LEILA DEHGHAN: Animal Rights, Human Rights, Veganism

WHERE AND WHEN DID YOUR PLANT BASED JOURNEY BEGIN?

I had been vegetarian on and off since the human dissection course at medical school. The human muscle fibres resembled the meat in my food and I felt nauseated at the thought of eating meat, it felt like I was eating human flesh. So, I ditched meat except fish. That was the beginning of my journey although it had nothing to do with animals. But like everyone else, I thought I had to eat meat. Once in a while I’d force myself to have some meat, usually kebab. Over the years I started to dislike the taste of meat. I’m one of those vegans who doesn’t like anything that tastes like meat. I’ve never tried any of the available meat-alternatives.

WHAT TIPPED YOU INTO A VEGAN LIFESTYLE?

In 2013 I got involved in dog rescue. By then I was fully vegetarian, and I thought by being vegetarian I wasn’t harming the animals. Then one day a fellow rescuer posted a onehour YouTube video by Gary Yourofsky. I watched the video and went vegan then and there.

HOW DO YOU UNDERSTAND VEGANISM? AND HOW DO YOU ‘TRANSLATE’ THE WORD WHEN REQUIRED?

I believe veganism is the ultimate form of compassion. Once you truly accept animals as sentient beings, your whole world view changes. Most of us don’t ever consider what it means to be a sentient human being, so in a way when we start seeing animals as sentient beings, we can’t help but extend our compassion to ALL beings, animals and humans. So, it turns into a social justice movement with compassion as its main principle: doing the least harm to animals and humans.

Sadly, most non-English languages don’t have a good translation for the word “veganism” and using the English word can alienate non-English speakers who perceive the idea of veganism as yet another tool of colonialism.

MAINSTREAM VEGANISM COMES OVER AS VERY ‘WHITE’ SOMETIMES. DO YOU AGREE WITH THAT?

Oh yes! And not just sometimes. Mainstream veganism IS white. Full. Stop.

WHAT WOULD HELP CHANGE THAT PERCEPTION?

It’s not easy and won’t happen anytime soon because “whiteness” is the norm. The white western hegemony is systemic AND global. As a result, we all, even people of colour living in the west, but also people in Asia or Africa, have learned supremacist ideas. It’s ingrained in us. I use “we”, and “us” because we’re all complicit in perpetuating this supremacy system. Recognising this is the first step. Only then can we be open enough to notice when white supremacy shows up in our messaging, posts and actions. Other practical steps involve listening to vegans of colour, giving them a platform in the mainstream vegan news outlets and events and checking whether the vegans of colour who have been offered a seat at the table are acting “mainstream” because of internalised racism. Having vegans of colour who are mainstream is not diversity and only adds to the problem. That’s a tough one though because whiteness is the norm and nobody questions anybody who acts “white”.

CONFIDENCE CAN BE A KEY FACTOR FOR SOME PEOPLE – DO YOU HAVE SOME THOUGHTS ON THAT?

Sure, having confidence is very important, especially for people of colour who are routinely being overlooked and whose skills are being downplayed.

WHAT WOULD YOU LIKE TO SEE FROM THE MAIN ANIMAL GROUPS IN THE UK?

If we truly want a vegan world, then diversity is crucial. Having people from different backgrounds, ethnicities and religions is the only way to dismantle the stereotypes linked with veganism. And recognising that all oppressions are interconnected and we cannot fight one oppression - animal cruelty - and ignore food injustice, social injustice, racism, health inequity - just to name a few. As Audre Lorde says, “There is no hierarchy of oppression.”

SOLIDARITY AND ALLYSHIP ARE VERY MUCH UNDER THE MICROSCOPE SINCE THE BLM PROTESTS IN 2020.

THE RECENT RESPONSE IN THE UK TO THE ATROCITIES IN PALESTINE WAS NOTICEABLE – ANIMAL GROUPS WERE VERY QUIET.

A white vegan commented on one of my posts and defended the silence of the vegan organisations by saying that BLM was considered “standard” whereas the opinions on the Israeli aggression against Palestinians are divided. He said vegan organisations would lose support by choosing sides and if our goal is to make people aware of veganism, then it’s better not to take sides.

In his naivety he disclosed the real reason. Last year BLM was fashionable and black people were calling out anybody who was being quiet, but being pro-Palestine is not fashionable yet. Last year, a vegan influencer posted “it’s time we all stand against injustice. Everything else is a distraction.” This year the response to the injustice in Palestine was deafening silence.

YOU’VE BEEN VERY VOCAL ABOUT PALESTINE RECENTLY - WHAT CAN ALLIES DO TO HELP MORE?

Neutrality only helps the oppressor. Dr Kahn, a famous plant-based doctor, publicly called the killings of Palestinians “ethical” and “justified”. Unfollow him on social media and if you’re brave enough, post the reason. Spread the word about what’s going on in Palestine. Show your support in a public way. Donate to the organisations such as “Plant the Land Team Gaza” that are helping the Palestinians and invite your followers to do the same. If you’re an influencer and have a platform, use it to raise awareness. There are many ways people can help - silence is not one of them.

I often hear people say they’re intersectional vegans, and although I do understand what they’re trying to say, I don’t agree with that terminology. We all are intersectional beings, whether we like it or not. We have a wide range of experiences based on our different social identities - gender identity, ethnicity, skin colour, sexuality, disability, class, culture, occupation…it’s not an exhaustive list - and the intersection of these identities shape our individual experiences. Certain identities won’t change, eg skin colour, ethnicity, but others may change (eg job, disability). All these social identities play a role in how privileged someone is, whether they’re being discriminated against or not, whether they’re represented in the media or not. Understanding how these social identities overlap is important if we want equity - which is different than equality. Without intersectionality the lived experiences of marginalised groups will be ignored.

Many countries and cultures are routinely subjected to abusive comments by the vegans in the west because of a festival or practice that involves abuse to animals.

YOU HAVE TALKED PREVIOUSLY ABOUT INTERSECTIONALITY, AND ‘FIXED’ AND ‘FLUID’ IDENTITIES – COULD YOU EXPAND ON THAT A BIT?

HOW DO YOU RESPOND IF YOU HEAR PEOPLE EXPRESS THAT ‘ONLY WHITE PEOPLE CAN BE RACIST’?

Let me start by giving a definition of race and racism. Race is a social construct. Race has been created to justify racism. Racism is about domination; it’s the oppression of a marginalised group in the society by the dominant race. In the west, the dominant race is white. We live in a society where the white race has the power.

Last year’s events demonstrated clearly that we don’t have equal power, status and opportunities in the society.

Sure, a person of colour can be discriminatory and abusive towards a white person, they can express racial prejudice, but that’s NOT racism. Saying that white people are subjected to racism is an attempt to make light of the racism people of colour are subjected to. It’s an attempt to minimise their lived experience. I know this is a hard pill to swallow for white people, but if we want equity and not equality, we need to have these difficult conversations. If we want animal liberation, we also need to fight for ALL oppressed sentient beings. As long as we keep silent when a group of people are being treated as “the other”, be it based on their race, sexual orientation, religion or what have you, we’re endorsing the idea of “otherizing” and perpetuating the myth that animals can be exploited as the other. So, by excluding all the other forms of oppression from the discussion, we actually harm the very animals we allegedly care about.

First do no harm - that’s always been my principle. I urge the public in the west to stop blaming and criticising a whole culture and country for their so-called “barbaric” traditions and practices. This makes it so hard for the grassroots movements in those countries to spread the vegan message.

THERE IS OFTEN A MISUNDERSTANDING AMONGST THE VEGAN COMMUNITY THAT VEGANISM IS ‘ONLY’ ABOUT THE ANIMALS, AND THAT SOMEHOW HUMAN RIGHTS ISSUES ‘DERAIL’ OR ‘GET IN THE WAY’ OF ANIMALS. HOW WOULD YOU EXPLAIN THAT THIS ISN’T REALLY THE CASE?

CAN WE DO MORE TO HELP OTHER COUNTRIES INCREASE THE DEVELOPMENT OF VEGANISM? AND IF SO, WHAT WOULD YOU PRIORITISE?

I often see a lot of anti-Asian, especially anti-China, sentiments on social media because of the Yulin festival. Then there’s the anti-Islam comments because of the halal slaughter. Many countries and cultures are routinely subjected to abusive comments by the vegans in the west because of a festival or practice that involves abuse to animals. First do no harm - that’s always been my principle. I urge the public in the west to stop blaming and criticising a whole culture and country for their so-called “barbaric” traditions and practices. This makes it so hard for the grassroots movements in those countries to spread the vegan message. Next, we need to realise that each country has different politics, cultures and even relationship to the west, so there’s no one answer. However, if a vegan organisation in the west is genuinely interested in helping to raise awareness in another country, they need o ask someone from that country while making sure not to make it all about themselves. What those countries certainly don’t need is another “white saviour”.

WHAT ARE YOUR HOPES FOR THE FUTURE?

I pray for more compassion in the world, compassion towards ourselves, other humans and animals. I hope that we humans start communicating with each other without becoming defensive. The future of the world depends on us working together and we can only do that from a place of peace, kindness and understanding.