance in a lot of the songs. Is this
was going on. In London, people don’t come until a lot
how you would describe your sound?
later. There were just a lot more people in the crowd, the energy was better, and more people dancing. I think that
B: Yeah, there are levels of dissonance that we like, and
made us perform a lot better. I liked that about Berlin,
there’s a balance to strike within that. I personally like the
people were dancing.
level of distance we have. It works.
B: Not to generalise, but London can feel a bit self-
O: I never learned chords on the guitar—the actual major/
conscious. Most of the time, we do know a lot of the
minor thing. I just play what I think sounds good. I guess
people. I enjoyed those European shows, not knowing
maybe the dissonance comes from those chords; it just
anyone there.
happens naturally. There’s all these words on Rate Your Music: sleepy, nocturnal, depressing, and really anxious.
A couple of you have played in bands before; with the
They’re pretty on it with descriptors on there.
state of British politics, would you say that things like that have felt harder to get/do?
How much do you think this sound has evolved from your initial visions of the band?
O: I may not be the person to ask because I have a European passport. But yeah, it’s definitely gotten more
E: I don’t know if there was a particular vision. In a way,
difficult.
it just became what it was. The goal was to be able to express ourselves and make honest music with feeling.
E: It’s hard in general, especially for new bands, to fund it. That’s the biggest aspect: the logistics of doing it
O: When we started, before doing anything, we just hung
when you are in an unsigned band. You don’t have the
out and listened to music for hours; that’s where a lot of
same resources to pull from, and everything’s insanely
our musical references have really come from.
expensive. Even just getting your gear there is so hard when you can’t really take flights unless you have flight
And lastly, what would you say is next for triage?
cases. E: We actually just lost our rehearsal space, so that would I wanted to move on to ‘fox hours’. I have been
be our next goal. For myself, I would be really happy if
listening to it a lot over the last couple of weeks, and
we could keep playing together for as long as possible.
think it sounds really great. In your own words, what
I just really enjoy everybody’s company. I really like
would you say it’s about?
making music with them. That’s the goal.
S: There’s a number of themes involved. For me, when
B: To be able to make enough money to do it without
I’m writing, I’m thinking of regrets, desires, school,
losing any creative control is a dream.
insecurities, struggles, paranoia, sorrow, and spite. O: We want to keep writing new songs and record an album.
55
triage
Editors Sam Ford
Josh Whettingsteel
Writers Sam Ford
Peter Martin
Amber Lashley Leo Lawton
Eve Boothroyd
Teddy Maloney Elvis Thirlwell Reuben Cross
Rhys Buchanan Poppy Richler Will Macnab
Printed By Ex Why Zed
info@soyoungmagazine.com
Artists
Josh Whettingsteel
Hanneke Rozemuller
Aleksandra Georgieva Cameron JL West Laura Simonati Yuka Masuko
Victoria Nikolova Cassady Moll REN
Cécile Cuny
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