Comic Book Artist Special Edition 1 Preview by TwoMorrows Publishing

DON’T ASK WHY--IT’S HERE!! IT’S NOW!!!

CBA

COMIC BOOK ARTIST

NO. l DEC.

S P E C I A L

E D I T I O N

KIRBY’S HERE!

HEATH

TOTH

ADAMS

WRIGHTSON

TIMM

S P E C I A L NO. 1

CELEBRATING

THE

LIVES & WORK

OF THE

E D I T I O N

GREAT CARTOONISTS, WRITERS & EDITORS

2013

EDITOR’S RANT: ON COOKES, MOOKS, AND COMIC BOOKS Ye Ed tries to get on his mom’s good side ..........................................1 MARK EVANIER: THE UNKNOWN KIRBY True Divorce Cases! Soul Love! Uncle Carmine’s Fat City Comix! Our interview with Mark Evanier gives us the skinny on the King’s unrealized ’70s DC work! ............................................2 STEVE SHERMAN: JACK KIRBY’S SUPERWORLD Starbaby, The Ship, and Jack’s Superworld of Everything— Kirby’s ’70s assistant reveals more of Jack’s hitherto unknown “could-of-beens”! ........................................................................15 RUSS HEATH OF EASY COMPANY War artist extraordinaire talks about Haunted Tanks, Sea Devils, Pterodactyl Guy, Cowgirls at War, Sgt. Rock and more of his superb DC Comics material ............................18

©2013 DC Comics COPYRIGHTS: Adam Strange, Batman, Big Barda, Cain, Darkseid, The Demon, Female Furies, Forever People, Jimmy Olsen, Kalibak, Haunted Tank, Kamandi, Lightray, Lois Lane, Mantis, Mister Miracle, New Gods, Newsboy Legion, OMAC, Orion, Sea Devils, Sgt. Rock & Easy Co., Superman, Two-Face ©2013 DC Comics Galaxy Green, Superworld ©2013 The Kirby Estate. Gemini ©2013 Steve Ditko. Hot Wheels ©2013 Mattel. Dr. Faustus, Lilith ©2013 Marvel Characters, Inc. Conan ©2013 Conan Properties, Inc. Tarzan ©2013 Edgar Rice Burroughs, Inc. Cowgirls at War ©2013 National Lampoon Inc. The Shadow ©2013 Condé Nast. Gunsmoke, Victory at Sea, Rip Kirby ©2013 their respective copyright holders. Visit CBA on the Web at: www.twomorrows.com Please send all letters of comment, articles and artwork to: Jon B. Cooke, Editor Comic Book Artist P.O. Box 204 West Kingston, RI 02892-0204 e-mail: jonbcooke@aol.com

ALEX TOTH: BEFORE I FORGET From Hot Wheels to The Witching Hour, romance to war, the quintessential “black-&-white” comics artist writes about his ’70s DC masterpieces (and The Shadow that got away!).... 30

THE GREATEST: NEAL ADAMS’ SUPERMAN VS. MUHAMMAD ALI Frequent CBA contributor (and our logo designer!) Arlen Schumer goes a few rounds with Neal Adams about perhaps the eminent artist’s finest work for DC, lavishly illustrated with unseen work by the master! ........................................36 BERNIE WRIGHTSON: DARK COMEDY Writer Bruce Jones gives us a glimpse of the Master Artist of the Macabre in this 1977 appreciation, plus an astounding portfolio of Bernie’s ’70s work ............................................56 SEXTET: A DC ODDITY............................65 BRUCE TIMM: YOUNG GOD OF SUPERTOWN Our most excellent cover artist gives us the lowdown on the animated Fourth World, Kirby’s babes, his sparse comics work, and what Jack means to him ..............................................66 HEMBECK’S DATELINE: @#!$?%! Oh, man, it’s… OMAC! ..................................73 Front cover by Bruce Timm. Back cover by Neal Adams. Superman vs. Muhammad Ali, Big Barda, Superman ©2013 DC Comics

COMIC BOOK ARTIST SPECIAL EDITION 1 is published by TwoMorrows Publishing, 10407 Bedfordtown Drive, Raleigh, NC 27614, USA. 919-449-0344 E-mail: store@twomorrowspubs.com. Jon B. Cooke, Editor. John Morrow, Publisher. Editorial Office: P.O. Box 204, West Kingston, RI 02892-0204 USA. First Printing. All characters are © their respective companies. All material is © their creators unless otherwise noted. All editorial matter is © their respective authors. ©2013 TwoMorrows/Jon B. Cooke.

CBA Interview

Conducted by Jon B. Cooke Transcribed by Jon B. Knutson Mark Evanier—columnist for the Comics Buyer’s Guide, television writer, and perennial creative cohort of Sergio Aragonés—received his first professional break (along with Steve Sherman) as assistant to the King, Jack Kirby. Now writing the definitive biography of the great comic book artist, Mark has an astonishing grasp of the entire history of comics and is an engaging interviewee. The writer has always been a vocal supporter of the TwoMorrows magazine group and I’d like to publically thank him for the enormous help he’s given this lowly editor over the years. Mark was interviewed via telephone for two sessions, Oct. 10 and 20, 1999, and he copyedited the transcript. Comic Book Artist: How did you start working with Jack? Mark Evanier: Well, I met Jack in July of 1969. I was just one of your geeky grade-level fans, but we got along very well. He saw some of my writing, and was for some inexplicable reason, impressed. Jack actually—God knows why—got it in his head that I could help out with artwork, which is kind of like Arnold Palmer picking someone out of the stands to do his putting for him. CBA: Were you a cartoonist? Mark: I was doing a little drawing, but I had absolutely no pretensions of ever making a nickel at it. I did it just for fun. In my whole life, I was never naive enough to think I could ever make a living as an artist. CBA: You’re really quite a mimic with signatures and such. Mark: Well, Jack was impressed that I could do his signature better than he could, he claimed. He was also impressed with my work on the Marvelmania magazine and other things I had done, but I think just generally, we got along. A stream of local comics fans had traipsed out to visit him, not only because he was Jack Kirby but also because he was the first comic book artist in L.A. who was even remotely approachable. Roz later

told me that, of all the people he was meeting, I was the one he most connected with as somebody who understood his odd way of speaking. I think a lot of fans came to him wanting sketches and autographs and freebies, and so on. I just wanted his wisdom and counsel. CBA: So you had no mercenary inclination. Mark: None. I wasn’t even at that point interested in working in comics. I’m as surprised as anyone that I’m in the business at all. More surprised, actually, because when I grew up, the prevailing wisdom was that if you didn’t live in New York, you didn’t work in comics. CBA: So Steve Sherman, Jack’s other assistant in those days, was your friend at the time? Mark: Yes, we had a comic book club, and Steve was a member. He just showed up at a meeting one day, and we became buddies. What happened was there was a science-fiction convention in Santa Monica in the summer of 1969—I think it was actually the July 4th weekend. I didn’t attend, but Jack did. He and Roz paid admission, and a lot of comics fans, members of our club, were there and word spread, “Oh, my God, Jack Kirby is here!” They all met him and got autographs, and Jack invited a couple of them to the house, and I tagged along. Our secretary, Rob Solomon, and our treasurer, Mike Rotblatt, had said to him, “Mr. Kirby, we have a comic book club, and we’d love to have you as a guest speaker at one of our meetings.” That was their excuse just to talk to him, and he said, “Great, why don’t you come to the house and let’s talk about it!” Jack was new in Southern California. He and Roz had only been here for a couple of months, and they were looking to make contact with the local writers and artists. Jack had a dream at that point that he was going to someday, in some fashion, start a West Coast comic book company. The Kirbys were a little isolated, living in Irvine, California so he invited our officers, and since I was President, I went along. We got along great and I ended up seeing him a couple of times after that, mostly through my involvement with a mail order firm I worked for briefly called Marvelmania (where I was handling Marvel merchandise). One day, he and Roz came down to Marvelmania, and they took Steve and myself to lunch. We went to Canter’s Delicatessen, where Jack told us, “I’m leaving Marvel. I’m going over to DC, and I’m going to be editing a bunch of books. I need a staff; would you guys like to work for me?” We thought it over for about four seconds, and said, “Absolutely.” I had no idea what the job would encompass or even if there was any money involved, but you don’t say no to Jack Kirby! CBA: He’s the King, eh? Mark: Right. We sat on the secret that he was leaving Marvel for about a month as he finished the final parameters of his deal. Finally, one day he called and said, “I just talked to Stan, it’s finished,

to give him the best deal in the place, when he, in fact, had not shown much loyalty to the company over the years. You’ve got to remember this was a time when DC had been throwing bodies out the door, and an awful lot of guys who’d worked for them for many, many years had either been eased out of their jobs, or outright fired. Whether the dismissals were justified or not, most of those who remained were very concerned that DC was forgetting about people who had been loyal to the company for years, and who had delivered in many cases books that had been relatively successful. So, all of a sudden, they’re being told there’s a new generation going on here, there’s a new wave, and…. CBA: They resented it. Mark: Yeah, anyone would. CBA: Was the idea for Jack to “Marvelize” DC?

you can tell anyone you want.” It set off shockwaves throughout the business. CBA: Jack came to DC in late Summer 1970. So the deal was done in the Spring? Mark: It was in early March, if I’m not mistaken. CBA: Do you think Carmine Infantino had a hard time “selling” Jack Kirby to DC, so to speak, because of Kirby’s previous problems with Jack Schiff? Mark: I think it was a couple of things. A lot of people at DC did not like Marvel Comics. They did not like Marvel artwork. They did not like Marvel style stories, and they believed DC was producing a superior product. The thinking was, “Why would we even want Marvel’s best artist when all their books stink?” That was kind of the attitude that some— not all—people there had. It was one of the factors that ultimately made Jack uncomfortable at DC. CBA: But other than inhouse staff sentiment, that wasn’t necessarily coming from Jack Liebowitz? Mark: I don’t know. CBA: One could speculate if Liebowitz didn’t want it, it wouldn’t have happened, right? Mark: Not necessarily. At that point, Liebowitz had moved upstairs, and Infantino was assuming more and more power. Liebowitz may have thought bringing in Kirby was a bad idea, but Carmine fought for it. It doesn’t necessarily mean Liebowitz would’ve either vetoed it or loved the notion—those were not the only two alternatives. He might have grudgingly felt that since Carmine was taking over, Carmine had to be given what he wanted. I don’t know exactly where the reticence came from. CBA: Possibly Sol Harrison? Mark: Well, Harrison never liked Jack’s work. That was not a secret. Sol was quite unabashed about it. CBA: Schiff still had friends at DC. Mark: Yes, but I think one of the things that was operative then was that you had a staff of people who’d been loyal to the company for (in some cases) 20-30 years. Some of them weren’t thrilled to see some guy brought in, and to suddenly be told this guy is the new star of the day, and we’re going

CBA Interview

Jack Kirby’s Superworld Steve Sherman Recalls Unseen Kirby Koncepts Conducted by Jon B. Cooke Assistant to Jack Kirby in the 1970s, Steve Sherman was witness to one of the most fertile and creative epochs in the King’s remarkable career. Steve not only composed the letter columns (along with Mark Evanier for a time), but also devised concepts for Jack’s final DC book, Kobra. Now a renowned puppeteer in the film industry (with M.I.B., Mighty Joe Young, and other movies to his credit), Steve was kind enough to answer some questions via e-mail this past October. Comic Book Artist: Do you recall any specific projects that Jack developed that never made it to publication? Steve Sherman: I can only recall two. One was a female robot character. Jack had the idea and I did a photo mock-up cover for it. I think the title was Starbaby. The reason it was a photo cover was because Jack was very intrigued with fumetti type comics (these are comic books done with photographs, mostly either Italian or Mexican in origin). Jack felt they really hadn't been done properly. I don't know if Jack wrote it down somewhere or not. That was as far as it got. The other was a concept called The Ship. It was sort of a Challengers of the Unknown type of saga. A group of ordinary people discover an alien spaceship which they use to fight evil. They keep discovering all kinds of different weapons and things that the ship can do. CBA: Can you remember the genesis of True Divorce Cases? Steve: That book came along the same time Jack was developing Spirit World and In The Days of the Mob. He was very excited about it, and thought it was an interesting approach to an adult comics magazine—sort of the darker side of romance comics. CBA: What was behind changing True Divorce into Soul Love? Steve: Well, I can only go by what Jack told me. According to him, the publisher of DC Comics had a certain religious aversion to divorce, and just didn't like it. However, one of the distributors who happened to handle the books in Harlem felt that a comic targeted to a Black audience would go over. So, we started working on Soul Love. Jack didn't seem to mind at all. He jumped right into it. Mark Evanier and I felt a bit awkward about it. It seemed to us that Black writers and artists should be the ones working on it, but we went ahead and did it anyway. I think we wrote the story about a goofy Black guy on a roller coaster. Sort of pre-Urkel. CBA: Did Jack have specific spin-off plans for some of his Fourth World concepts? Steve: Not that I can remember. He pretty much took everything book-by-book. If anything, I think that he would have been happy just doing New Gods, Forever People and Mr. Miracle. That was

what he was concentrating on. Jack only did Jimmy Olsen because DC wanted him to do a Superman book. CBA: What was the idea behind Superworld? Steve: I recall Jack calling it the Superworld of Everything. It was going to be an anthology magazine featuring different strips by a variety of artists. I guess it would have been something along the lines of the early issues of Heavy Metal, only on cheaper paper. CBA: Any relationship between Superworld and Uncle Carmine’s Fat City Comix? Steve: I think that Uncle Carmine’s FCC evolved out of Superworld. It all came about because Jack wanted to try different things. He wanted to break out of the 6" x 10" 32-page comic book format. He was very impressed by Steranko’s History of Comics, and liked the format—that’s one of the reasons why the Kirby Unleashed portfolio was the same size.

CBA Interview

Russ Heath of Easy Co. Interview with the Artist on His DC War Comics Duty Conducted by Jon B. Cooke Transcribed by Jon B. Knutson

It is legend that in the early ’70s, when a new job would arrive at the DC offices from Russ’ Chicago studio, all work would stop, and the bullpen would wait in nervous anticipation as the package was unwrapped, so they could be the first to see the latest opus from a master. In a comic con program book, renowned writer/editor Archie Goodwin wrote in his tribute to Russ: “Artist’s artist. That’s something you read somewhere. I haven’t heard anyone in comics actually say it. What I do hear said is: ‘You see what that crazy bastard Heath did this month?’ And everyone stops and looks at the new ‘Sgt. Rock’ and shakes their head. Then they go back to their drawing boards or their typewriters or wherever, and maybe they work a little longer, try a little harder. And maybe it has nothing to do with a crazy bastard like Russ Heath. But maybe it does.” After over 50 years in the industry, Russ is still hard at work producing glorious work, and he continues to be our inspiration. Look for a special tribute issue in the coming year. The artist was interviewed on July 22, 1999, and he copyedited the transcript. Comic Book Artist: While you worked for Timely/Atlas with Stan Lee, were you looking to get a gig at DC? Russ Heath: Well, the business in those days, it used to be up one year and down the next, and so on—sometimes a lot worse, and sometimes not so bad—but there was a big break around 1950, somewhere in there, and I ended up doing some of Joe Kubert’s 3-D book, Tor. And then I went over to DC and showed my stuff to Bob Kanigher, and he gave me a war story to draw. CBA: How did you get hooked up with Kubert? Was it through Joe, or his partner, Norm Maurer? Russ: Well, they were working together at St. John’s offices, and I was going everywhere—I had a list of 15 places to go—and I went over there, and I talked to Norm first. As I’m about to open my portfolio, Kubert walks in and says, “He doesn’t have to show that. He’s okay.” Which was very flattering! CBA: So Kubert knew your work from Atlas? Russ: Right. CBA: And Kubert and Maurer were really cooking with the 3-D stuff then, weren’t they? Russ: Yeah, they were working around the clock. CBA: Did Kubert tell you to go over to DC, or did you just go over there on your own? Russ: I can’t remember… it could’ve been either way, or both.

CBA: Recall your first meeting with Bob Kanigher? Russ: Not really… it was, “Show your samples, and here’s a script.” CBA: Was “Golden Gladiator” [from The Brave and the Bold] your first DC work? Russ: The first was a war story, I think it was a winter story about ice and then, when I finished that one, I got another one… I’m not sure of the order of when the “Golden Gladiator” thing…. CBA: That was ’55 or so… after the Comics Code came along. You did some work for Kubert, and then Harvey Kurtzman at EC, at the same time? Russ: I met Harvey at Atlas in 1946, when I was working there, and he was doing the “Hey, Look!”

one-page strips. I guess we went out to lunch and one thing led to another. Then I did a story for his Frontline Combat, I think. Then I worked on everything—all the magazines he ever got into— such as Trump, Humbug, and Help! Through the years, we’d go to lunch, and he’d give me a job. CBA: For decades on end, right? Russ: Yes, through “Little Annie Fanny.” CBA: Were you ever exclusive to anybody, or were you always freelancing? Russ: I might’ve been exclusive once in a while, but not by intention. It’d been because they kept giving me another job when I went in, and I didn’t have to work elsewhere. But I did find out and learned a lesson that even the nicest editor—if you’re only working for him—has got you under his foot, and he can’t resist grinding the heel in. And I thought, “What a strange thing human nature is.” I always tried to have something else going. CBA: Nonetheless, you did a huge body of work for DC in the late ’50s/early ’60s. Was it like they

say: You went to Kanigher’s office, delivered a job, picked up a check and a new job at the same time? Russ: Yeah, or I’d go to lunch and Bob would write a story during lunch. He was that quick. CBA: Were stories being tailored to you? Did you have particular strengths that Bob saw? Russ: Well, they’d start you on a feature. I did some “Robin Hood,” and some “Golden Gladiator.” It’s like, “All right, you’ve done the ‘Golden Gladiator,’ and we’ve got this stuff on hand, so we’ll give you some ‘Robin Hood.’” CBA: As part of Bob’s group of artists, were you exclusively on his books? Russ: It wasn’t by design; you were just working for him, and someone else was working for Julie Schwartz. CBA: Did you ever lean over to Julie and say, “Hey, got anything?” Russ: What he was doing wasn’t up my line. CBA: You were where you were supposed to be, so to speak. But you could’ve done other genres,

Below: Possibly Russ’s epitome as one of DC’s finest war artists: The double-page splash to “Easy’s First Tiger,” Our Army at War #244. This also features a very rare turn of Russ as writer. Courtesy of the artist. ©1999 DC Comics, Inc.

Alex Toth: Before I Forget The Artist Discusses His ’70s DC Comics Work

CBA Collection Extra!

The Greatest! Neal Adams on his masterpiece, Superman vs. Muhammad Ali Conducted by Arlen Schumer Transcribed by Jon B. Knutson Below: We found this partially unused full-body image of Ali and Kal-El in Neal’s thumbnails, though the upper-body portion was adapted for the book’s final two-page spread. Art ©2000 Neal Adams. Superman ©2000 DC Comics.

[Editor’s Note: I may be in the minority fandom opinion on this, but I’ve long felt that Neal Adams’ Superman vs. Muhammad Ali was his best work for DC Comics. Ever. It appeared on the stands in late 1977—just as I was losing interest in comics, and Neal’s storytelling and technique simply blew me away. So I asked Neal and my pal (interviewer/designer/historian extraordinaire) Arlen Schumer, if they could do a brief interview about the story behind the story. In phenomenally short turnaround time, Neal gave us the definitive interview on the project, Arlen sent us original art and the tapes, and transcriber

Jon B. Knutson finished the transcript in record time. CBA presented an edited version of the transcript—about half the size of this interview—in CBA Special Edition #1. What follows is the entire transcript, illustrated with plenty of new artwork. This interview was conducted in Neal’s Continuity Studio on Nov. 12, 1999.—JBC] Arlen Schumer: Let’s start with the cover: Originally, this project at DC Comics was going to be drawn by Joe Kubert, and for whatever reason, the Muhammad Ali people weren’t happy with the likenesses, and somehow the idea came up, “Maybe we can get Neal to work on it.” Neal Adams: Clearly, DC was having a problem with likenesses, and Ali’s people weren’t happy, so they had me take a try. They were happy with my likenesses, and basically, that was the turning point, and the reason I got the project. When I saw Joe’s original cover (he hadn’t done detail to the background) with the two figures, I thought, “Gee, you know, no matter what I do, I don’t think I’m going to come up with a better layout than Joe.” So I essentially took his layout, and just put my own drawing into it, and if somebody recognizes the pose of, say, Superman as not being a typical Neal Adams pose, it’s a Joe Kubert pose, adapted to my style. Arlen: I remember looking at this at the time, thinking, “This cover doesn’t quite look like Neal.” Neal: I wanted to keep Joe’s name attached to it, and by using his layout, I paid homage to it. Because this is a classic Kubert layout: The one foot up, and the shoulder. The big question that entered my mind was, I knew it would have a wraparound cover, so how do I then make it an event? And I thought, “Why don’t I put famous people on the cover watching the match?” Arlen: Kubert’s layout had a generic audience. Neal: I don’t think he was focused on the audience at that point; he was looking to get a layout done, and just show the main figures. So, I started to put in some famous people. Naturally, the President would be there if the Earth is in jeopardy, as would various other people—and for some reason, it caught on at DC Comics. They thought, “Well, why don’t we put famous people there?” The logic says make it an event. So, I started to do that. I didn’t have any idea what I had let myself in for. [laughter] I simply had no idea. Arlen: What do you mean? You knew you had to do likenesses…. Neal: If you count them, I think there’s something like 170 different likenesses there. For a cover, that’s a lot of drawings. You don’t really do that—but I guess I was caught up in it, in that, for instance, I had just met Kurt Vonnegut and I thought, “Gee, Vonnegut would be at this fight.” Certainly Ali’s trainers would be there, and of course, if Superman were there, Lex Luthor would be there, [laughter] and Batman would be there... well, by the time I got that stuff going, we got carried away—it just turned into this ball of string that I just couldn’t unravel. And it got to the point where I was saying, “If there’s a circle there, I ought to put a person there... where do I stop?” [laughter] Where does it end? Well, it just never ended, we just kept on going and going and going. Arlen: As a former employee of yours, I remember one of your lessons in drawing was, when one has to do a crowd, design it in such a way that you suggest a crowd…. Neal: That was one of those times that I should’ve stuck with one of my own rules! [laughter] Once the idea was presented up at DC, the question was: Should we get permission from these people to put them on the cover, or should we not? My feeling was, “I don’t see

Below: Preliminary version of the legendary cover featuring Neal’s likenesses of at least 17 celebrities who ultimately declined to be used. Note the ringside use of Telly Savalas (smoking, no less!) who was easily transformed into Luthor. Another treasure found by Tom Ziuko and courtesy of Neal Adams. Art ©2000 Neal Adams. Superman ©2000 DC Comics.

why we’d have to get permission. If it was an editorial decision, that essentially these people would be at this thing, if you put drawings of people on a comic book cover, it’s just a comic book. You’re not really saying anything or implying anything, so I don’t think there’s any reason for it.” Well, for whatever reason, it was decided, “Well, why don’t we ask anyway?” Maybe it was the publicity…. Arlen: And thus, the biggest can of worms was opened. Neal: The logical thought was that everybody would say, “Yes, who cares?” And certainly, a majority of people said yes. There were people who decided not to say yes… why, I have no idea. Assuming that they would say yes, I went ahead and put them in. So, then we started to get responses (and most people were very cooperative, and very generous, and I’m sure that even the people who rejected the idea were very generous and very cooperative), some just decided on that day, “I don’t feel like giving my permission.” You know, it’s sort of a flip of a coin. They just said no, or yes, whatever. So, there were people I just left out—but there were other people I’d already put in there. For example, John Wayne decided he didn’t want to be in it, but I’d already drawn him. So I decided, “I don’t want to take him out, but on the other hand, I don’t want everybody to know it’s John Wayne.” So we put a mustache on him. So, if you look very carefully on the front cover, you’ll see a guy with a mustache sitting right next to Johnny Carson, and sure enough, that’s John Wayne with a mustache. You’ll see next to Ron Howard, is a guy with a mustache—that’s Fonzie [Henry Winkler] with different hair and a mustache. Arlen: So, basically, anybody with a mustache is somebody that didn’t give approval? [laughs] Neal: Well, I can’t guarantee that! It becomes a game to look around and find people who might not have given permission. We tried, but it got to be like a silly joke after a while. I thought, “Oh, God, what are we doing?” So, there were a whole bunch of people I

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George C. Scott Art Garfunkel Paul Newman & Joanne Woodward Elton John Bob Dylan John Denver

really had to put aside, if I had to take them out, but in some cases, I did the mustache thing. So there are, again, over 170 people on this cover... big, big project! The two figures in the middle? The easiest part of the cover! [laughter] Remember, I had to have photographs to work from, and I then had to draw these people so small, yet the likenesses had to be there, so people wouldn’t come to me later and say, “Gee, that doesn’t look like so-and-so.” It’s a professional thing to not miss the likeness. Also, all the people who were not stars on the cover, but people I liked, I didn’t want to disappoint them, and put them in such a way that you couldn’t recognize who they are. So the game with this comic book, of course, if anybody can find it, is to play that little game of “Find out who all those people are.” Arlen: Whose idea was it to do this comic in the first place? Neal: I think it generated like lava, from some swamp beneath the earth, and it suddenly appeared. [laughs] My memory says that Julie Schwartz had something to do with it, and of course, without knowledge, I’d love to give Julie credit for the whole idea, but I guess you’d have to ask him. Certainly, when I heard it, I thought it was a great idea. I mean, just the concept... yet, at the same time, the logical question is, “How do you have a human being fight an alien—Superman—and how do you justify such a battle?” We had to come up with an answer. Arlen: Let’s back up for a minute. Once you did your thing, and were approved, in a sense, as the artist, were there any other creative people involved? Neal: Denny O’Neil was certainly involved, and both Denny and I had to be approved, not by DC Comics or by Muhammad Ali, but by Elijah Muhammad [head of the Nation of Islam, the American Black Muslim organization]. Elijah Muhammad had to decide whether or not we were okay to do this book. Remember, Cassius Clay had accepted Islam as his religion, changed his name to Muhammad Ali,

7 John Travolta, Gabe Kaplan, & Lawrence Hilton-Jacobs

8 Charlton Heston & Bob Mitchum 9 Mick Jagger 10 Telly Savalas 11 John Wayne 12 Jimmie J.J. Walker 13 Dean Martin 14 Mary Tyler Moore

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and essentially put himself under the guidance of Elijah Muhammad. So, here we were in this curious situation, that once the artwork was approved by the Ali people, the question was, were we approved by Elijah Muhammad? And there was really only one way we could be approved of by him, and that was for us to get on a plane, go to Chicago, be driven by limousine to the home of Elijah Muhammad, set out in the windy plains of Chicago, through a gate, and up to his rather elegant house. Arlen: This is just you and Denny? Neal: Just me and Denny, led into a parlor, very Turkish in design, surrounded by columns and couches around the edges— and Elijah Muhammad came out, said hello, got into a phone call, was called away, and left— and we were excused! Arlen: That was it? Neal: That was it. Arlen: He just had to physically...? Neal: See us, I guess, I don’t know! [laughter] I think, in spite of the fact that my personal history comes from many different back-

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grounds, I think the map of Ireland was on both Denny’s and my face, and perhaps that’s what swayed him. I don’t know, whatever it was, we seemed like friendly guys. I think it was just a... a ritual. I think that he felt responsible to Ali, and was looking after him, and why not meet the people who were going to do this, and see if they’re okay? It seemed a little odd to us. [laughs] Arlen: The book came out in 1978. Your last comic for DC before this was “Moon of the Wolf,” which was published in early ‘74, which you had to have drawn, let’s say, in late ‘73, after “The Joker’s Five-Way Revenge.” From that point on, you pretty much thought that was it for you and DC, in terms of concrete artwork. Neal: Right. Remember at that time, I was dealing with Jerry Siegel and Joe Shuster [fighting for Superman’s creators to receive recognition and a pension from DC Comics]. That became a rather intense time for me. At any rate, I had a contract for Superman vs. Muhammad Ali, I also had an agreement with DC Comics that I get a very, very small percentage of overseas sales. I don’t believe that any other comic book artist has ever gotten that. Arlen: This was really the first mainstream DC comic you did that was not work-for-hire? Neal: Not as work-for-hire, but under contract. It wasn’t a great contract, but it did have stipulations in the contract that were valid for people to have, and I let everybody know what was in there. Arlen: At the time, this was DC’s highest-priced original comic book, I believe. The format was established from those dollar editions, so this was really the first “prestige format.” Neal: It was meant from the beginning to be a success. In the end, whether it was a success, I don’t know. Arlen: How come you don’t know? Neal: No, I don’t know the sales in the United States. I know that all around the world it sold very well. Arlen: So you were approved as the artist, Denny was approved as writer, Julie Schwartz is the editor. Neal: Now, I participated in the outline, and it turned out, in the middle of the project Denny could no longer work on it, so essentially, Julie Schwartz dumped it into my lap to finish. Arlen: We’ve got some script pages so we know it was written as a traditional script. Neal: Up to a certain point. Remember, this is a 72-page story. You don’t write it all at once, you do it in parts. Midway into it, Denny was unable to finish, so Julie asked, “Do you want to finish it? You know the story better than anybody else.” I said, “Fine.” He said, “Have the remainder of the script in here Monday.” [laughs]

Superman movie with Christopher Reeve came out. Neal: Yeah. Arlen: So it’s not like they weren’t making Superman movies. Neal: It’s not like this couldn’t have been the second film. Arlen: Right, right. Neal: That would’ve been way too much to hope for, but it’s the kind of thing where you go, “I don’t know, I’d have a good time watching that movie.” Arlen: Part of what’s wrong with Hollywood is they don’t realize they’ve got a movie on paper, in a sense, planned out for them, and all they’ve got to do is film it, so to speak. Neal: Twenty years later. Arlen: Anyway, this, the kick—again, this was covered in the Neal Adams Sketch Book... I think stuff that was covered probably will not be in this article—but you know, you went into a nice whole discussion about this drawing. Neal: From this point of view, once again, this is, in effect—two pages back, we had Bundini Brown—now we’re back to Bundini Brown, and once again, the design work... I was getting off. At this point in the story, we’re on page 51, I may have felt I was practicing, but when I got to page 51, I felt really comfortable with the design work. I was feeling very good—even though I wasn’t necessarily given the opportunity to do design work—I was much more confident the way this escalator works up into the ship, and the energy field, and the ships on the outside, and this interior of this room here... I felt very, very comfortable doing that. I think, in some ways, I cut my teeth on some of the space design stuff in this book, and I felt very comfortable when I got to this point. So, from here on, the spaceships and the other stuff get more confident. Even though it was of a given style—a style I wouldn’t do now—I still was doing it confidently, the strokes were bolder, they were cleaner, the shapes were even kind of bolder... this kind of stuff in here with these... taking a design, and moving the camera around and finding it, like on page 52, panel 3, here was a vast design that we just isolated a given area and took the picture, and you can imagine taking the camera and moving it to the right, and moving it to the left, and seeing all the other design elements of the ship... they’re still there, because in my mind they’re there, and in your imagination, you can see them. I was

much more comfortable, very, very comfortable with this stuff. These spaceships—I had decided what these aliens’ spaceships looked like in general, so I was clean on that. Arlen: Neal, how influenced were you—because this came out a year after Star Wars—how influenced were you at the time by the impact of that movie coming out? Neal: I think you’d have to say I was influenced only in that you had this kind of transition between The Day the Earth Stood Still, Wally Wood-type of spaceships that were these pointed bullets that fly off into space.... Arlen: And then you had 2001. Neal: Well, 2001 was very mechanical in nature. Even though it was interestingly designed, they had a lot of interesting design elements, it was very industrial looking. Arlen: Lucas brought back the fun with spaceships. Neal: Yeah, in effect, if you look at the contrast between 2001 and then George Lucas’ stuff—and I have to say that George Lucas’ stuff essentially was very basic, it was all triangles and circles—what it, in effect, said to you was, “There’s a wide, vast difference between what you can set up in space.” Even though you knew from literature and everything else that once you got into space, you’re basically free to design anything you wanted, you didn’t believe it. You bought the Wally Wood spaceship, that had to look like a bullet or a rocket. Now, we saw other people doing it, and we saw, “Wow, there’s a lot of freedom, you can basically do whatever you want.” So, their technology is based on solar sails, it’s basically a ship that has various functions, and one way or another, there’s a sail. Maybe different designers designed the ships, they come from different companies or whatever—the lesson, of course, that we learned was, “Hey, there are other ways to do this... yeah, you can shape them like bullets, but they’re not really bullets, they’re designs.” So, if you have a culture that’s into sleekness, you can make them sleek. If you have a culture that’s into klunkiness, you can make them klunky... you can make them balls, you can make them flat walls that fly forward... it didn’t really matter. So, here was, essentially, the call to freedom was out there. Was I the first to do it? No, no—but I certainly had a lot of fun! Arlen: Page 54, 55? Neal: Here I’m well into the semi-reality of Superman. Once again, I had only done Superman covers. Now, I’m really beginning to enjoy the Superman character. Once I got through that fight, and I had that cape move, and I did all the stuff that you mentioned with the cape, I’m realizing, “Hey, I can really use that cape. It’s not Batman’s cape, it’s a very different cape, it’s a piece of cloth on this guy’s back that can fit his form, I can really play with that. I like that.” It’s very, very enjoyable. So, now we’re at... Arlen: I’ve always loved Superman kissing his fist. That’s a great... Neal: Of course, you don’t have to see the next scene. Arlen: Yeah. But, Neal, interesting again, like a movie, the cutting: This is how a great director would do it: Kissing his fist, and then you cut to.... Neal: At least a good director. Arlen: Yeah. Neal: I got a lot of fun out of this. Now, each time we cut back, in a way, the story is developing each of the characters. We’re seeing Superman develop, he’s doing his job. We’re seeing Ali face the situation, that he’s doing his job. Arlen: Step up to the plate. Neal: He’s stepping up to the plate. He’s deciding that this is going to end, that he’s going to win. No matter what the bad guys do, he’s going to win this fight. Even in the first panel, one of the things that I tried to do was to show... Arlen: We’re on page 56. Neal: ...at the top of the panel that, here was a small man punching a big man, and the effect of his punches is not to knock the guy away, but he can wear him down, so those two punches, if you look at it, essentially the first punch to the gut really doesn’t make the other guy do anything, but you still feel from that little turn of his foot that he’s felt the impact. In the second drawing, he’s tried to throw a blow, his jaw has been slammed together, he’s felt it in his brain, but there’s not that kind of comic-book action to it yet. You’re starting to get it, the little guy is fighting back, and he’s got a chance,

Appreciation

Bernie’s Dark Comedy The First Decade of Friendship by Bruce Jones

Above: Bernie’s self-portrait from a ’70s BayCon program book. ©1999 Bernie Wrightson. Below: Cover to House of Secrets #139. Opposite: Anyone know what this was done for? ©1999 Bernie Wrightson. Courtesy of Mike Thibodeaux (below) and Todd Adams (opposite).

We entered the Baltimore cemetery together under slate-grey skies pregnant with rain and over an asphalt path that Bernie had himself trod countless times since childhood—and one which had been instrumental in shaping both his life and his art. I would have known this even if his rambling conversation hadn’t disclosed it as we strolled among the graves, for Bernie was at home here, it was obvious. The gaunt lanes of skeletal trees and towering granite-faced crypts embraced him like old friends—as indeed they were. There had been times in his life—as in mine—when only the silent tombstones and quiet lawns could be trusted with the special problems of a young artist’s life and it was apparent these had listened many times to his, even as they were listening now…. It has been an unusual year. Bernie would make a major move to a strange town, face critical decisions about his art, fall in love and then break off with a girl from the Midwest,

lose his father to cancer, and move back to New York again, all within a few short months. “It used to be an open cemetery,” he was saying, squinting up at the grumbling overcast. “But teenagers started vandalizing the place so they fenced it in.” I glanced across at the chiseled features and saw a thousand grave-choked comic panels reflected in his eyes. “They put guard dogs in here at night to keep the people out.” “Jesus,” I muttered, remembering the graveyard scene in Val Lewton’s Leopard Man. “That could be a little hairy if you got trapped in here!” “Oh, I did once!” Bernie replied proudly. “You’re kidding! What did you do?” “I climbed a tree.” I was both chilled and envious. I wished I had met Bernie when we were kids. But that wouldn’t happen until 1968 when I’d walk into Jeff Jones’ New York apartment with my new bride and see a Byronic young man in jeans and sweater slouched on a sofa with a drawing board in his lap. “Bruce, this is Bernie Wrightson. He’s just started working for National….” One look and I could see why. That portfolio of early drawings beside him—the first Wrightson art I would see—was truly staggering, all the more so for his tender years. I remember taking Jeff aside later and whispering ominously, “How’re we gonna get rid of this guy?” Bernie affected all our work in some way, whether by actual application or just through the good vibes that flowed from his brush. Probably that was his greatest contribution—just looking at the immense love and care that went into each panel. As Kaluta once said, “When Bernie’s cookin’—whew!” “Whew!” indeed. Bernie drew like he’d never worked at it at all, like it was the most natural thing in the world to just sit there and watch this gorgeous stuff appear magically on a blank page— while the rest of us sketched and erased and redrew and cursed and sweat blood. But then, we didn’t have the cemetery. We stopped on the cemetery path and Bernie reached down and picked up a flat stone. “Looking for snakes.” He had collected many snakes. At one time or another there was always a rainbow boa or corn snake in an aquarium on top of Bernie’s TV or bookshelf. I even witnessed his strange hunt personally one day when Bernie suggested we look for water snakes in the creek in my backyard. I’d never seen any water snakes there—but then I’d never really looked. I found that there is a real art to that. Bernie pointed out two beautiful specimens from the bridge spanning the creek that for all the world looked to me like dangling reeds. Then, with me guiding from the bridge, he descended to the rushing waters, waded across the tumbled stone and approached one of the serpents. From his angle

Bernie’s Batman

Above: Pencils to a page from Bernie’s and Len Wein’s masterpiece, “Night of the Bat,” Swamp Thing #7. Center: A 1990s Wrightson Batman. Both images courtesy of Todd Adams. Art ©1999 Bernie Wrightson. Batman ©1999 DC Comics, Inc.

DC Oddity

Sextet: The Lost Comic A Charlie’s Angels-inspired series that never made it Comic Book Artist thrives on finding unpublished art, unused stories, and other material that just didn’t make it, and sharing this new unearthed stuff with our readers. As editor, I’m always hounding creators and collectors for cool pages, and I was delighted when my British buddy David A. Roach (new CBA columnist) told me during one of our frequent transatlantic phone calls that DC produced two issues of an apparently Charlie’s Angels-inspired comic book featuring the women adventure team, Sextet, that (the production code reveals) was prepared in 1976 as a Joe Kubert-edited series. I tracked down pages from the second issue of this oddity from another frequent CBA contributor, Ed Noonechester, the Filipino art representative, and present some choice images for your inspection. The origin reference below and nickname of the group, “The Sensational Sextet,” certainly recall the cosmic experience of another group of astronaut heroes, The Fantastic Four. The art does look like the Nestor Redondo Studio style and the words appear to be Bob Kanigher’s. Was the series scrapped when it was realized DC was about to release a comic book with the word “sex” in the title? CBA promises to hunt down the real story of these violent vixens and give you the lowdown. Naturally, if you have any pages or info on this aborted title—or any other unknown project—be sure to contact CBA and spread the word! —Jon B. Cooke

CBA Interview

Below: Betcha didn't know that Bruce started out as an illustrator for pulp and horror small press publishers. This is the cover to Starmont House's Reader's Guide to Clark Ashton Smith. Courtesy of the artist. ©1999 Bruce Timm.

Conducted by Jon B. Cooke Transcribed by Jon B. Knutson I recall the moment I discovered Bruce Timm’s work. I sat in my parked minivan, waiting for my wife to be done with some appointment, and I started to glance through Batman Adventures Annual #2 I had picked up because I was attracted to the Kirby riffs inside. Well, from that moment on, I have been thunderstruck by Bruce’s astonishing ability as a premier cartoonist. He is mostly known as art director and producer of the lauded Batman animated show, but one look at his graphic novel (scripted by Paul Dini), Mad Love, proves he is a comic book artist to be reckoned with. Seek him out in the (unfortunately) too few places his artwork has appeared and you will assuredly become one of the converted. And though he was knee-high to a grasshopper when the other creators in this Special Edition were producing some mean work, Bruce drew and colored the perfect Big Barda cover for us (thanks, Timm!), and I’ll feature Bruce coz’ he damn well deserves it! The artist was interviewed via phone on November 5, 1999, and he copyedited the transcript. Comic Book Artist: When did you first discover Jack Kirby’s Fourth World? Bruce Timm: In 1972 or ’73. I was always interested in comics, but I never really bought a whole bunch of them. I watched super-hero shows on TV, but I’d always spent my allowance on Hot Wheels, things like that, instead of actually buying comics. But in ’73, I really started collecting them seriously. When I was going to junior high school, I had lunch money, which I could spend on comics instead of lunch. [laughter] The only Fourth World title still being published at that time was Mister Miracle, and I got two issues of that, but I didn’t actually discover the rest of the Fourth World until later, when I bought back issues. I was aware of Kirby from the Marvel cartoons, but without actually being able to put his name on the style. So it was right around ’73 or ’74 when I started really getting into

comics that I started putting it all together, and realized, “Oh, yeah, this is that guy!” It’s funny, because I had a love/hate thing with Kirby for a while there; I wasn’t sure that I really liked this stuff or not. I’d go back and forth, and say, “Well, this is really kind of sloppy, weird and strange-looking.” But I’d keep going back and looking at them. CBA: The style was compelling? Bruce: Yeah, kind of. I was that way with a lot of people when I was first getting into comics. My first heroes were John Buscema and Neal Adams. I was much more into the “slick,” realistic style, and Gene Colan was one of my top favorites. So, a lot of the people I love now, I wasn’t really crazy about back then; I wasn’t crazy about Kirby, I wasn’t really crazy about Alex Toth. I’d look at Toth and think, “My god, this stuff is like kiddie drawings! It’s like coloring book drawings, they’re so simple,” but I’d keep going back, looking at them, saying, “If I don’t like this, why do I keep looking at them?” CBA: Did you go through a phase of attempting to draw with a slick, realistic style? Bruce: Oh, absolutely. I still can’t get the John Buscema out of me. [laughter] There’s things about Buscema—I still think he’s just one of the masters of comic book art. I’ve said this before in interviews, and it’s absolutely true: I got hold of Silver Surfer #6, and it totally blew my mind, and I literally traced every drawing over and over again, trying to figure out what he did. John was my number one favorite artist for the longest time. He still is one of them. CBA: You obviously reached the point of getting into an iconic style. It’s been said ad nauseum that you’re a synthesis of Kirby and Toth, two opposing kind of styles. Bruce: Well, Toth’s heroes are all from the real, slick, Noel Sickles school, and Kirby’s stuff is so brain-blasting! [laughter] Kirby’s stuff was all over the place, and really exuberant and wild and full of pizzazz. CBA: You obviously clued into a Kirby/Toth synthesis as a style you were trying to achieve? Bruce: Well, you know, I don’t even know if it was a conscious effort. My “style,” when people talk about it, they’re actually probably referring to the Batman animated style, for which I’m most known. CBA: Even going back to your pulp illustration work for Bob Price [small press publisher of Crypt of Cthulhu and pulp homage zines], you had a real dynamic approach which suggested a Kirby influence within the work. I recall very vividly these adorable girls fighting in the mud, that was just great. There was a real energy in that early work that persists. Bruce: Actually, one of my other major influences is Frank Frazetta. In that particular piece, I was trying to get into that kind of style. People don’t notice the Frazetta in my work because it’s buried very deeply, but, in particular, the way I draw

women, you’ll actually notice a formula based on a really stylized version of Frazetta-type women, with the slanted eyes and the little tiny nose, pointed chin, heart-shaped face—I took all that Frazetta stuff and stylized it into my approach. So, a lot of these influences are probably subliminal; it’s not really a conscious effort thing, “Okay, I want to do a little bit of Kirby here, a little bit of Toth here,” I just absorbed all those things over the years, and they just come out of my hand that way. CBA: When you first bought the Fourth World material, did Kirby become very important to you? I can’t even think of any other artists who have been able to clue in so successfully to what Kirby was doing. Not only did you overtly use his material in the Superman cartoon show, but it also showed up in your comic book work. I recall picking up a Batman Adventures Annual which featured a dead-on version of The Demon. My eyes popped because you “got it”; you understood Kirby’s approach. Bruce: Well, we were really consciously at that point trying to do a lot of Kirby stuff in that Annual. That was overt; we wanted to really put as much Kirby into it as possible without actually doing a swipe. Anytime I do something that I think is specifically a Kirby homage, I try not to do an actual swipe, and I’ll have a lot of his stuff in front of me, but I won’t actually swipe a whole pose or a face or anything. I just have his material there as an osmosis kind of thing—trying to pull up the vibe from it. But yeah, that was one that I and Glen Murakami, who worked on that annual with me, we were really trying to achieve. Well, the thing with The Demon, especially, is that the character had gone through so many permutations in the DC universe since the Kirby days—they’d changed him so much—so I thought, “Well, gosh, he’s hardly even the Kirby Demon any more, so if we’re going to use him in the Annual, we should go back to the source and try to make it as true to Kirby as possible.” CBA: Yeah, and mixing it up with other iconic figures at the time—Ra’s Al Ghul and Talia. Bruce: Yeah, it’s something that hadn’t really been done before, and I thought, “Well, it kind of makes sense.” CBA: Your comic book work is quite sparse. It’s difficult to even find it on a yearly basis nowadays. Do you plan in the future to be doing… do you have any time? Bruce: Well you know, that’s the problem: It’s the time it takes to do it. I recently did Avengers #11/2. That was something that I fell into doing for Marvel. Again, it’s a direct Kirby homage, and all the way through I tried to make it look as much like Kirby as possible, more than anything else, and I honestly think I failed. I look at it and I think, “It doesn’t really look like Kirby, and it doesn’t look like me, it’s kind of neither fish nor fowl.” People really seemed to like it, but…. CBA: So you’re not happy with it? Bruce: Like I said, it’s neither 100% Kirby or 100% me, it’s somewhere in-between, and it’s just… whatever. A lot of people tell me, “It looks just like Kirby,” and I’m just like, “Oh, well, that’s nice.” It frustrates me on that level. Anyhow, getting back to your original question, to actually take the time out to do a 25-page comic, I actually

had to take a week off of work just to pencil the thing, because I have this really demanding day job, and I’ve got a wife and daughter, and when I get home, I want to spend time with them, so finding time to actually do a full comic is pretty back-breaking. As much as I enjoy doing comics, I wish they paid as well as my animation work. I’d probably do them full-time! CBA: So your animation work is going full gangbusters right now? Bruce: Oh yeah, big time. We’re cranking away on Batman Beyond. CBA: That’s a daily show? Bruce: No, not yet. Warner Bros. wants to get it to the point where they have enough episodes so they can actually strip it and run it Monday through Friday, but they don’t have enough yet. I think it’s on twice a week—one day during the week, and Saturdays as well. We’re doing 52 episodes total, and we’re still working on them. CBA: Is anything up with Superman any more? Bruce: Superman is officially on hold for the time period. I kind of doubt we’re going to go back to doing any more. There doesn’t seem to be much interest from the network or from the lot to do more Superman, but if they ever get the Superman live-action movie up and running, then chances are, that might spark some interest in doing more cartoons. But for the time being, it’s pretty dead. CBA: The Superman cartoon show was full of obvious homages to Kirby—there was even a character, Terrible Turpin, who was, for all practical purposes, Jack Kirby as a cartoon character. Do you see the Fourth World creations as a

Above: Timm's take on the mighty Cimmarian from a Robert E. Howard tribute zine called The Barbarian Scroll. Courtesy of the artist. Art ©1999 Bruce Tim. Conan ©1999 Conan Properties, Inc. Below: Cover illustration of an issue of Robert Price's legendary HPLzine, Crypt of Cthulhu. Bruce tells us L. Sprague DeCamp owns the original! Courtesy of the artist. ©1999 Bruce Timm.

Spread: Bruce’s concept sketches for this issue’s cover, all courtesy of the artist. Above: Bruce notes, “As you can see, I had a hard time deciding on a concept and/or pose… I hate multicharacter compositions!”

around for a long time, it’s not something that’s been seen on a mass media exposure. CBA: If you could, do you have more Fourth World stories you’d love to do? Bruce: You know, it’s so hard to say. On one hand, I go back to them a lot and re-read them (or try to re-read them—they’re kind of all over the place), it’s a hard thing to really get a grasp on. People keep saying, “Why don’t you do a Fourth World series or a movie or something,” and I don’t really know how to do it. In a way, it was nice that we introduced it into Superman because perfect setting for Superman? we didn’t have to concentrate solely on the Fourth Bruce: The Fourth World certainly blended in World, and try to figure out exactly how to make it very well with the character. Of course, Kirby work. We were able to use elements that worked started that himself, with Jimmy Olsen, and even in on a more commercial aspect, reducing Darkseid’s recent years, Mike Carlin has re-introduced a lot of whole central being and mythos into something the Kirby elements back into the Superman strip. that’s kind of easily palatable to our key audience. It was certainly a good blend. I think one of the But the whole thing is such a big mind-expanding problems we always have with Superman is that the concept, it’s so huge! To this day, I think that it kind character’s been around for so long, and he’s kind of got beyond Kirby; I mean, Kirby couldn’t even of such a… I don’t want to say dated, but you control it all, coming up with concepts so fast, he’d know what I mean? There’s nothing terribly modern lose sight of what the story was. If you go back and about Superman; he’s been around for so long. His re-read the entire run of The New Gods, the first costume is so primary, and he’s such an icon that it’s three issues are, “Wow, he’s really onto somehard to find anything fresh and original about him, thing!” But by the fourth issue, he’s introducing IF YOU ENJOYED THIS PREVIEW, so bringing the Kirby mythos into the Superman new characters, and something is getting lost in the CLICK THE LINK TO ORDER THISThe first universe seemed to be a way to introduce a new mix. All of his comics are created that way: PRINT DIGITAL FORMAT! element, to make people interested in the character. ISSUE two orINthree issuesOR of The Eternals are like, “Wow, Even though the Fourth World stuff has been he’s really on to something,” and then, “My God, now where are we going?” [laughter] So, a lot of people say, “Well, it’s not fair because Kirby never really got a chance to finish the Fourth World,” and I’m not sure he really had anything in mind as a complete story, even though he said he did. CBA: Jack was a very spontaneous guy. COMIC BOOK ARTIST: Bruce: SPECIAL EDITION #1 Seriously, if theSpotlights books great had DC been Previously available only to CBA subscribers! Comics of the ’70s: Interviews with MARKsuccessful, EVANIER andand STEVE he’d SHERMAN on JACK KIRBY’s Fourth World, ALEX TOTH on his been able to do mystery work, NEAL ADAMS on Superman vs. Muhammad Ali,30 RUSS HEATH on Sgt. Rock, BRUCE JONESissues discussing BERNIE of The New WRIGHTSON (plus a WRIGHTSON portfolio), and a BRUCE Gods, and 40 issues of TIMM interview, art gallery, and cover! Forever People and (76-page Digital Edition) $3.95 Mister Miracle, maybe http://twomorrows.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=98_56&products_id=318 he would’ve been able to tie it all together, but it doesn’t really