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A “King”-Size 68-page ISSUE on JAck’s Female Characters!!
Issue #20, JUNE 1998
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A Rare 1975
Kirby Interview Interviews with
Dave Stevens & Lisa Kirby Unpublished Tenpage story from
True Life Divorce A Close Look At
Romance Comics Jack’s original screenplay for
Captain Victory Doublecenterfold of
Galaxy Green Special Features:
Jack’s Women From The ’40s To The ’80s including Pencil pages Befo re They Were Inked, And Much Mo re!!
Nominated Fo r Two 1998 Eisner Awards Including “Best Comics-Related Publication”
1998 Harve y Awards Nominee “Best Biographical, Historical or Journalistic Presentation”
Artwork © Jack Kirby & Ken Steacy
Unpublished Art
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FAIRLY FEMININE FELLOWSHIP FOR A FABULOUSLY FINE FELLOW! ITEM! TJKC was honored once again this year with a HARVEY AWARD NOMINATION for BEST BIOGRAPHICAL, HISTORICAL, OR JOURNALISTIC PRESENTATION. Plus, we chalked up TWO EISNER AWARD NOMINATIONS (for BEST COMICS-RELATED BOOK for our COLLECTED TJKC, VOL. ONE trade paperback, and BEST COMICS-RELATED PERIODICAL for TJKC itself)! We’re pleased as punch to be honored again this year, and want to thank everyone for supporting TJKC over the years, and helping keep it in the public eye. ITEM! Although the above-mentioned Vol. One is sold out, our colossal 160-page COLLECTED JACK KIRBY COLLECTOR, VOLUME 2 (our new TRADE PAPERBACK COLLECTION reprinting TJKC #10-12 plus over 25 NEW pages of Jack’s pencils) ships in July! Our supply will be pretty limited, so to ensure you get a copy, you should order immediately. It’s only $14.95 postpaid in the US ($16.95 Canada, $24.95 elsewhere).
ITEM! The first issue of our new publication COMIC BOOK ARTIST was a sell-out in stores across the country! Right now, TJKC’s Associate Editor, Jovial JON B. COOKE is hard at work on CBA #2, featuring MARVEL COMICS: THE SECOND WAVE (1970-77). Behind a new GIL KANE cover, there’s new interviews with GIL, STAN LEE, BARRY WINDSOR-SMITH, and features and unpublished art on such greats of that era as FRANK BRUNNER, GENE COLAN, JIM STARLIN, MIKE PLOOG, P. CRAIG RUSSELL, JACK KIRBY, and many others! Plus, Rascally ROY THOMAS has concocted another 16-page installment of his classic fanzine ALTER EGO for CBA #2, spotlighting more greats of the Golden and Silver Age! It ships in August, and CBA #1 (with a DC theme, featuring plenty of rare art by NEAL ADAMS and others) is still available for $5.95, or you can subscribe for four issues for only $20 in the US! If you want to get involved, submit copies of art from your collection and articles about your favorite comics artists to Jon Cooke, PO Box 204, W. Kingston, RI 02892-0204. ITEM! Get connected! The TJKC Web Site (maintained by Rascally RANDY HOPPE) is at www.fantasty.com/kirby while the official Web Site of the Kirby Estate is at www.heavypen.com/theking And be sure to join the KIRBY MAILING LIST by sending an e-mail request to kirby-l@fantasty.com. Start typing, Kirbyheads! ITEM! We’re gearing up for another sojourn to COMIC CON INTERNATIONAL: SAN DIEGO, August 13-16 (and the EXPO August 11-12). The TJKC BOOTH will sport a new look this year, with the addition of COMIC BOOK ARTIST to our publishing schedule (CBA #2 will debut at the con), so be sure to stop by and say hello! (Thanks to Magnificent MIKE GARTLAND for helping JON B. COOKE run our booth at this year’s RAMAPO CON!) See ya there! ITEM! We’re sad to report that the special display of Jack’s work planned for this year’s SAN DIEGO COMIC-CON won’t be happening, due to a lack of sponsors to offset the costs of security, etc. Maybe next year! ITEM! If you haven’t checked out STERANKO: GRAPHIC PRINCE OF DARKNESS (the recently-published autobiographical docu-comic), you owe it to yourself to find a copy right away! Besides being profusely illustrated with some of Jim’s finest work (much unpublished), you’re treated to some amazing tales of Steranko’s life and career. This book is a must for fans of Steranko and comics in general, and is available through comics shops, or for $4 ($5.50
JOHN’S JUKEBOX You’ve probably heard people say Jack didn’t draw very beautiful women, or that he cared much more about the testosterone-pumping males in his books. So I guess it shouldn’t surprise me that, as near as I can tell, less than one percent of TJKC’s readership is female. Why is it more women aren’t interested in comics, and Jack’s work in particular? I’m not sure how to answer that question (although joining FRIENDS OF LULU might help change the situation; see info below), but I hope this issue will change people’s opinion about Jack’s women. As we’ll show, he drew a wide variety of females in his books; some strong, some sexy, and all done with the utmost respect for the fairer sex. But we mustn’t forget that they were all drawn through the perception of a man (and one who grew up in the early part of this century). So what I’m after this issue isn’t a Feminist viewpoint on Jack’s characters; quite the contrary, I wanted a look at Jack’s female characters from the perspective of his readers, who are overwhelmingly male. I’ve resisted the urge to make politicallycorrect changes to any of the racier articles (or Jack’s art, for that matter). The end result is, hopefully, an issue like Jack’s female characters: A little bawdy, a little sexy, and one that can hold its own alongside any other. Now turn the page to see if we succeeded! Long Live The King!
John Morrow, Editor • 1812 Park Dr. • Raleigh, NC 27605 • (919) 833-8092 • FAX (919) 833-8023 E-mail: twomorrow@aol.com P.S. TJKC #1-12 and our first Trade Paperback are sold out, but don’t forget that next month we’re shipping our second Trade Paperback, which reprints #1012. Supplies will be limited, so order yours right away to assure availability! Canada) plus $1 for shipping from: VANGUARD PRODUCTIONS, 170 Wildwood Avenue, Montclair, NJ 07043 or call 973-744-1135. (A signed edition is also available for $10 plus $1 shipping.) Get it while it lasts! ITEM! FRIENDS OF LULU needs your support! It’s a national organization aimed at promoting and encouraging more female readership and participation in comic books. Annual dues are only $25 for adults ($5 for under 18 Jr. Lulus), and you get a nifty membership card, a subscription to the FOL newsletter, a tax deduction (they’re a nonprofit organization), and the joy in knowing you’re helping the comics industry reach new readers. Send dues to: Friends of Lulu, 4657 Cajon Way, San Diego, CA 92115. ITEM! BIG BANG COMICS is working on a great tribute to Jack’s FOURTH WORLD books, featuring their female character VENUS. We’ve seen the penciled pages, and this homage is dead-on! BIG BANG is from IMAGE COMICS; look for it in comics shops soon! ITEM! Have you checked out HOGAN’S ALLEY? It’s a beautifully-produced magazine with something for every fan of comic strips, comic books, animation, & more! Each 100+ page issue is chocked full of features, interviews, reprints, appreciation and analysis. The fifth issue (which is on sale now) includes a special section showing how BARRY WINDSOR-SMITH puts together an issue of his critically-acclaimed STORYTELLER (including plenty of rare art)! We here at TJKC can’t recommend it enough, so give it a shot. Four issue subscriptions are $18.95 ($27.95 overseas) from: HOGAN’S ALLEY, PO Box 47684, Atlanta, GA 30362 or sample them online at www.cagle.com/hogan
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KIRBY COLLECTOR CHECKLIST These Issues Of TJKC Are Available – See Page 66 THE COLLECTED TJKC, VOLUME TWO: (NEW!) A whopping 160-page trade paperback, reprinting the soldout TJKC #10-12, plus over 25 more pieces of Kirby art NEVER BEFORE PUBLISHED in TJKC (many are fullpage repros)! Features interviews with JACK & ROZ KIRBY, STEVE GERBER, JOHN BYRNE, MARK EVANIER, ROGER STERN, MARV WOLFMAN, RARE KIRBY ART and more! $14.95 postpaid ($16.95 Canada, $24.95 elsewhere). SHIPS IN JULY — ORDER NOW! SORRY, VOLUME ONE of our TRADE PAPERBACK, plus TJKC #1- 9 ARE SOLD OUT!! TJKC #10-12 ARE SOLD OUT!! But they’re reprinted in the new TJKC TRADE PAPERBACK, Vol 2! (See above — It ships in July — Order now!) TJKC #13: 52-page SUPERNATURAL theme issue! An interview with Jack and Walter Gibson (creator of The Shadow), unpublished 7-page mystery story, DICK AYERS interview, THE DEMON, BLACK MAGIC, SPIRIT WORLD, ATLAS MONSTERS, published pages before inking, and more! New Kirby/Ayers and Kirby/Bissette covers. $4.95 ($5.40 Canada, $7.40 elsewhere) TJKC #14: 52-page THOR theme issue! Interviews with CHIC STONE and WALT SIMONSON! Also, Jack’s uninked pencils to JOURNEY INTO MYSTERY #101 and others, unused THOR #169 art, pros and cons of Vince Colletta, and more! New Kirby/Stone and Kirby/Simonson covers. $4.95 ($5.40 Canada, $7.40 elsewhere) TJKC #15: 52-page SCI-FI issue! A rare Kirby interview, AL WILLIAMSON and MIKE THIBODEAUX interviews, the story behind SKY MASTERS, ETERNALS, MACHINE MAN, CAPTAIN VICTORY, 2001, STARMAN ZERO, SILVER SURFER GRAPHIC NOVEL, Jack’s uninked pencils and more! New Kirby/Williamson and Kirby/Austin covers. $4.95 ($5.40 Canada, $7.40 elsewhere) TJKC #16: 52-page TOUGH GUYS theme issue! A rare interview with Jack, interviews with WILL EISNER and FRANK MILLER, a look at Jack’s tough childhood, features on IN THE DAYS OF THE MOB, BULLSEYE, THE FLYING FOOL, WAR AND WESTERN BOOKS, 1950s COMIC STRIP IDEAS, unpublished art, Jack’s uninked pencils and more! New Kirby/Miller and Kirby/Kesel covers. $4.95 ($5.40 Canada, $7.40 elsewhere) TJKC #17: 68-page DC theme issue! A rare KIRBY INTERVIEW, interviews with NEAL ADAMS, D. BRUCE BERRY, 1997 Kirby Tribute Panel, features on KAMANDI, MANHUNTER, FOURTH WORLD, CHALLENGERS, SANDMAN, unpublished art, Jack’s uninked pencils & more! New Kirby/Royer and Kirby/Rude covers. $5.95 ($6.40 Canada, $8.40 elsewhere) TJKC #18: 68-page MARVEL theme issue! A rare KIRBY INTERVIEW, interviews with STAN LEE, ROY THOMAS, JOHN ROMITA, JOHN BUSCEMA, MARIE SEVERIN, HERB TRIMPE, FLO STEINBERG, GEORGE ROUSSOS, features on ANT-MAN, THE ETERNALS, BLACK PANTHER, unpublished art, Jack’s uninked pencils & more! New Kirby and Kirby/Sinnott covers. $5.95 ($6.40 Canada, $8.40 elsewhere) TJKC #19: 56-page ART theme issue! Interviews with JOE KUBERT, KEVIN EASTMAN, Marvel art controversy discussed by KIRBY, MILLER, EVANIER, GERBER, and GROTH, thesis by GIL KANE, ins & outs of collecting Kirby art, tribute to ROZ, unpublished art, 6-page color section (with Jack’s paintings) & more! New Kirby/Alex Ross cover. $5.95 ($6.40 Canada, $8.40 elsewhere) TJKC POSTER: See pg. 66. $7 ($8 Can., $10 elsewhere) AND DON’T FORGET: COMIC BOOK ARTIST #1: 100-page DC Theme, with ADAMS, INFANTINO, KUBERT, CARDY, KIRBY, GIORDANO, and more! See the ad in this issue. $5.95 ($6.40 Canada, $8.40 elsewhere)
Issue #20 Contents: Lisa Kirby Interview . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4 (the “Kid From Left Field” speaks) Soiled & Sweet & Sometimes Green! . . .9 (S&K’s women of the Golden Age) Those Marvel-Ous Kirby Women . .1 3 (fun and frolic in the ’60s) SUE’s ’DOs Contest . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .14 (how many did she have? Enter and you could win a free issue!) Gender Relations In The Kirby Pantheon . . .1 8 (from the Fourth World to Eternals) An Oddball Kirby Comic . . . . . . . . .23 (a dreamy visit with Doris Nelson) Dave Stevens Interview . . . . . . . . . . .2 4 (a very revealing discussion with Dave) Romantic Worlds of Sci-Fi . . . . . . . . .3 0 (romance where you’d least expect it) Uncle Carmine’s Fat City Comix . . . .3 1 (Kirby goes underground) Double Centerfold: Galaxy Green . .3 2 (the two unpublished pages at last!) Kirby’s Romance Women . . . . . . . . .3 6 (were they tough enough? Richard Howell tells us) An Exercise In Realism . . . . . . . . . . .3 8 (exploring S&K’s romance books) “True Life Divorce” . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4 0 (a shocking, unpublished 10-page story from 1970, still in pencil stage!) Jack Kirby Interview . . . . . . . . . . . . . .5 1 (Jack and Don Rico discuss WWII, the Mafia, Watergate, and comics) Captain Victory & the Lightning Lady . .5 7 (the unseen original screenplay that was the basis for the comic book) The Newer Gods . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .6 2 (Jack’s final females take a bow) Flowers for Miss Conway . . . . . . . . .6 3 (a love note to Mr. Edge’s secretary) Collector Comments . . . . . . . . . . . . .6 4
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The Jack Kirby Collector, Vol. 5, No. 20, June 1998. Published bi-monthly by & © TwoMorrows Advertising & Design, 1812 Park Drive, Raleigh, NC 27605, USA. 919-833-8092. John Morrow, Editor. Pamela Morrow, Asst. Editor. Jon B. Cooke, Assoc. Editor. Single issues: $5.95 ($6.40 Canada, $8.40 elsewhere). Six-issue subscriptions: $24.00 US, $32.00 Canada and Mexico, $44.00 outside North America. First printing. All characters are © their respective companies. All artwork is © Jack Kirby unless otherwise noted. All editorial matter is © the respective authors. PRINTED IN CANADA.
Front cover painting: Ken Steacy Back cover inks: Richard Howell Back cover color: Tom Ziuko Photocopies of Jack’s uninked pencils from published comics are reproduced here courtesy of the Kirby Estate, which has our thanks for their continued support. COPYRIGHTS: Captain Victory and the Lightning Lady, Farrah, Friends of Fandom art, Galaxy Green, Insectons, Klavus, Orca, Sky Masters of the Space Force, Warrior Woman © Jack Kirby Estate. • Love Problems © Harvey Publications • Agatha Harkness, Alicia Masters, Ardina, Betty Ross, Bucky, Captain America, Crystal, Deviants, Don Blake, Doris Nelson/Wilson, Dorma, Enchantress, Eternals, Hela, Hercules, Human Torch, Invisible Girl, Jane Foster, Karnilla, Loki, Margo Damian, Marvel Girl, Medusa, Mr. Fantastic, Red Skull, Scarlet Witch, Sersi, Sharon Carter/Agent 13, Sif, Silver Surfer, Steve Rogers, Tana Nile, Thing, Thor © Marvel Entertainment, Inc. • Beautiful Dreamer, Bernadeth, Big Barda, Count Dragorin, Dr. Bedlam, Granny Goodness, In The Days Of The Mob, Jimmy Olsen, Kanto the Assassin, Lashina, Laura Conway, Lupek, Mad Harriet, Mister Miracle, Orion, Scott Free, Stompa, Superman, Tigra, Toxl the World Killer, True Divorce Cases, Virmin Vundabar © DC Comics, Inc. • Amazon Women, “Back-Door Love”, Blue Bolt, “Different”, “Gang Sweetheart”, Green Sorceress, “Mama’s Boy”, Mother Delilah, Sandra Sylvan, Stuntman, Stuntwoman, “The Girl Who Tempted Me” © Joe Simon & Jack Kirby.
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The Kid From Left Field Jack & Roz’s youngest daughter Lisa interviewed by John Morrow (Lisa Kirby, whom Jack dubbed “The Kid From Left Field” in the Jimmy Olsen #133 text page, was born September 7, 1960 in Brooklyn, NY. As the youngest of Jack and Roz’s four children, she grew up during her father’s most prolific creative period in comics. She now serves as Co-Executor— with cousin Robert Katz—of her parent’s estate, overseeing usage of Jack’s creations. This interview was conducted by phone on April 6, 1998.)
They thought it would be better to move to a warmer climate. TJKC: I don’t know if you realize it, but indirectly, you’re responsible for the San Diego Comic Convention! (laughter) Fans should be grateful to you for getting your dad out there where they could meet him. LISA: I never thought of it that way. (laughter)
THE JACK KIRBY COLLECTOR: What do you remember about living in New York? Did fans stop by the house at all? LISA KIRBY: I was so little... I’m sure they did. My dad always had people in and out. I remember more from when we moved to California; when we lived in Thousand Oaks, I always remember people being there. It was kind of a constant thing; it was the norm for me. TJKC: The story we’ve all heard was that you had asthma problems, and that’s why the family moved out to California. Is that correct? LISA: Right. It was really bad; I was a really sickly kid, actually. I was in the hospital a lot, I missed a lot of school. My mother had asthma too.
Lisa’s proud parents in the 1990s.
TJKC: How old were you when you moved to California? LISA: I was about eight. TJKC: Did the kids at school know who your dad was, and what he did? LISA: Yeah, it was really neat. I have fond memories of it. He always came to my classroom. When we had parties, he’d draw. He’d take the letter of a child’s first name, and turn it into a super-hero. (laughter) Everybody was enthralled; it made me a very popular kid, (laughter) which was great because I was sick all the time, and I was really shy. I never uttered a word to anybody. I don’t know what happened to me; now I can’t shut up. But in the early years, it really helped me, because otherwise I probably wouldn’t have had any friends! (laughter) It made me really popular. He always did that, even as I got older. I was a preschool teacher for awhile, and he came to my classroom, and did the same thing. So there’s some parents out there with very valuable momentos! (laughter) I wonder if they know they have them. He was always really good about giving back, y’know? TJKC: Did your classmates pester you, wanting to know, “What’s your dad going to draw next issue?” LISA: Everybody would always ask me, and what’s so funny is I never really knew that much. I lived with it, but I never knew that much about what he was doing, I guess because it was just something Dad did; it was his job, and I thought of it that way. Everybody was like, “Were you in your dad’s studio? What is he doing?”(laughter) To me it was like, “Who cares? (laughter) Daddy’s working.” I had a different view, I guess. We just did everyday kid things. I didn’t think anything of it. I saw my father, and I knew that was his job, that’s what he does. I knew it was definitely different than someone else’s father, (laughter) but I just had the attitude of “That’s what he did.” Then I got older and went, “Wow, look at this stuff!” Even today, I’m going through all this work, inventorying everything, and I’m just in awe. I’m almost ashamed of myself; I can’t believe what I missed and did not pay attention to.
Pencils from a FF Annual #5 pin-up. Note Stan Lee’s misspelling of Crystal’s name. 4
TJKC: I take it you weren’t a comic book reader. LISA: No, I wasn’t at all. In fact, I didn’t really get into it until I was older, and noticed, “Wow, this is really good stuff!” When I was younger, it just really didn’t appeal to me that much.
TJKC: Would it be a fair assessment to say your dad was always working? LISA: Oh, yes. He worked all the time. He wasn’t the kind of dad who took us camping or things like that. He was a workaholic. As I was growing up, I was involved with horses; I went to horse shows, and he always came to all my horse shows. He was always really supportive of what I did. But his schedule was: He woke up late, and I’d see him for a little bit in the morning, and then the afternoon hit, and he was working. He was in “the room.” (laughter)
The digital painting that graces this issue’s front cover is by Ken Steacy, based on a Kirby pencil drawing. Ken also did this inked version; if anyone out there has the original pencils to this piece, Ken would be most interested in purchasing them! Please contact TJKC if they’re for sale.
TJKC: So he was home all the time, but you didn’t see a whole lot of him? LISA: No, unless I went in to see what he was doing. He’d come out every so often, but he worked quite a bit. He worked all night long; he’d work till 2:00 in the morning most of the time, then sleep, then start work again at 1:00 or 2:00 in the afternoon. TJKC: Did he work on holidays as well? LISA: No, we always had pretty good family gatherings. I’m sure he probably worked part of the time, but we usually had company and relatives. He was a pretty social guy, so he definitely participated during that time. TJKC: Did all the relatives gather at your place on holidays, or did you take trips? LISA: Once in a while we’d take trips upstate when we lived in New York. When we moved to California, we didn’t have that many relatives in California at the time. Everybody kind of took turns. TJKC: Was it really tough being the youngest child? LISA: Not really, because I was a spoiled brat. (laughter) I think I was “Daddy’s Girl” to tell you the truth. I hate to admit it. He was very overprotective. I was the baby. TJKC: Which of you four kids was the most into what your dad was doing? LISA: Probably my brother [Neal]. My sister Susan was a singer, and she was always involved in music, and traveled around a lot. But my brother was home a lot, and he probably read more comic books than any of us. I think he was more into reading them, and got into the whole thing more than the rest of us.
really notice. I think they thought it was really cool. They’d come over and say, “Wow, this is what your dad does? Can I see the studio? Can I meet your dad?” We’d go in there, and of course my dad would go into his stories—you know how he is. They’d go into, like, some kind of hypnotic state. (laughter) They’d hang out in there for a while, and it was neat; then they’d come out. But as I got older, my boyfriends started to venture in there, and I’d never see them again—then I got a little resentful! (laughter)
TJKC: Roz talked about how often you had people over. LISA: (laughter) We always had people over. She forgot me at school once because there were people over. (laughter) They were just really good that way; they’d open their doors to everybody. TJKC: Didn’t that get really annoying for you as a kid, to constantly have strangers over? LISA: I guess I was just content. It was something that was always there and that I was used to. It didn’t really matter to me; I was always out riding my horse, and had a lot of friends I hung out with. I just got used to people coming in: “Oh, who’s here today?” (laughter) Then my friends would come over and disappear into “the room” and I’d never see them again, either.
TJKC: What did your dad think of your boyfriends? LISA: In the era I grew up and started dating in—the late ’70s—most of them had long hair and were kind of hippie-ish. He made the comment: Why couldn’t I meet someone that had shorter hair? (laughter) I heard that a few times. They were really good about my friends. Sure, they got scrutinized, and before I went out, they had to know where I was going, and what time I’d be home, and this and that, like any other parent.
TJKC: Was anybody ever friends with you just to meet your dad? LISA: I don’t know. It could’ve been that way, but if it was I didn’t
TJKC: Was your mom more strict with that kind of stuff than your dad? 5
One of the first jobs Mike Royer inked for Jack was Mister Miracle #5. When he inked this page, he modified the Barda face Jack drew in an attempt to make her “prettier.” Jack wasn’t too happy when he saw it, told Mike to never change anything, and restored the face to its original look for publication. Shown here is Mike’s modified version.
TJKC: Do you think he had a really old-fashioned view of women? Did he think the wife should stay at home, and the man should be the breadwinner? LISA: He was definitely old-fashioned in some respects. I think he was old-fashioned in his etiquette toward women, with the door-opening, and like that. He’d never let any of us take out the trash, because that was a man’s job. (laughter) There were just certain things that men were supposed to do; but I don’t think he thought women had to be homemakers, and that type of thing. If a woman wanted to go out and have a career, he’d be all for it. Even though my mother was a homemaker— she stayed home—she still pretty much ran the household, and he needed her to do that. TJKC: Was he as likely to encourage you and your sisters’ careers as he was Neal’s? LISA: Oh, yeah, definitely. They were always supportive of us. They may have thought some of my ideas were a little nutty at the time, (laughter) but they tried not to come right out and say that—not that we were going to go out and do something crazy. My sister Susan at an early age was a musician and a singer, and went to Europe and traveled around back in the 1960s. That was something women didn’t really do that much of back then. They definitely encouraged creativity, and doing your own thing. TJKC: I’ve heard stories about what an awful driver your dad was. Who gave you your first driving lesson—your mom or your dad? LISA: Definitely her. (laughter) I’ve never been with him when he drove, actually. He quit driving way before me. I may have been in the car with him once when I was really young. He couldn’t think; I want to say he was always in fantasyland, thinking of work. At least he knew he was a lousy driver. (laughter) Most people don’t know, and they keep driving around. (laughter) He just couldn’t keep his mind on basic stuff like that. TJKC: I’d like to get your perspective as a woman; can you relate at all to what you dad was doing with all this testosterone-laden work, with all the punching and leaping and all that? LISA: What I like was that his characters were actually pretty wholesome. I think the women characters were very strong; gosh, they were like Amazons! (laughter) He had very strong women characters; I feel he made them the equal of any of the male super-heroes. I don’t really have a favorite, as far as the female characters, but I think he was pretty fair. He made some really strong female characters.
LISA: No, I think my dad was. He’d say, “Roz, make sure you know where she’s going,” and that type of thing. TJKC: Your dad drew a lot of hippies in the early 1970s. (Lisa laughs) How hip or unhip was your dad? Did he really understand the hippie culture, or was he just picking up on stuff he saw on the news? LISA: I think a little of both. He definitely watched the news all the time. He was very much into current events and world affairs, and he read quite a bit. I think he was hip, but he was also brought up a certain way. I’m sure they were all a little bit more clean-cut back in those days. (laughter) What I liked about him was he wasn’t prejudiced against any particular culture—what people wore or what they did. He was just so open-minded, and he really accepted people for who they were. I thought that was really special.
TJKC: Why do you think his comics appealed more to guys than girls? LISA: I don’t know. I think young girls are more interested in reading romance stories or that type of thing. TJKC: Have you ever read any of your dad’s 1950s romance comics? LISA: I have; I went through them. I thought they were really corny. (laughter) It’s funny; I’m reading more of his work now than I did when I was younger. It’s so different for me now; I have such a different point of view on the whole thing. TJKC: Did you ever offer any story or character suggestions? LISA: No, I never did. I did like to write myself; when I was younger I used to write songs and poems. He’d always read them and say, “Wow, this is so good! You should keep doing this.” He was always encouraging me.
TJKC: What about politics? Did he rant and rave about any political figures? LISA: I never really heard him talk about politics all that much. I know he was a Democrat, and he probably did say a few things about Nixon. (laughter) I think he was pretty liberal, as far as that goes. He never really talked politics with me that much.
TJKC: As a kid, did you get any good bedtime stories from your dad? 6
LISA: (laughter) I think he was working when I went to sleep. But we used to hear all his stories; all the war stories...! (laughter) TJKC: Do you remember any of them, or did you just tune them out after a while? LISA: Oh, my gosh! (laughter) Even my mom; he’d start in, and she’d go, “Jack, we’ve heard that story so many times!” (laughter) We’d roll our eyes at him, and he’d go, “Oh, you girls!” (laughter) We heard so many, it’s hard to even pinpoint one. But the War definitely had a traumatic effect on him. He made some of his stories humorous, and that somewhat took the edge off them—and then he had some that were actually very tragic.
TJKC: Which one of the Kirby kids has the best understanding of what your dad did, and the importance of preserving his art? LISA: Well, I think we’re all concerned, but probably myself, and my niece Tracy. Also, my cousin Robert Katz has been a great help to me, and Mike Thibodeaux has been just wonderful. Now I take a really big interest in trying to preserve it as much as we can; you know, just keeping things going, and keeping his name out there, and making sure people can enjoy his characters for as long as possible. TJKC: Is that your primary responsibility as Co-Executor of the estate? LISA: Yeah, trying to control that end is part of it. Robert Katz and I collaborate a lot on it.
TJKC: Do you have memories of any particular family trip or event? LISA: When we were really young, we used to take long road trips up to the Catskills of Liberty, NY and visit my cousins and aunt and uncle. They used to stuff us in the car and drive us up there. When we moved to California, I remember them taking me to Disneyland; we did all the basic family amusement park things. TJKC: Did you prefer California to New York? LISA: I did, but I don’t remember too much of New York. When we moved up to Thousand Oaks, it was great; we lived up in the hills, and I had my horse. I went hiking and enjoyed the outdoors. I think it was nice for him, considering where he grew up on the Lower East Side. He just loved it; he was getting to be a cowboy and living out a fantasy of his. (laughter) My dad didn’t really like to travel that much; he wasn’t into going on planes, so we did a lot of things at home. They always were entertaining; we always had parties. We had these pool parties, and tons of people would come. It was a little bit of everybody; fans, friends, other artists. They always had their house open to people, and I think they really enjoyed entertaining. TJKC: We know he enjoyed movies; do you remember seeing any with him? LISA: I don’t remember seeing movies with him that much. I know he loved Charles Bronson. (laughter) That was his favorite; he’d sit there and watch these action films. He liked Clint Eastwood too. (laughter) I don’t remember much about going to movies with him; he worked a lot! (laughter) TJKC: Where did you go to college? LISA: I went to Moorpark Community College for two years here in southern California, and I became a preschool teacher for a little over ten years. Now I’m a massage therapist; I have a private practice. I’ve been doing that for the past five years; I work on a lot of athletes, and go to a lot of sporting events. I like it; I was ready for a career change, and I’m very sports-oriented, and it’s something I really enjoy and believe in. I’m kind of a beach bum, and I definitely like to surf; that’s kind of my thing. My mother would say, “Oh, my daughter’s a surfer...!” (laughter) I love the Silver Surfer, of course! (laughter) TJKC: Is that your favorite Kirby character? LISA: I like Thor a lot too, but the Silver Surfer’s probably up there. Lisa’s favorite character, Thor, from #154, page 2. 7
TJKC: What’s the weirdest experience you remember with a fan? LISA: The UFO People. (laughter) They looked like very conservative, clean-cut all-Americans. Of course, they invited them in and showed them around. What these people did was sell their homes and give away their belongings, and they were going to the desert because the Mother Ship was coming to pick them up! (laughter) And my dad’s like, “Oh, okay, come on in, have a cup of coffee!” (laughter) I used to tease them that if Charlie Manson came to the door, they’d invite him in.
him; he was just very down-to-Earth. That’s what I loved about him; he was so accepting of people. That’s why he opened his home to everyone. My fondest memory of my mom... there’s a lot of memories. We had a real good mother/daughter relationship. My mother and I argued more than my dad and I did! (laughter) In high school, a friend of ours, Gary Sherman, found out Paul McCartney was a fan of my father. My father drew a caricature of the Paul McCartney & Wings band; he made them all into super-heroes. They invited him to a concert, and we went backstage and presented him with the drawing. At first we didn’t think we were going to get to meet him; we met Linda McCartney. She was a wonderful lady, very nice. Then I turned around, and out comes Paul McCartney—and I just stood there...! (laughter) I was probably about fifteen, and I just stood there and stared. My mom used to tease me about it: “You didn’t even say one word to him! You just stood there with your mouth hanging open in disbelief!” They gave us tickets, and the Forum in LA was packed. We’re all sitting there, and all of a sudden my mom goes, “Lisa, what’s that smell?” (laughter) The guy next to me had lit up a joint, and my mom says to me, “Is he smoking marijuana?! Oh my God!” So she took a kleenex out of her purse, and she held it over her face for the entire show! (laughter) And I’m sinking in my seat out of embarrassment. But the most exciting part was when Paul McCartney got up to sing “Magneto & Titanium Man” and he dedicated it to Jack Kirby. That was just outrageous; it was really exciting! Also during the ’70s, when KISS was popular, we got tickets to a concert and dad went down and talked to Gene Simmons while he went offstage to fix his makeup. (laughter) I was going to these rock concerts with my parents; it was kinda neat.
TJKC: Were you closer to your mom or your dad? LISA: I had pretty different relationships with both of them. With my dad, the time I did get to spend with him was really special, because I didn’t have that much time to spend with him. You think when you have a father that works at home, you’d get to spend a lot of time with him, but that really wasn’t the case. TJKC: Do you have a fondest memory of your mom or your dad? LISA: This may seem off the wall, but my dad did a really neat thing for me. I had a horse, and one of the stipulations for them buying me a horse and having it at home was that I was to take care of it, and do all the cleaning and raking manure, and all that. (laughter) And every day, my dad would get out there with a shovel and clean that corral, and throw that stuff over the fence into the canyon. I was twelve years old, and I’m like, “Dad, I thought I was supposed to do that.” And he goes, “Girls are not supposed to do this kind of work.” (laughter) So he’d shoo me out of there, after this whole thing about how I was supposed to take care of my horse, and I think he actually enjoyed it! I think it was therapeutic for him to shovel manure over the fence! (laughter) It was like his little break from work, to go out there and clean my corral. He was just such a super guy. I miss him a lot, mainly because he was so humble, and good to people. He didn’t have any airs about
TJKC: Just in our short talk here, I sense a lot of similarities between you and your mother, in your mannerisms, and the way you talk. LISA: A lot of people say that. I spent a lot of time with her. My mother was a very strong woman; very strong-willed. She ran the show. She was a tough cookie, and I think I have a lot of those traits. I can also be really stubborn, and she and I would bump heads once in a while. (laughter) But I think those are good qualities to have, to an extent. A fond memory with my mother alone was a big party I had for her 75th birthday. A lot of people came up to the house, and that was probably the last big party we had before she became ill. She was really shining during that time; she was so appreciative of everybody being there. She was the queen of the moment. (laughter) It was nice to see her happy. A fond memory of them together would probably be their 50th Anniversary. It was kind of sad, because my father at the time was in remission from his cancer, and he didn’t look well. But they got up there and renewed their vows, and they danced. It was just a really great moment. They both had a lot of perseverance, even during my father’s illness. He didn’t want people to know that he felt bad, and they were both like that. They tried to have very good attitudes, even when they didn’t feel well. TJKC: Last question: What’s the best advice your dad ever gave you? LISA: Hmmm. I guess to do the best you can. Whatever you choose to do, do it well, to the best of your ability, and go after your dreams. He was very pro-education; he thought having a good educational background was a real positive thing for people to do. I know he always encouraged young people to stay in school. I kind of wish I had! (laughter) I enjoy what I do, and I’m happy with what I do, and I do go to school—but I wish I’d taken more of his advice about staying in college and getting my degree. Later in life, when you have more responsibilities, it’s harder to do that.♥ (Lisa would like to extend her deep appreciation and special thanks to the fans and industry professionals who sent their condolences on the passing of her parents. Your warm cards and letters have been a great comfort.)
A star is born? 1970s convention drawing. 8
Soiled & Sweet & Sometimes Green! Simon & Kirby’s Women of the Golden Age, by R.J. Vitone ou know that Jack Kirby was there at just about the very beginning, don’t you? In 1938, when Action #1 began the Golden Age of the comic book super-hero with Superman, Jack was settling in for a short stint at Eisner & Iger’s “Universal Phoenix Feature Syndicate.” The staff there churned out newspaper strip-style continuities to be packaged and sold to feature-hungry publishers. Kirby’s efforts, The Count of Monte Cristo, The Diary of Dr. Haywood, and Wilton of the West first saw print in about May of 1938, in a British comic named WAGS. Not long after, Fiction House came knocking, and those strips showed up in the oversize (10" x 14") Jumbo #1, 2, and 3. These pages were his first published American comic book work, and his style, the power, the perspective, the basic storytelling flow of visual narrative, were already there in a crude, unpolished form. Also there was another vital component: The women. Women in comics during those formative days generally had little to do. Not much was asked of them other than to provide some
girls became blurry parts of the whole. “Plot device” best describes their use. In strips like Blue Beetle (1940), Kirby plowed his narrative full speed ahead. His females became bridges to the next gunfight, the next fist-fight, the next... well, fight. Always the beautiful daughter, the wealthy socialite, the faithful secretary, the childhood sweetheart—always left behind, almost forgotten in the rush. She’d be on hand at the end, dot-like eyes fixed squarely on the triumphant hero. (A notable exception came out of the early Eisner/ Iger shop: Sheena, Queen of the Jungle. As Jules Feiffer wrote in The Great Comic Book Heroes, “Sheena was a voluptuous Tarzan who laid waste to wild beasts, savages, and evil white men in the jungle of her day...”) Jack stuck to the popular trend, and even when futuristic sci-fi concepts like “Cosmic Carson” (Science Comics) and “Solar Legion” (Crash Comics) afforded women roles of almost equal status with the heroes, the girls were shown wearing formless, sexless space suits! Although his art and storytelling style had matured greatly by 1940, Kirby was still a diamond in the rough. When Joe Simon entered his professional life, things began to change.
Y
SHe’s Lean, Mean, & Green Simon quickly recognized Jack’s talents, and knew the profit potential of the artist’s speedy penciling. They “teamed” for the first time in Blue Bolt # 2 (July 1940). Simon had sold the sci-fi feature to Novelty Press, and when Kirby joined the mix, the strip found new vistas. The Flash Gordon-ish series seemed tailor-made for Jack, who had trod similar ground in his own “Solar Legion”: Rocketships, ornate weaponry, cosmic encounters in space, and right there—engulfing it all—was the baleful menace of the beautiful Green Sorceress. She was the first dominant female character in the Kirby lexicon, and as such she wielded tremendous power. A magician who could teleport anywhere via her “green aura,” she ruled the Hidden Empire, commanded vast armies of subservient men, and lusted for more lands to conquer... and Blue Bolt. (Her inner conflict usually amounted to soulful stares into her televisor showing her unattainable lover.) He admired her as well, always hoping she’d reform. Over the nine issues S&K produced, the (here and top) Blue Bolt’s Green Sorceress. Green Sorceress was the driving force behind the
Some early Kirby women. decoration and direction, or to stumble into obvious traps in order to be rescued, then provide sexless companionship for the oblivious hero. This wasn’t always by formalistic design. The artwork of the early Golden Age, though produced by enthusiastic young penmen, was mostly slapdash and crude. In some cases, the only means of identifying the heroine was by the fact that she was drawn wearing a dress, and was called by a girl’s name! (By contrast, many of the popular adventure newspaper strips of the day were peopled by a host of clearly-defined, incredibly feminine gals drawn by talents like Foster, Raymond, and Caniff!) Jack studied their work, absorbing their art styles into his own. Even in his early work, women stand out on his pages. Crisp, round faces, upswept hair, and bared shoulders were the norm. This was still the ’30s, after all, the height of the Hollywood glamour period. Actresses struck feral poses in carefully-crafted films designed to showcase the talent. Almost always in shimmering black&-white, on 30-foot-high silver screens, personalities like Dietrich, Garbo, Crawford, Hepburn, and scores of others burned their images into Kirby’s artistic memory. These women, their clothes, their poses, often found their way into his work. Pace was the key, however. Telling a story in 3 or 4 panels, or on one page, or even in a 6-page format forced restrictions. The 9
storylines. Speed was still the key in Jack’s work, but Simon added some twisting bends to the plots. The Blue Bolt/Green Sorceress relationship became a roller-coaster ride of brinkmanship. She’d save his life. He’d put down a military coup that threatened her rule. She’d threaten him. He’d save her from mutant squid creatures. She’d thank him. In Blue Bolt #6, he rescued her from the crossbreeding plans of a demented evil dwarf. She reformed... but not really. Get the idea? By the final two stories S&K worked on, the Forties fun with Joe Sorceress had found her way to our own and Jack. Earth and Blue Bolt had to block her plans to invade and conquer that as well. Had the series continued under Jack & Joe, the (eventual) teaming of the two color-coded protagonists may have produced some multi-hued sparks and some strangely colored offspring. But the lure of other projects moved the team to another publisher, where another strong female would spring to life.
“Ain’t She Pretty, Cap?” Early in 1940, Simon secured a sweet position at Timely. He assumed the duties as Editor of the comics line, but retained the right to freelance work at other publishers. Kirby moved into the Timely bullpen with Joe, and they began to brainstorm new concepts. Red Raven #1 was the first package they produced, followed quickly by “Marvel Boy” (Daring Mystery), “The Vision” (Marvel Mystery), plus a handful of spot illos for Timely’s line of pulps. Their main efforts were directed at what would be their greatest creation: Captain America. All the familiar elements were in place from the first issue—dynamic Cap, puny Steve Rogers, plucky kid sidekick Bucky, blustering Sgt. Duffy, a military camp as a background, colorful villains, and one special lady: Betty Ross. If Kirby’s women thus far had been mere plot-pointers and decor, or a powerfully different Green Sorceress, then Betty Ross stands as a combination of all those things. Timely’s house style headed into the early 1940s was more starkly horrific than most of the other major comics publishers. Sure, women were easy targets in those days, but at Timely, women became victims more often than not—and not just by simple means! Sparked by a parade of classic Alex Schomberg covers, the gals were roasted over fiery pits, impaled on spiked tables, smashed into iron maidens, threatened with red-hot branding irons, tossed into shark tanks, dipped into boiling wax or acid, tied to rockets, or locked into cages with every type of wild rabid beast imaginable. To emerge from that carnage and still be functional, a woman had to be made of stern stuff! Betty was introduced in the very first Cap story in issue one (although that is arguable—the young dark-haired lady who greets the government envoys disguised as an old woman is called
only Agent X-13. The next time we see her in the second story, she’s blond, and introduces herself as Betty Ross). Maybe she’d have liked to buy back that intro, because from that point on, whenever the plot called for a damsel in distress, Jack and Joe drew poor Betty into the story. Her status as a government secret agent (in the ’40s? Her training alone would have made an interesting series) cast her in a more than functionary role. She was cool under duress, trained to be an investigator. She could handle a gun and wasn’t afraid to fight, either. Cap treated her as an equal, and except for some comic relief “romantic” horseplay with hopeless Sgt. Duffy, the hint of S-E-X was barely on hand. But what a victim she made! She appeared in all ten issues that S&K produced, sometimes in more than one story! (She just made #3. The Red Skull is calmly tying her to a rocket-bomb on the cover.) The boys put her through Timely house-style paces at every turn. Evil Orientals, mad Russians, zombies, murderous mummies, crazed elephants, even the Red Skull had their shot at her. In one memorable exchange, a deranged doctor asks her, “Do you have good blood?” But she survived and excelled via brains and two-fisted toughness. It would have been interesting to see her grow as a character under Kirby’s pencil, but just as with the Green Sorceress, it was not meant to be. S&K left Timely, and headed over to DC.
“A Very Nice Song, Rip Darling”
Imagine the chaos and upheaval. Over the matter of a few short months, America plunged into global warfare, S&K left Captain America—a solid hit at Timely—and moved with some uncertainty to DC/National. What would they do? No one seemed sure at the time. (Oh, yes... and Jack Kirby married Rosalind Goldstein on May 23, 1942. You could almost see it on a splash page: “Against the backdrop of a world in flames, two starcrossed lovers find each other amid the ruins of war! Could their love endure? NOW IT CAN BE TOLD!... the story without an ending... The Queen Crowns Her King!”) While a real-life woman was making life interesting for Jack, the move to DC sparked a creative avalanche from his drawing board. The combination of producing fresh new series and stacking Betty Ross: Nice legs, and a good shot! inventory features in expectation of key 10
talent Rafferty Mob,” Star-Spangled #17) she was even being tougher than any of the guys, then never seen drafted again. Jim Harper, who was a policeman when produced he wasn’t The Guardian, seemed to lead an amazing a solitary Joe Friday-like life: Seldom at amount of home, always on the job. Only the globematerial in trotting Boy Commandos offered much less than a space for women, usually young freedom year and a fighters, desperate to repel the invaders half. (One from their homelands (“Toinette The unofficial Terrible,” Boy Commandos #4). count put One female war-time menace reared the figure her masked head in Boy Commandos at over 100 #1. In “Satan Wears A Swastika,” stories and Agent Axis—a mysterious Gestapo 75 covers!) operative—terrorizes occupied Europe. The product didn’t look cheap either. “The Sandman & Sandy,” “The Thought dead in an explosion, the villain returns in Stuntwoman. Manhunter,” “The Guardian and the Newsboy Legion,” “Boy Boy Commandos #3, only to be revealed as a beautiful Commandos” led by Rip Carter—each with their own place in the woman. Her plans thwarted, she jumps out of a castle window—to her Kirby Hall of Fame; long-underwear heroes, street-smart kids, profesdeath? At least for a while. After the war, S&K resurrected the basic sional soldiers leading an international detachment of young warcharacter in Boy Commandos #23 as “Agent 13,” but the twist here is riors. This was the Golden now the black-robed Age. But there was something fiend is two people, a missing from Kirby’s newest man and a woman! The work. Where had all the rest of the war-time women gone? inventory featured little Women at the House else in the way of women. that Superman built were Jack and Joe put in their treated largely as secondmilitary time, then class citizens. After a period returned, ready to of pulp-style gore and menace work—but not at DC. directed at them in the late ’30s, the over-all feel of DC’s books softened. It was left to Timely, Fox, and Fiction A short stop at House to tie women to proHarvey Publications in pellers. At DC, their place 1946 produced a couple was still somewhere “back of titles. Stuntman was there,” pointing the way or about a caped daredevil getting in it. (Lois Lane was a in stories set against ballsy exception.) By the time glittery Hollywood setJack arrived, Hawkgirl and tings. Blonde actress Wonder Woman were changSandra Sylvan was the ing the formula, paving the lady in the spotlight, with way for more female input. just slightly more to do (The Second World War than any other war-time helped the process. American Kirby female. Had the women became a major part quickly-cancelled series of the work force with so gone on, she was intendmany men off to war!) But no ed to join the hero as such equality rolled out of the Stuntwoman. The Boy S&K Tudor City studio. Their Explorers took the ladies reverted to their preNewsboy Legion/Boy Timely roles: Decoration/ Commandos style and Plot Devices/Pals, with nary eschewed women for a Betty Ross to be seen. the most part. The book Sandman and Manhunter lasted one issue (plus a needed little more than gallimited release b-&-w), pals, granny ladies, socialite but one leftover story “friends,” or just plain victims. saw print in Terry & The The Newsboy Legion was a Pirates #3 & 4 (May ’47). members-only boys club that “The Isle Where Women ran the streets with a “Who Rule” was Amazon Isle, Needs Goils?” attitude. Even where women believe when a tough skirt showed up leading a rival gang, (“The Unpublished Stuntman page, with Sandra Sylvan. (above) Boy Explorers meet killer women! that “a man’s place is in 11
“Knocked Out By A... Man!”
The good, the bad, and the ugly: The women of Simon & Kirby’s crime comics. the kitchen,” and employ a rough and tough female fighting force to make it stick! Naturally, the boys show the ladies that not all men are hopeless, but have to escape the isle in a hail of gunfire! A post-war comics bust spelled doom for the Harvey titles. By the time the dust had settled, Jack was back to the drawing board to begin one of the most productive periods of his career.
these stories. The other-worldly tales of suspense offered little else for them to do. Much less complex or layered than the other S&K titles, most of these brief tales had an interesting beginning, a short middle, and a snap ending. Kirby’s ladies had to stand aside in the rush; but the new decade of the ’50s offered up one lady who wouldn’t stand aside.
“Oh How I Hate Thees Man”
Mean. Scornful. Fearful in her wrath. And beautiful as any Kirby woman, patterned after any film star you can imagine. Davis? A touch. Crawford? More than a little. Dietrich? Right out of Destry Rides Again (’39). She is Mother Delilah from Boys’ Ranch #3 (Feb. 1951)—one of the most celebrated stories from that series, and rightly so. Another ‘kid-gang’ with an adult guardian (Clay Duncan) set in the Wild West—sure, more kids with guns, but also with much more depth than previous S&K kid-gang strips—the basic elements that had made the romance and crime books so thematically strong were applied here as well. Boys’ Ranch became a multi-leveled experience, with plenty of rootin’-tootin’ twogun fun for fans of the genre, mixed with strong storytelling. Mother Delilah stands as one of the strongest. The epic unfolds Mother Delilah. like a John Ford western, introducing all the main characters and conflicts in just a few panels. Clay’s rebuff of saloon hostess Del triggers a plan meant to hurt the frontiersman via the young Angel. (Spoiler Warning: The ending of “Mother Delilah” is told here!) She mothers the boy, and the relationship softens both of them. Clay confronts Delilah with demands that she stop seeing Angel, and she decides to play dirty. She cuts the trusting boy’s long hair off. (When she does, Kirby shows her in turmoil, reluctant but determined.) When Angel sees her work, he runs off as her laughter fills the panel. Strong stuff. Angel regains his self-respect as his hair grows back, but Delilah finds her own redemption only by dying. She saves Clay from an ambush and leaps in front of bullets meant for him. As the saloon “poet” speaks her eulogy, Angel kneels over her body. In truth, her type died with her. She was the culmination of over ten years of the developing Kirby Golden Age female. Although the romance and suspense titles would continue for a couple more years, that particular style of Jack’s art would continue to develop, and by the mid-’50s, the way he drew women would change again. The Golden Age gave way to the Silver Age; the end became a new beginning; and Jack was there for that beginning as well!♥
“Better To Be Scorned Than Dead”
The Simon & Kirby team’s new home was Crestwood Publications, where a favorable financial share of the profits provided extra incentive to produce hits—and they did! In a handful of titles, S&K rolled out romance, crime, and magic. In all, women found new levels of importance. While serving in the military, Joe Simon had come to the realization that traditional super-hero/funny animal books were just not enough to appeal to all types of readers. He made some notes and sketches for a new type of comic, and filed them away until after the war. The romance comic was the result. Since you’ll find an in-depth study of the romance titles elsewhere in this issue, we’ll move on with just this: Kirby’s women now became central characters with no costumed hero to run off with the story, or no cute kids with Tommyguns on hand to blast the bad guys. Stories became finely structured, talky soap operas in an old-time romantic tradition; and if it worked in romance comics—why not in crime comics? Justice Traps The Guilty and Headline took that romance formula and added guns and gangsters. Women found themselves trapped in a dark world of noir-ish nightmares—not only as victims, but also as first-person narrators of sordid stories of sin. Sometimes they were dark-haired, steely-eyed firebrands, packing guns, leading gangs, robbing stores, and breaking bones in insurance scams. Other times they’d be sticky-sweet, the sister of a kid gone wrong, or the naive childhood sweetheart of a confirmed heel—always caught between the law and their heart, or just plain greedy. Jack’s art by this time had found new levels of craftsmanship. The plot-driven narrative called for slick page layouts to keep the reader interested. Explosive fistand gun-fights were bracketed by melodramatic build-ups. Dialogue spouted from figures frozen mid-motion, or posing in pin-up-like display. The women became reflections of their souls: Cold eyes, chiseled, severe faces for the “bad girls”; blonde-haired, wide-eyed, round faces for the “good girls.” Most were dressed in the period-style of the story, clothes hanging drape-like with weight and folds sharply shaded. From wild dancehall parties, to saloons, to banks, to common street scenes, Kirby presented the crimes on the scene, and took the ladies along for the ride.
“I Talked With My Dead Wife” By the time Black Magic #1 came out (Oct. ’50), the romance/ crime formula was set, and all that was needed was to plug supernatural elements into the mix. Women again reverted to supporting roles in 12
Those Marvel-Ous Kirby Women by Mike Gartland “Yes, I like strong women. I respect women in general. Women have always had great potential. They’re continuing to become prominent in their own way.” Jack Kirby, Comicscene Magazine interview, 1993
(left) Sue appears brave and strong in FF #1, but faints after battling the Hulk (wouldn’t you?) in #25.
J
ack Kirby did indeed like strong women, and this does include the ones that he created for Marvel in the ’60s. There are those who dispute this—they criticize the women of Marvel (we’re talking Silver Age ’61-’70 Kirby) for being loaded with stereotypical, male chauvinistic condescension—but as this article hopes to show, it wasn’t as it appeared, as much as how it read. Just as with the majority of the male super-heroes at Marvel at the time, Kirby was responsible for the co-creation of virtually all of the female characters (excluding only the ones co-created by Steve Ditko)— and since Kirby was definitely established as the major character consultant, he probably had some input into the characters that he didn’t directly introduce as an artist (like The Black Widow for example).
did her part as a member of the team. Some people point out that all she ever did was cook, shop, and faint—which she did, too—but these are present-day minds passing present-day judgments on a character created in the early ’60s. Sue is introduced as a socialite-type person; later on she gets married, has a child, and tries to settle down into a family environment. To me, at least, this seems like average, normal behavior for a lady in the early ’60s (people like to shop and cook; what’s so stereotypical about that?). If she fainted, it was generally because she was battling a force beyond her abilities, like the Hulk, for example; if you had to fight the Hulk, you might find yourself fainting too! Readers at the time apparently protested that she wasn’t contributing as a member of the team. Personally I can’t see a reason for it; she prominently adds to the stories in the first ten issues. If anything, I guess it just came down to the fact that there was a predominately male readership at the time (in super-hero and monster comics anyway), and that her three companions were a little more colorful. In the early ’60s there were many blonde personalities prominent on TV and in the movies—Marilyn Monroe, Jayne Mansfield, Connie Stevens, Dorothy Provine, etc.—and perhaps Jack molded Sue after some of them. He certainly drew her from a contemporary point of view, so Jack was obviously keeping an eye on the times; you’ll notice that before she was costumed, Sue was always rendered fashionably. Alicia was introduced in FF #8 and I’m wondering if she was created for the story itself—as a one-time character—or if as the story went on it was decided to develop her as a love interest for Ben Grimm. She Is Alicia (disguised as Sue) using was drawn to resemble Sue Storm some form of telepathy in FF #8? for the sake of the story, but later (below) FF #49, Alicia’s finest hour. developed her own look (of note is the fact that on page 16 she is depicted by Kirby as holding her hands to her head, in a mentalistic E.S.P. fashion, and dialogue is conspicuously absent from the large empty space overhead; was Kirby trying to imbue her with a sixth sense or other power?). Definitely a supporting character, but Kirby never abandons her for too long a stretch, using her prominently in several FF stories—the most famous being FF #66-67, and Alicia’s greatest moment, in FF #49. There’s no mistaking Medusa as anything but a powerful woman; she is tough and comes out swingin’, quite literally, in her first appearance in FF #36. This is a wonderful
Pin-up from FF Annual #1. Evidence on the original art suggests Jack wrote all the copy, indicating his overwhelming conceptual input. Besides creating the major female characters for Fantastic Four and Thor, he also contributed important ladies to X-Men, Hulk, Avengers, Captain America, and Sub-Mariner storylines. Some of these were created as full-blown major characters; others started out as supporting characters whom Kirby would increase in importance as time went on. In researching these ladies it is easy to see that Kirby imbued each of them with their own distinct personality, and it becomes evident that they all start out as strong women—if not physically, then most assuredly characteristically. Whether Kirby used anyone as inspiration, I can only speculate. I would like to stress that in order to see what Kirby may have intended, the reader must not read. You have to review Kirby’s ’60s Marvel comics like picture books, disregarding the dialogue because one cannot be sure if it was following Kirby’s plots. You will then notice that nearly all of the major female characters are drawn as selfassured and level-headed women. This is evident in the very beginning with Sue Storm in FF #1. She appears to be just as strong emotionally as the other three, and this confidence in characterization continues throughout the series. She 13
example of Kirby’s ability to modernize mythology. In all frankness, the reason she was so popular with the thenpredominately male readership was that, although she was obviously female, she Kirby imbued Medusa with plenty of power, confidence, fought like a and sex appeal—at least while she was a villain. man. She takes no guff from her male co-horts in the Frightful Four and appears to be quite confident and ruthless (and sexy). With no given origin, Kirby later incorporates her into his Inhumans storyline; when he first created her, Kirby hadn’t thought up the Inhumans yet. She fit in perfectly of course, but sadly, it is there that she begins to languish as one of that group, whereas she stood out with the Frightful Four. With the introduction of the Inhumans, Kirby introduced his next major FF female personality, Crystal—the only one of them with a humansounding name. She’s introduced, much like Alicia, to develop as a love interest for one of the FF, and it becomes apparent that she has the temperament and ability to handle the Human Torch. In her initial appearance she appears almost elfin in looks, like a young child; perhaps Jack used one of his daughters to draw from—or Bridget Bardot, since Crystal appears very much the sex-kitten, very much the vixen. As time went on Jack would use Crystal more Crystal went from elfin and more, finally making her a part of the (left) to vivacious (above). team when he gave Sue Storm “maternity leave”; by this time, however, Crystal lost her elfish face in favor of a more standard one, but her shape remained the same—thanks Jack! For Thor, Jack introduced us to Jane Foster in the second issue and she immediately is used not only in intrigue, but to establish the old love triangle between two people (the Lois-Clark-Superman type of triangle). Jane loved Thor, and would’ve loved Blake if she knew he Jane picks up Hercules in #125. cared; Blake loved Jane but couldn’t
because the shadow of Thor stood in the way. This didn’t stop Jack from getting Jane involved in most of the stories, though. In the early stories it’s usually Thor who rescues Jane, but later in the series, where it’s evident that Kirby is doing the plotting solo, we see Jane become an integral part of the stories involving the other characters Jack is introducing at the time. Rather than being threatened by them, she is interacting with them. Jack has her go for a quick drink with Hercules, room with an alien, and tutor a group of evolved animals— things not covered under general nursing practice. In fact, Jane may have been originally drawn from the proliferation of medical shows on TV at that time, all strong on human interest drama to be sure. Kirby resolves the two-way love triangle by introducing a new love interest for Thor (perhaps because by this time, Kirby was leaving the The stunning Sif— world of humans far behind, as far a precursor to Big Barda? as Thor was concerned anyway). So in a nice little segue story, Thor tries one last time with Jane, but she can’t cut it as an immortal, so exit Jane (no, she wasn’t killed) and enter Sif (for you youngsters out there, this takes place in Thor #136). Sif comes on the scene with kinda a chip on her shoulder; she’s just loaded with confidence. She’s sure she can do anything a warrior of Asgard can do and then some. Sif looks like she might have been inspired by Sophia Loren, a very dark, full-figured girl; she figures prominently in most of the stories thereafter as a fit battle-companion for Thor. Of note is that Jack hinted at a possible triangle involving Balder in issue #143-144, but this is never developed, perhaps because Kirby decided to involve Balder with another female down the line. The Thor storyline had its share of villainesses also; in the early part of the run there was The Enchantress, introduced in issue #103. Kirby had drawn attractive women up until that point, but The Enchantress was drawn specifically to be attractive. Jack looks like he took Marilyn Monroe, Jayne Mansfield, Caroll Baker, and some of the bombshells from his generation—Lauren Bacall, Veronica Lake, and Was Jack consciously—or unconsciously—using Betty Grable for good phallic imagery to introduce the Enchantress? measure—and poured
SUE’s ’DOs Contest Over Jack’s 100+ issues of Fantastic Four, the Invisible Girl went through quite a few hairdos. Be the first to send us the correct issue numbers for each hairstyle, and we’ll award you a free issue of TJKC!
Jackie-oh
Teased 14
Bad hair day
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Short ’n sassy
them all into The Enchantress. She ruthless. Although she appears to be as powerful as The Enchantress, was drawn to be all things attracshe is a plotter and schemer and prefers to have others do her dirty work tively feminine in Jack’s point of for her. Physically, Jack has her go from attractive to witchlike (almost view; not what he perceived as the haglike), depending if her evil nature is showing. As time goes on, perfect woman, but what he felt the majority of men would find to be the perfect woman (although he made her “zoftig” enough for his own taste—not that I’m complaining). It’s hinted in her introduction: The Enchantress in street clothes; If you want sex, enough to make Norse gods weak. you go to The Enchantress (not literally, but in Asgard, who knows?). It should also be noted how Loki is “holdin’ his horns” on page 4, and the allure of The Enchantress’ stockings—a Kirby subliminal previously discovered by other sharp-eyed Kirby fans. As an excellent use of name, Kirby makes her not only enchanting visually, but an enchanter physically. She is, up until that time, his most powerful female creation; definitely able to humble powerful men one way or the other. Kirby brings her into The Avengers storyline where, although she returns briefly to Thor, she basically remains as one of their major foes, eventually taking them on single-handedly (and beautifully rendered by Don Heck, I might add). Jack creates a secondary Enchantress in the person of The Norn Queen. She appears sporadically in the early part of Karnilla got a major makeover the run, until finally between Thor #150 and #157. appearing as Karnilla in Thor #150. In her earlier appearances, she appears to help Thor, sometimes begrudgingly, but definitely is not as thoroughly evil as she is when Kirby “re-introduces” her as Karnilla. By then she is a full ally of Loki and just as Hela reappears as Sif lies injured; pencils from Thor #154. Is that a Romita Thor face in panel 1?
Wigged-out
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however, she generally appears attractive and it is she that Jack involves Balder with eventually; this tends to soften her evil edge, but Jack makes it clear that this is a woman who won’t let her heart rule her head. She loves Balder, but she’ll kill him if she has to (how’s that for strong conviction and sense of duty—a reversal of the generallyaccepted stereotype of romantic females done at that time?). For an example of this you can refer to Jack’s liner notes on the original art on pg. 21 of TJKC #14. Hela was to Asgardians what Galactus was to humans; a giant, aloof, enigmatic being who could erase you out of existence. Kirby introduced her in a Tales of Asgard story; she almost looks like she was drawn in a hurry. Jack definitely developed this character as he used her; she appears to be inspired by no one individual. Kirby was simply rendering a mythological character in his own way, much like he did Thor. Hela is a representation of a concept, not a person, but is put in human form; Kirby keeps her as a detached Hela and Sif first appeared in JIM character, yet an imposing one. Whenever she appears she seems #102 (both made more auspicious and definitive entrances later). to loom over those around her, much as death does to all of us. Kirby uses her to a much grander effect in subsequent appearances in Thor #133 and #150. Marvel Girl, Jack’s feminine contribution to his X-Men, meets the X-Men for the first time in #1 along with the rest of us. Kirby devotes several pages to her, showing that she is level-headed, fashionable, and powerful enough to handle unwanted advances. In just about every issue of X-Men that he handles (plotting #1-17 and drawing #1-11), he always gives her a spot to show that she pulls her weight as a member of the team. It is of interest that Marvel Girl, Kirby’s third super-heroine, is a redhead; with Sue Storm being a blonde and The Wasp a brunette, one wonders if this was intentional on Jack’s part, or an editorial decision. As much as Jack tried to keep Marvel Girl in the readers’ Like the Invisible Girl, Marvel Girl was eye, she was easily overprone to fainting spells, but neither shirked her duties to her teammates. shadowed by his next female creation, the Scarlet Witch, introduced in X-Men #4. She was his first femme fatale for Marvel, appearing only a month or so before his Enchantress and she was drawn as a zoftig, dark-haired, exotic creature (generally thought of as
Page boy
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Jack’s kind of girl). It’s easy to envision parts of Roz and Rita Hayworth in the Scarlet Witch; she is confident, powerful, and beautiful and Kirby utilizes her effectively in every story he uses her in. After Jack finishes with her in X-Men (she literally walks out of the story), she’s quickly snapped up for a run in Avengers and is rendered just as attractively by Don Heck. The powerful, confident Scarlet Witch. Dorma was another Was Roz an influence on this character? raven-haired beauty rendered by Jack, brought in as a love interest for the Sub-Mariner in FF Annual #1; in the beginning she appears almost alien but becomes quite exotic by the time Kirby handles her again in FF #33 (I’d like to add that Chic Stone’s inks helped to beautify Jack’s women nicely; Chic inked the initial appearances of The Enchantress and Medusa, and improved the looks of The Scarlet Witch and Dorma). When Dorma appears in this issue, one wonders what Namor saw in Sue Storm. Betty Ross, the second woman created for Marvel, was introduced by Kirby in Hulk #1. She begins as a supporting character, looking like Jackie Kennedy in her initial appearance—a levelheaded girl trying to control her temperamental father. She meets and becomes fascinated with Banner, Doris Day meets Rita Hayworth; notice how which of course leads much more exotic Dorma looks than Sue. her to become more involved in the stories as time goes on. By issue #5 she’s hip-deep in adventure, fighting alongside Rick Jones and the Hulk. Jack worked on the character again when he drew the Hulk in Tales To Astonish, and plotted the stories that Bill Everett drew in the same title in the mid-’60s. Much like Jane Foster, Betty was Jack’s version of a normal (non super-powered) girl caught up in extraordinary circumstances, doing her best to cope without losing it. Jack introduces Sharon Carter, first known as Agent 13, in Tales of Suspense as a compatriot, battle-companion, and love interest for Captain America. By the time Kirby ends his run on Cap she is firmly established as an integral part in his stories, sharing his adventures much like the Wasp did with Giant-Man. Jack also introduced characters like Tana Nile and Agatha Harkness—and lesser ones that I haven’t forgotten—but Jack only handled these creations once or twice. Some were throwaway (or giveaway if you will) characters, and
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there isn’t enough space here to cover them. I’ve come to the conclusion Kirby depicted his female creations with beauty, power, grace, and especially, respect. The stereotyping comes mostly from the dialogue; there are examples of Kirby originals where his females are supposed to be acting as rational as the story
allows, but this is sometimes disregarded in favor of supposedly dramatic or witty dialogue. (For example, in FF #31 on page 8, in the first panel Kirby has the Mole Man say to Sue: “Tell your pals to surrender or I kill you.” Sue replies: “There’s no need to do this.” Granted, Kirby is writing in the borders and cannot put in much dialogue, but it’s enough to show that Sue isn’t desperate or overwrought with emotion; the printed dialogue, of course, belies that. There are other examples, some in previous issues of TJKC, where Jack’s uninked pages are shown.) The published dialogue used on Jack’s women does appear sometimes chauvinistic, but I wouldn’t fault Jack; he had much more experience writing about women from his work with Joe Simon. As far as I’m concerned, Jack stood by his quote at the beginning of this article. He had confidence that women had confidence in themselves and could get the job done; it is apparent that Jack represented his females with all the attributes that men should always respect them for: Beauty, confidence, charm, and personality—and a little super-power just to round it out.♥
Agatha Harkness, the last new female addition to Fantastic Four during Jack’s run. (below) Thor’s Tana Nile.
Uninked pencils from Captain America #104, page 8, featuring Sharon Carter, a.k.a. Agent 13. And let us not forget Jack’s other FF “follicle firsts,” all deserving of mention: Farrah
The headband
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and value of “manhood” a more pivotal question, in these books than in much of the entertainments contemporaneous to them, with or without Kirby’s byline. Collectively, the themes’ exploration in Kirby’s two best-regarded opuses seems to address concerns that were central to him as both an artist and a citizen.
Neither Jack’s Women Nor Yours:
Clash Of The Titans
Gender Relations in the Kirby Pantheon, by Adam Sternberg McGovern
Fans are justly fond of comparing and contrasting the Fourth World titles and The Eternals. They are Kirby’s two crowning attempts at epic storytelling and universal artistic statement. Each are impressive syntheses of heroic lore and personified values recurrent throughout history and across cultures. The differences are readily discernible— Fourth World’s inspiration was more Biblical while Eternals’ was more mythological; Fourth World’s tone was more spiritual/magical while Eternals’ was more secular/technological; Fourth World’s stated relationship to its sources was more enigmatic while Eternals’ was more literal, etc. Similarly, Fourth World segmented its themes among its three constituent storylines while Eternals compressed all into one. Yet in both sagas we see issues of male/female participation, and examinations of the combative and cooperative sensibilities respectively assigned by history to men and women.
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ttuned to pop-cultural currents like few others in either the “folk” or “high” arts of his time, Jack Kirby never produced a comic that didn’t reflect its social moment. But it was never more than in his mythology-based series that he reflected on the issues of the ages. The Fourth World trilogy and the Eternals saga were the principal works in which humankind’s struggle (and indeed ambivalence) between conflict and peace, order and free will, solitude and oneness (both societal and spiritual)—and, to no lesser extent, our mystification with gender—were projected and tentatively resolved. Women are more of a literal and thematic presence, and the nature
Got Any New Goddesses? In a mid-’80s interview (see TJKC #16), Kirby, the master of two-fisted fantasy, remarked curiously and poignantly that “In this kind of an age, I don’t think we can afford power... of any kind.” And in this age, it’s still men who wield the power—along with an occasional handful of women like Margaret Thatcher, whose admission price is equal brutality. As such, the Fourth World’s flagship title, New Gods, was pervaded with what critic Amy Taubin has seen in the films of Martin Scorcese: A “critique of masculinity” (Village Voice, 3/11/98). Reading the series can be a grueling experience of unrelieved combat, showing just how much the cycle’s centerpiece needed the humanizing influence of its satellite narratives The Forever People and Mister Miracle. Epic conflict is a traditionally male domain (in its principals if not its victims), and there is a corresponding scarcity of major female characters in New Gods, as noted by Elayne Wechsler-Chaput in TJKC #6. Nonetheless, a female perspective is present and crucial in the series. Most notably, the women in New Gods act as chorus and conscience, admonishing the male actors (quite possibly in vain) on the desolation —and even doom—of their chosen course. In #7, New Goddess Avia exhorts her husband Izaya to enjoy life rather than relish battle, shortly before she falls in the assassination that will spur him to initiate a martial holocaust and then spend an eternity in penitent pacifism. In issue #8 mortal playwright Eve Donner (significantly, a creator rather than destroyer—Avia’s specific regret had been that she’d never heard Izaya sing) confronts series-protagonist Orion on the suicidal intensity of his righteous vengefulness, first pitying him and finally, as he runs back to conflict, wishing him the peace that may be the one thing beyond his powers.
The Lightray Touch Granny Goodness looks especially ruthless in these pencils from Mister Miracle #8. 18
Elsewhere in the storyline, a male voice is the commentator on Orion’s brand of masculinity. The dashing and comfortably fey Lightray repeatedly reins
in his volatile comrade’s fearsome outbursts, gently rebukes Orion for his cynical dismissal of two overheard young lovers, is solicitous and apologetic toward forthcoming Earth women who don’t get past Orion’s hostile shell, and soliloquizes his mystification at what motivates the contest between males of Earth, New Genesis and Apokolips he sees unfold in the “Death Wish of Terrible Turpin” episode. A native of New Genesis rather than a refugee from Apokolips like Orion (who in #6 laments war’s intrusion upon personalities like Lightray’s, thereby implying his own emotional limitations), Lightray’s rejection of machismo (at least in principle) is complete. It is clear that New Genesis embraces the equality principle; though Orion’s personal life is devoid of the comforts and counsel of women, he adheres to his adoptive society’s codes, fully involving secretary Claudia Shane in the operations he undertakes with his other human allies, and exhorting one of them (accountant Victor Lanza) that Lanza’s wife (who theretofore has apparently been kept in the dark) is welcome to share the secrets of the Apokolips/New Genesis war.
Woman and Superwoman n The Eternals, Kirby found himself confining a tale of the Fourth World’s epic scope to a single title; the thematic strands which could be comfortably dispersed among that cycle’s three books here had to be woven into one. Consequently, woman were front-and-center from The Eternals’ earliest days.
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The Good... Margo Damian is the first we meet, part of a father-daughter archaeologist team which has stumbled upon evidence of prehistoric alien visitors to the Earth. Upon the return of these “Space Gods” (who genetically engineered the human race, the super-heroic Eternals, and the malevolent “Deviants” from primordial apes), a force-field cordoned base of operations is set up from which they will render a 50-year judgment of their ancient handiwork. When the elder Dr.
Father Knows Best? True, in #6 Orion (with no contradiction from Lightray) practically orders the young Lynn Sheridan (who has earlier expressed dismay at her hawk father and dove brother’s mutual animosity) to fly Orion’s “astro-harness” away from a gathering battle when she begs to stay by her father’s side. It’s a scene which will be echoed in Eternals #3 (see below), and exhibits some of the ambiguities which would never be fully resolved in Kirby’s oeuvre. After the death of his son, the father has slipped into traumatic dementia and awaits what he imagines to be his real-life WWII enemies, thereby introducing a theme of crazy old men making their suicidal decisions while young women escape and live on. In this light, Lynn’s compulsory departure can be seen as sexism on Orion’s part, or can be interpreted as a kind of blunt manumission (or womanumission). Paradoxically, the act represents a man breaking through a woman’s socially-conditioned sacrificial deference—though to do it, he himself declines the sensitivity traditionally relegated to the female realm, and assumes the authority to dictate a woman’s behavior “for her own good” (not a quote from the story).
Our Mother, Who Art In A Box Of course, beyond New Gods’ narratively marginal (if thematically pivotal) female characters, there is a female essence which figures prominently throughout the Fourth World cycle. Most protagonists use, and in an oblique way commune with, their “Mother Box,” a bizarre talismanic palmtop which links them to the wisdom of their ancestors and has ineffable protective (and even therapeutic) properties. “She” is a high-tech stand-in for the intermediary role between humanity and divinity played by a host of male and female spirits in the Jewish Kabala belief system, and by the Virgin Mary in Catholicism. Orion’s Mother Box charitably “re-shifts the atoms” of his face to resemble a native New Genesis visage, but when his ferocious temperament disrupts the introspective depth needed to connect with the device, a resurgently grotesque exterior manifests his other nature, his Mr. Hyde masculinity.
Orion’s mother Tigra makes a surprise appearance in Mister Miracle #8. 19
Damian chooses to stay and study, another young woman gets strongarmed into escaping her father’s decision, this time in the burly grip of Ikaris the Eternal. It’s the ultimate in chauvinistic chivalry to be sure, but it ironically “liberates” her from the imposition of a more literal patriarch’s values. Through the act, Ikaris also abruptly spares Margo the agony of moral decision-making—and isn’t that what many of us want godlike beings for? At any rate, her anguished reactions—and, it seems, subtle relief— are three-dimensionally portrayed, setting a pattern for one of the more nuanced (if misunderstood) personalities in Kirby’s body of work. Though disparaged by some Kirby fans as a cardboard goody-goody who stands in embarrassing contrast to the likably libertine Sersi (a kind of “cat fighting” relationship that the two characters would, admittedly, slide into toward the series’ late-period decline), Margo is most often the voice of responsibility (a guidance role rare to women in the superhero comics of the day). Her “courage” is noted as early as issue #3, and later on she repeatedly shows more composure in the face of the unknown than the male professor and pontificator Samuel Holden, the scholar who first introduces the Eternals and Deviants to an unsuspecting humankind—at the arrangement of Margo, a woman.
“star” slot in issues #8-10’s “Lemuria Trilogy,” in which she visits the domain of her Deviant adversaries, confronts and overcomes some of her prejudices against them, and takes on two of them as wards. Though the final story of this sequence is titled “Mother,” Thena is really assuming the more traditionally male role of mentor—one rare for women in comics history, and all the more so for that time. She comes across the grotesque yet philosophical Karkas (a disdained model of maleness) and the handsome yet vicious “Reject” (a sadly prized one) in the Deviants’ gladiatorial arena, removing the pair from this realm of conflict to her idyllic mountain-top home. Upon the Reject’s arrival in Olympia, Thena separates him from the crowd of admiring but frivolous women who’ve gathered around him, thereby contradicting the superficial level on which the sexes are expected to relate to each other, and delivering the first admonition of the bred killer’s emotional education: “Love is caring! Love is respect for the dignity of others! You’ve known nothing of that...” (#12). This theme of moral authority and instruction from a woman was exceptional
...the Bad... After Margo, we meet the mischievous and strongwilled Sersi the Eternal. She’s first introduced to us as a kind of immortal jet-setter, undertaking a millennialong series of vacations which just happen to land her in the middle of King Arthur’s court, Rome burning, etc. But in fact, she’s a witness and catalyst in many of the great historical events credited by men to other men. She not only teaches Ulysses’ “ravenous crew of slobs” some manners by turning them into pigs, she also encounters a Merlin without “much talent” until she shows the “old soak” a trick or two. In the person of Sersi, male history’s femmes fatales (from Circe the Sorceress to, by implication, Morgan le Fay) are recast as heroines. Her headstrong quality is primarily portrayed as refreshing rather than bothersome, and she supplies one of the series’ best running gags as the automatic avenger of male arrogance (memorably in issue #6, when she goes as far as the Comics Code will allow in taunting a Deviant captor for expressing his sexuality through his weapon—which she then makes literally flaccid by transmuting it from steel to rubber). Throughout the series she and Ikaris spar over his affable but reckless machismo (a gender animosity that grows more intense and grim toward the final issue), and while in the later, lesser stories dialogue references to her frivolity proliferate, a mid-series caption still describes her as personifying “the joy of living.” Though over-endowed and under-clothed in the manner of too many Kirby women, psychologically she is still one of his most complexly realized ones.
...and the Tough The characterization of Eternals’ third major female character, Thena, is a landmark of comic book women being portrayed as commanding but not stereotyped as bossy. We first see her engaged in a recreational, life-size Rock-’Em-Sock-’Em-Robots-style tourney against her own father (the “Prime Eternal”)—but the point is that we’re introduced to her triumphing over a man by applying herself while he blusters. She gets her first crack at the series’ rotating
(this page and next) The enchanting Sersi, from Eternals #4. 20
Peace, Love and Inequality
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n occasion throughout the series, Kirby’s narration takes rueful relish in noting that the Eternals “are yet another species of Man” (sic)—usually during a scene of brawling. By the same token, the Eternals remain (psychologically if not physically) a gender-segregated society —joint efforts like Thena and Makarri’s are less common than Sersi being admonished to stay out of Ikaris’s way. The fullest unification of male and female comes elsewhere, and not in Forever People, though it is the other of these storylines that co-stars a woman from its inception. Forever People, while often a series of great charm, did not have the same level of character differentiation as its companion Fourth World titles. “Beautiful Dreamer,” the woman of this hippie-inspired troupe, gets assigned a roughly equal amount of their un-cloyingly inspirational homilies, and works well as one arm of a team that’s more a collection of abilities than personality traits—but she’s seldom central to the narrative, and is sometimes at the bottom of its social scale. She’s the subject of gratuitous cheesecake sequences in the series’ DC-tampered decline, and is unprovokedly snapped at in issue #7’s time-travel sequence by her apparent boyfriend Mark Moonrider (an unpleasant though not inaccurate depiction of hippieera gender relations). We do at one point see another of the males, Serifan, weeping without shame (and with implicit endorsement from Kirby’s captions) when he mistakenly believes he’s the last surviving group member. And the late-period Trixie Magruder character (a mortal ex-Flapper turned eccentric landlady to the team) provides a refreshing example of an unmarried elderly woman being portrayed without derision (two decades before Titanic)—but overall, from the standpoint of exploring the battle and reconciliation of the sexes, this is not one of Kirby’s more satisfying and significant series.
Super Liberation Artist
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hat mantle is instead borne by Mister Miracle (which was named for a man, but whose female co-protagonists apparently came quite close to getting their own book before DC aborted the entire cycle anyway). Male vulnerability and female equality were hallmarks of this series like no other in Kirby’s canon. In the first three issues we get to know “Scott Free,” who escapes to Earth from a hellish orphanage/boot camp on Apokolips (where he was given his mocking name), thus heightening hostilities between that world and his native New Genesis. Scott is portrayed from the start as a man with “a haunting look of fear in (his) eyes—and pain,” in other words, a man in touch with his feelings, pleasant or otherwise. It’s this lowering of his emotional barricades (this comfort level would later come into common American parlance as his “feminine side”) that enables him to activate his Mother Box; when “she” is “injured” in an early issue, Scott “must pour out my love—my belief—to make her respond!” Scott is both haunted and sustained by the fragmentary memory of a woman—his real mother (the one who wanted to hear Izaya sing), whose identity and relationship to him he may never know. Unlike the denial-steeped and unswervingly “masculine” Orion, who was, like Scott, abandoned by his father in the truce-swap that brought Scott to Apokolips, Scott confronts his traumas and is paradoxically much more at peace. We see him yelp in fear (early in #8) and cry out in pain (midway through #18) — this is quite atypical behavior for a male super-hero, and the central visual motif of the series (subtitled Super Escape Artist), a male body in bondage, was virtually unprecedented in pop-culture conceptions of American men’s self-image.
for the medium, and Thena and her charges were, significantly, the focus of The Eternals’ one Annual in 1977.
Where Are The Great Male Eternals? The series’ principal male protagonist presents a sharp and intentional contrast to the counterparts detailed above. Ikaris is affectionately portrayed as having more heroics than brains, ordering Sersi around in late-series, faintly praised as the least objectionable of his macho clan in mid-series, and, in the early days, providing a definitive scenario: Having placed Margo in Sersi’s care during the Deviants’ first attack on a modern city (and thus effectively delegated his emotions to the womenfolk), he rushes off to single-handedly oppose an entire army of enemies, and is promptly rendered unconscious and left at the bottom of the sea. A watchful Ajak (the Eternal in charge of the Space Gods’ landing site) decides to leave him there to “stew” over “what happens to heroes.” The Deviant force is then subdued by the team of Thena and Makarri (another male Eternal). Narratively speaking, it doesn’t matter that only two prevail where one failed; the point is thematic: The complimentary and cooperative principles of male and female together do the job where solitary machismo did not. 21
woman!” Just one issue later the roles are reversed, in an interesting indication of Scott and Barda’s balanced partnership: “I’m a soldier, Scott!” says Barda. “I’m trained to die! But you—you’re beautiful inside!”
Pin-ups Of The Gods Tenderness and toughness are seamlessly and sympathetically portrayed in Barda’s characterization, but she and her Lieutenants are truly transitional figures in American pop culture, treading a line between revelation and stereotype. Barda’s plus-size physique defies a sexist society’s dominant prescriptions for female beauty, but in the early issues it’s usually on display in a kind of sport bikini—Kirby broke with convention, yet presented the character in a way evidently pleasing to him, thus diluting his clearly intended effect. Similarly, the Female Furies teeter between diversity and fetish. On the upside, we have a respectful range of images from the hefty Stompa to the outrageous protopunk Mad Harriet to the apparently middle-aged Bernadeth. (Again, Kirby is most refreshingly un-“manly” in his portrayal of older women—the depiction of Apokolips’ orphanage head, “Granny Goodness,” is less an echo of folkloric “hag” imagery than an implicit commentary on the narrow options open to women in a brutal man’s world [the Thatcher formula I noted earlier]—and she’s automatically countered by a grand and formidable woman of comparable age, who briefly aids Barda and Scott’s cause: Tigra, exiled mother of Orion.) On the downside we have Lashina, the mistress of whips, and a plethora of cameo appearances by less detailed (and less attired) Russ Meyer-ish babes of death. The “Lonar” short stories in Forever People featured much male semi-nudity, but added up to only a few pages that were nowhere near as prominent as the Furies’, Barda’s, and Beautiful Dreamer’s exposures. An anecdote brought to my attention by John Morrow underscores the extent of Kirby’s enlightenment, exceptional for a man of his generation though incomplete from a contemporary perspective: On the first Mister Miracle page Mike Royer ever inked, Mike re-drew Barda’s face to make it “prettier”; a dismayed Kirby restored her more substantive countenance in a paste-up, and exhorted Royer never to change anything again. Yet Kirby himself thought nothing of the overall image of Barda exercising in the near-buff. Late in the series, Orion confronts some unwelcome wedding guests, in Mister Miracle #18, the end of the series. Barda roars to an opponent, “I’ll teach you respect for the equal sex!” By the time of The Eternals, Kirby would learn more.
Warrior Princess
These uncommon depictions carried through to Mister Miracle’s mostly female supporting cast. Just as conventional male body-standards for other males were subverted in the well-developed and dignified character of Oberon, Scott’s little-person associate, arbitrary male specifications for female appearance and personality were gripped by the heel and hung upside-down in the person of Scott’s Amazonian Apokolips ally “Big” Barda, and the “Female Furies” she commands. Scott has solidified the partnership between male and female both internally and externally—from her introduction in #4 onward, Barda is equally featured (if not equally billed) with Mister Miracle, a recurring theme being her and her troops springing him from the traps even he can’t escape on his own (including his pivotal flight from Apokolips). Barda’s full participation in world-shaping affairs is never questioned by Scott (though it’s the source of running-gag incredulity from males of Apokolips and Earth). The values guiding Scott are revealed in dialogue from #5: Barda asks his forgiveness for exhibiting momentary fear; “I—a warrior!” “You’re better than that,” Scott replies, “You’re a
Mr. Miracle & Ms. Barda But he had already arrived at a personal answer to the conflicts which seem grand on his pages and insurmountable in our lives. Though both The Eternals and the Fourth World books are considered unfinished masterworks, Eternals is the one which feels less resolved to me. In that series the question of humankind’s worth is as open-ended as that of its fate, but never in the Fourth World is there doubt that Earth should be saved. And I’ve come to believe that the trilogy does in fact conclude. The final issue of Mister Miracle recounts the marriage of Barda and Scott. And so, Kirby’s war of the gods does end, not in pitched battle but in an act of love; a union between children of both worlds, and an immortal alliance of male and female. Perhaps this age can’t afford power of any kind. But here Kirby’s vision and imagination give us the kind of hopeful strength this age can’t do without.♥ (Thanks to John Morrow for his Mister Miracles, and to Charles Hatfield for an alliterative phrase in Paragraph 12, Sentence One.) 22
The Dream World Of Doris Nelson/Wilson Examining an Oddball Kirby Comic, by Scott Shaw! Love Romances #103 (January, 1962), published by Male Publishing Corp. (a.k.a. Marvel) Cover and lead story (7 pages) penciled by Kirby, inked by Paul Reinman or Sol Brodsky.
asks just how Doris came to be in that comic book. Doris’ answer: “There isn’t much to tell, except that a dream isn’t so bad after all— because there is always the chance... that your dream will come true!” The chances are great that Jack plotted as well as penciled the story (as they always say, “Write what you know!”) and that Stan Lee or Larry Leiber wrote the dialogue. Oddball elements aside, “The Dream World of Doris Nelson/Wilson” is an example of solid, if not exceptional, Kirby art of the time period. Actually, I was surprised to learn that Jack was still working in the romance genre at this time, one he and partner Joe Simon originally created over a decade earlier. This is especially surprising, considering Jack was already carrying an increasingly heavy workload due to Marvel’s expanding lineup that relied so much upon his creative spark. The inks (by either Reinman or Brodsky), although cleaner than the embellishment in early issues of Avengers and X-Men, do their job but add nothing special to the art. But in my opinion, its lead story makes Love Romances #103 a classic example of an Oddball Comic. Not only is its inclusion of comic books and cartoonists an unusual one, but the story’s structure and references to the very comic book title in which it appears makes it the storytelling equivalent of an ‘’infinity cover.” Additionally, the story’s lead character’s name weirdly changes twice (!) from the cover to the story’s end. But on top of all that, the characters of Doris and Joe immediately reminded me of nothing more than idealized versions of Roz and Jack Kirby themselves! At first I thought I was reading more into this story than was intended, but when I mentioned this story (and its lead characters’ supposed resemblance to the real Kirbys) at the Kirby Tribute Panel at San Diego’s 1996 Comic-Con International, Roz herself immediately began chuckling and nodding her head in obvious recognition of this obscure, decades-old story. Hey, we always knew that Jack was a romantic type at heart... now we have proof. Best of all, I found this obscure gem, which also features a second Kirby 5-pager, in a box of $2 love comics. Great Kirby stuff is still out there... you just have to know where to look!♥
D
oris Wilson (referred to on the book’s cover as “Doris Nelson”) is a loner who would rather dream about romance than live it. She simply hasn’t met a boy who interested her, but she does have one source of love... romance comic books! (She’s even pictured reading an issue of Love Romances itself!) Yet for all her four-color fantasies, Doris tearfully laments, “Maybe I’ll never meet the right man! Maybe I’ll never fall in love!” Pleading a headache, Doris turns down the offer of a date with “Jazzbo,” a fun-loving boy who’s supposedly “a million laughs.” She counters, “If I just want to laugh, I can always watch Jerry Lewis!” (Obviously, Doris is of French descent!) Trying to ignore her girlfriends’ taunts (“Doris would rather cuddle up with some silly romance stories, than with a real, live boy!”), she seeks out the solace of a nearby park bench, where Doris retreats into the welcoming world of her beloved love comics. There, she immerses herself in another pulpinduced daydream, not noticing the funnybook (wouldn’t you know it, another issue of Love Romances) as it slips from her fingers. Unexpectedly, the publication is retrieved by a handsome young stranger, Joe Marlowe, who just happens to be a comic book artist, one who specializes in drawing romance stories! He points to Doris’ magazine: “In fact, I illustrated that one!” (Talk about coincidences... but you haven’t seen anything yet!) It turns out that Joe also dwells in a dream world; one of his own making as he draws all of those romance stories. “...I prefer my dream world where everything is as perfect as I want it... to the real world where I haven’t yet found the girl for me!” Not surprisingly, Doris understands Joe’s philosophy completely, and this makes Joe glad “because I noticed you the moment I saw you sitting here! You see, I’ve drawn so many pretty girls, that I always study them in real life... searching for the perfect one... like you!” But instead of running for her life like most normal women, Doris responds in kind. “The look in our eyes and the touch of our hands said it all!” Later* (although the caption reads “And so it came to pass...”), Doris’ catty girlfriends are checking out the latest issue of Love Romances (there it is again!) where they’re amazed to discover a story featuring a heroine named “Doris Nelson” — who looks just like their daydreaming friend! (Notice Doris’ bizarre mid-story change of name from “Wilson” to “Nelson”!) As Doris and her new beau, Joe, approach arm-in-arm, the gal-gang
* In fact, it would have to be months later for Joe’s comic story of their romance to be written, drawn, lettered, inked, colored, separated, published, and distributed! Jack Kirby was a fast draw-er, but not that fast!
23
DAVE: When I was about seven, I think. I started honing my skills, because I wanted “to draw Goofy for Mr. Disney.” (laughter) My best tool for cartooning was this little boxed instructional set (it was originally my dad’s), done by Jack Cole. It was produced, I guess, in the late 1930s, made up of several little “how to draw” booklets on cartooning, in a little blue box with an illustrated cover. It was the most delightful trainer for kids on how to cartoon that I’ve ever seen. It was in that classic “squash and stretch” style of the 1930s. I lugged that thing around with me for probably ten years. TJKC: After you discovered Kirby, did you become a bonafide Marvel fan? DAVE: Absolutely. I refused to read DC at all. (laughter) In those days, Stan Lee indoctrinated readers to be very faithful, and DC just wasn’t giving me what I was getting at Marvel, which was all this really overthe-top, melodramatic, teenaged stuff, bubbling with angst. Kids nearing that age love drama and angst—and coupled with secret identities and radioactivity... I was hooked! TJKC: Drawing is obviously a solitary act. When you went through adolescence, did you continue to draw after you discovered girls? DAVE: Well, I was trying to do both. I tried to incorporate drawing into my whole “seduction” routine. (laughter) “I’ll draw you!”, that kind of thing. I carried a sketchbook around with me, did caricatures of girls, did psychedelic designs on their arms and legs; I was shameless. TJKC: Were you actually trying to do sequential comics stories? DAVE: Mostly I was just trying to learn how to draw. I didn’t start attempting continuity until I was about fifteen or sixteen, and that was purely because by that time we’d moved to Portland, and I’d met up with guys like Chris Warner, Randy Emberlin, Dave at the Kirby home in the mid-1970s. and others (some of whom are now working at Dark Horse). We had a clique of maybe a dozen people; some of us wrote, some drew. We’d get together and have these all-night marathons of drawing in a room together, just trying to challenge each other. I was more of a single illustration guy. The sequential stuff kind of bogged me down. Although I loved to tell stories, I found I had a lot of problems when laying it out on a page. We moved back down to southern California in the Spring of ’72. That was the first year I was able to get to the San Diego Con. That was a huge experience; it was also the first time I met Jack; total sensory overload.
A Stevens-inked Big Barda; zoftig!
Dave Stevens Interview Interviewed by Jon B. Cooke (Dave Stevens was born in 1955 in Los Angeles, CA. Through his involvement in southern California comics fandom during the early 1970s, he formed a close relationship with Jack and Roz Kirby. Dave got an early break inking the Tarzan newspaper strip for Russ Manning, and went on to a successful career in animation, working with Doug Wildey. Dave eventually came back to comics, where in the 1980s he created the Rocketeer, which was made into a feature film by Disney, and became known for his “cheesecake” cover art, featuring some of the sexiest women ever to appear in comics. This interview was conducted by phone on May 10, 1998.) THE JACK KIRBY COLLECTOR: What’s the earliest Kirby work you remember reading? DAVE STEVENS: The first Kirby work that I remember seeing was early Tales of Suspense covers, featuring the original Iron Man in the golden armor. The first Marvel that I bought was the two-part story, featuring the Sub-Mariner/Iron Man fight (Tales to Astonish #82-83), and it just knocked me on my butt! (laughter) It was action, drawn like I’d never seen before. I was immediately aware of this totally energetic approach to the dramatics of storytelling. That was the first time I was really aware of an artistic “style.”
TJKC: Did you contribute to fanzines at all? Were you doing any “cheesecake” drawings? DAVE: I submitted to a lot of them, starting in ’69, and it was pretty crude stuff. The first few female figures I attempted were at school, in art class, and they didn’t look like much. The one or two times I’d drawn nudes for some of my greasy little friends, they would immediately trot it right up to the teacher! I got pulled out of class a couple times for that, so I just stopped. (laughter) I couldn’t deal with the humiliation.
TJKC: What got you into comic books? DAVE: I was your typical kid; I loved exotic subject matter: Dinosaurs, spaceships, monster movies, that kind of stuff. I was a huge cartoon nut; I grew up on the Fleischer brothers. (We’re talking from age four to ten). Then Jonny Quest hit the airwaves. I remember that was the show; everybody watched! It definitely whet my appetite for similar-looking reading matter—and super-heroes were just beginning to make a comeback.
TJKC: Were you regularly reading comics all this time? DAVE: Up until about age sixteen, which was around the time Steranko left Marvel. Other than Gil Kane and Joe Kubert, and one or two other people, there really wasn’t a lot of incentive for me to keep buying comics at that point. After about 1971 I really just stopped. TJKC: What about Jack’s Fourth World stuff? DAVE: That was something I hung in with. I loved the Demon; I bought
TJKC: When did you decide to make a living drawing? 24
Jimmy Olsen because it was bringing back the Newsboy Legion, which I loved. I made sure I got every copy of Jack’s new stuff.
it was obvious that Roz was like everyone’s den mother. She kind of treated us all as the neighborhood kids down the street. We became sort of like an extended group of nephews or something. They were very gracious and funny; Roz always liked to embarrass me about putting me together with one of her daughters. (laughter) She’d tease me about that for years.
TJKC: When you met him in San Diego in 1972, he was really at the apex of his career in many ways. DAVE: Yeah, he’d only been out in California for two or three years, and it was a huge deal that he’d come down to the San Diego show. I met him with Scott Shaw!, who had just done this knock-off of an old Kirby monster cover. Scott had drawn this giant phallus on the monster, (laughter) who was basically terrorizing the world with this giant thing! He proudly showed it to Jack! (laughter) Scott was so pleased with it, and he wanted to get Jack’s approval. I remember Jack’s reaction was just priceless; he thought it was funny, but he definitely didn’t want Roz to see it, (laughter) so it was: “Geez, don’t show that to my wife! Hide it!” (laughter) Jack soon dubbed him “the dirtiest man in comics.” You should get Scott to tell you the whole story, because he tells it really well [see sidebar below]. It was a defining moment in comics fandom: The Underground Meets Kirby! (laughter) Scott was part of the FiveString Mob in San Diego; we were all sort of a pesky bunch, nosing around for any kind of an “in” into the industry.
TJKC: Did you go down into the studio? DAVE: Always! It was a big, spacious rec room off of the pool. They were pretty high up on a hill, with a nice big outdoor pool that they made available to all of us, much to their chagrin, I’m sure. (laughter) Some of the guys used it, but I mostly just wanted to talk to him, and listen to stories. TJKC: Do you remember specifically what he was working on? DAVE: Fourth World stuff, but he would always stop work when we got there. There might be something on the board, but generally it was just show-and-tell, talking about the industry, and us wanting to know all the latest; what he was about to do in the next couple of issues. He was always more than happy to tell you about the workings of a Mother Box, (laughter) or what the Boom Tube was; that was generally the way it went. (laughter) I didn’t ask too much of that kind of stuff; I wanted to know about the nuts and bolts—what kind of tools he used, etc. He was always really, really generous with me as a young scribbler. I finally got up the nerve in 1974 to drag up this gigantic, cardboard portfolio filled with loose pieces of art to show him. He opened it up, and the first few things he pulled out were product illustrations: Cars, appliances; samples for the commercial market that I’d done at city
TJKC: Did you establish a relationship with Jack early on? DAVE: Not immediately, because I was just a face among several others that year. The following year, 1973, was the first time I went up to the house with some of the other guys. I was just happy to be along; I initiated a couple of other visits after that, once I was sure it was okay that we come up. I had no idea what the protocol was, whether they would even be happy to see our scruffy faces. But after that first visit,
Sidebar by Scott Shaw!
Dave inked this drawing from a xerox of Jack’s pencils, and used it as a portfolio piece.
I look back in disbelief when I realize what a (purely unintentional) pain-in-the-butt I was to Jack, and how graciously he accepted my usually misjudged attention during the early years of our friendship. Since I was already writing and drawing stories for underground “comix” at the time, I saw nothing wrong in doing a countercultural (read: dirty) parody of one of Jack’s covers for an old pre-hero issue of Strange Tales. It depicted a gigantic ape/bulldog-like alien facing an arena crowd, proclaiming “No Human Can Beat Me!” My version, appropriately entitled Deranged Tales, was faithfully similar, except for the equally gigantic tumescent phallus that adorned the proud-as-punch alien’s crotch, and the added word “off ” that now ended the creature’s statement. However sophomoric this was, it definitely was not created with any malice toward Jack or Marvel. Marvel represented the “establishment,” so to my illformed judgment, the company presented a suitable target for parody, however grotesque my efforts might be. As if all this weren’t bad enough, to make matters worse, San Diego fan publisher Mike Towry decided to print my masturbatory masterpiece as a – Good Lord! (choke!) – poster! I’ll never forget the look on Jack’s face when I tried to present him with his very own copy. “B-but I can’t hang this on my wall... I’ve got a wife and kids!” Jack protested, trying not to hurt my feelings while simultaneously trying not to encourage me any further. “Well, maybe you could hang it up inside a closet,” I helpfully suggested. A few years later, following one of my customary apologies for my past indiscretions, Jack off-handedly acknowledged my somewhat reformed behavior by observing, “Next thing I know, you’ll be singin’ in the boys’ choir!” 25
have hired you as an inker? DAVE: Maybe, eventually; but it never came up, because Mike Royer was more than able to handle everything, and he gave Jack exactly what he wanted. I don’t think it ever occurred to Jack that I was that hungry for it; that I was almost begging, without saying so. Because I didn’t push it. And, then the following year, in ’75, I went to work for Russ Manning. So, I missed my chance. But, I never asked Jack for things; never hit him up for sketches, or work. I just didn’t feel right about it. I figured if he felt I was ready, he’d toss me something.
(right) Beautiful Dreamer by Kirby. (below) Dave’s first San Diego Con program book inks of Jack’s work; we ran this back in TJKC #8, but here’s a full reproduction from the original art.
TJKC: Was it a boost to ink his con drawings? DAVE: It was absolutely, but I don’t think anybody else noticed. I would only initial them “D.S.”; I usually didn’t sign my whole name. I didn’t think it was appropriate, they were just little spot illustrations for the convention. The first couple of large pieces I included in my comics samples were things that I lightboxed from Kirby Unleashed (Newsboy Legion was used as one of your covers). Also, a couple of local collectors who had bought original drawings from Jack asked me if I’d ink them—but I would always lightbox the stuff; I hated to deface the originals. Who was I? I thought it might diminish the value of the pencils. One the pieces was a really gorgeous drawing of Dr. Doom standing over the fallen Silver Surfer, with his castle in the background. It was a really dramatic, beautifully detailed piece, commissioned by the buyer (Mike Price). TJKC: How’d you get your start in Hollywood? DAVE: Initially I did a lot of storyboards, a lot of advertising art. I did a smattering of whatever I could get, and I also did presentation art for films that were being pitched. I had boundless energy, and went wherever the work was. I ended up showing my samples to Doug (Wildey) at Hanna-Barbera in April, 1978. It was purely because I wanted to work with Doug; I didn’t care what the show was. He was one of my heroes. TJKC: Were you still visiting Jack at this time? DAVE: Yeah, but not as frequently, because I was putting in long hours at Hanna-Barbera, and doing freelance on the outside, and storyboards at night. So, when I would see Jack and Roz, it would be in tandem with running out to Wildey’s house, because they were in pretty close proximity of each other. Doug and Jack became friends, and they started socializing. We would occasionally find ourselves as a group, and that was a lot of fun for me.
college. He took a good look, and said, “You should be drawing for Time or Newsweek or the NFL or something!” I was devastated, because at that point, I just wanted to draw funnybooks. “But Jack, I don’t really want to do that stuff!” “But that’s what you’ve done. You’re wasting your talent getting into comic books; this is what you’re good at.” But at that time, I didn’t have the smarts to hear what he was saying. But he followed it up by telling me that if I felt I just had to say something with comic books, then, by all means do it— “but remember that illustration is your strong suit.” And he was right, because right out of high school, I was doing greeting cards, ad art for local businesses, sign-painting, fashion illustrations. Didn’t like it though!
TJKC: How did you get hooked up with Pacific Comics, and the Schanes brothers? DAVE: They had owned a couple of comic book stores in San Diego, in the mid-’70s, while I was still living down there. They knew me as a customer. But it wasn’t until Summer of ’81 that they approached me at the San Diego Con.
TJKC: Was Jack forthcoming with you about the realities of the business? DAVE: Not too much—only when I asked specific things. I think he felt that we each needed to find out on our own, at our own pace and under our own circumstances. TJKC: Did you show progressions of your work to Jack? DAVE: Yeah. In fact, it was in 1974 that he requested the San Diego Con start having me ink his program book drawings. He would always send them in pencil, and somebody obviously was needed to ink them. The first one I did was of the Silver Surfer. TJKC: If the opportunity had presented itself, would Jack 26
They’d just published the first two issues of Captain Victory and the first issue of Starslayer was about to go to press. The second issue was a few pages short, and they asked me if I wanted to come up with some filler material for the back of it, and the following issue as well. So I went home and thought about it and came up with something. TJKC: Where’d you get the idea for The Rocketeer? DAVE: Aviation and the serials. As a kid, I was a huge fan of Buster Crabbe, Captain Marvel, Commando Cody, Spy Smasher, and of course Captain Midnight. It was a rich playground to draw inspiration from. TJKC: Did you want to be the Rocketeer? DAVE: Oh, probably unconsciously, since I was about five. (laughter) I remember making a little cardboard mask and flying around the back yard when I was five. (laughter) TJKC: When did Marvel contact you about the Rocketeer trademark, and initiate their lawsuit for ownership of the name? DAVE: I filed my trademark application in 1983, and they started petitioning me as soon as the trademark was published. It was just an aggravation suit. They started hitting me hard in the latter half of 1984, and I don’t know if it had anything to do with the fact that Archie Goodwin and I were in discussions to bring the Rocketeer to Epic, but once I had seen their standard contract, I backed off immediately. Unfortunately, somebody there had already put it on the schedule prematurely. TJKC: How long did the lawsuit take? DAVE: It dragged on for about three years. It only ultimately went away when Disney got involved in 1987; it took that to get them to back off. They just weren’t going to back down; Shooter could’ve helped, and he didn’t. I talked to Mike Hobson, who was the head honcho at that point, and he took a very hard line with me. Their argument was that it (my Rocketeer) was causing “confusion in Another portfolio piece, from “Toxl, The World Killer”; Dave inked off a pencil xerox. the marketplace” because they claimed that they were actively using the mark, but nobody slapstick: Girls with clowns, midgets, gorillas! (laughter) It was very in comics had any idea that Marvel had ever used that name. It silly stuff and Betty just fit right in with her very broad style. turned out to be an obscure group of villains who had appeared once in an issue of Daredevil in 1980. Marv Wolfman had written the story TJKC: Did you run into any legal problems appropriating her image? and he told me it was just a throwaway group of green space villains. DAVE: Well, I never really felt like I was appropriating anything, They’d never appeared on a cover, and Marvel had no intention of because all I did basically, was to pattern Cliff ’s girlfriend in the series ever using it as a mark on the cover of a book. It was just aggravation after her, and I never named her “Bettie Page,” I just called her “Betty.” suit; they were slapping me around because they could. I never marketed any Bettie Page items; I only did two art prints for Graphitti Designs that I got a small royalty from, but I wasn’t out there TJKC: When did you first get exposed to Bettie Page? hawking Bettie Page merchandise. The few pieces of artwork I did were DAVE: I’m not sure when I first saw an image of her. I just know that never really exploited in the marketplace. the first time I saved one, I was in high school. I consciously saved it, because it was such a gorgeous shot; just her in a bikini standing in water, with this big grin. It was the most glorious thing I’d ever seen.
TJKC: Have you ever met Bettie? DAVE: Yes. In fact, we’ve been good friends for about four years now; I met her right after the earthquake in January of ’94. I had gotten in touch with her brother after the Lifestyles of the Rich and Famous piece aired, in December of 1992. Robin Leach had tracked her down, and she’d done an audio tape interview. I located Jack Page (her brother) in
TJKC: What is it about her image that...? DAVE: Just... effervescence. Joie de vivre. She just emanates sweetness and spontaneity; it’s gleeful, it’s joyous. The early pin-up magazines of the late 1940s were all fairly whimsical in tone. It was burlesque, all 27
Nashville, and said, “I did this stuff a few years back, and I wanted to make sure she’s okay with it. Would you please send this check to her (along with a letter explaining who I was and what I was about)?” Several months later, her lawyer called me, and I met with him and offered to help generate some new, licensed projects for her to make some good money from. It was about a year later, she decided to meet me. TJKC: Was it a nice meeting? DAVE: Yeah, it was great. I was suddenly called upon to be her driver for the day. She had to get to Santa Monica to sign a number of Robert Blue prints. So, afterward, we just tooled around all over LA playing Big Band music and talking about her career. We ended the evening at a pizza parlor. It was an amazing day. I’ll never forget it. TJKC: Would you say you started the Bettie cult, or was it already there? DAVE: I think it was always there, just dormant; a fond remembrance on the part of the guys who had been collecting her photos for twenty years prior. Then, when they learned that there was some kid drawing a Bettie lookalike in this comic book, they started writing me letters, and that was the first clue I had that this was bigger than just me— and very soon after the Rocketeer took off, there was a flurry of “Betty” imitations popping up in other comics; and people were suddenly drawing her on all sorts of products. It was like a runaway train.
Dave inked this Kirby drawing for the SDCC’s “Friend of Fandom” award; again, a better repro than we ran in TJKC #8.
TJKC: When you were working on the Rocketeer film, were you involved on the final creative decisions? DAVE: I was involved in a lot of it from start to finish, and I fought daily to stay involved. There are an awful lot of egos in the mix when there’s that much money at stake, and from
the get-go I was all but barred from the studio. (laughter) I rattled my cup on the gate and I wouldn’t go away. “Guard! Guard!!” I was finally able to turn it around, once they saw that I was there for the benefit of the film, and not for my own ego, they eased up and we all did our best. TJKC: Do you think Jennifer Connelly was the right casting choice? DAVE: I really enjoyed what Jennifer was able to do with it, though she wasn’t originally what I might’ve been looking for. I was after someone with a little more of an edge; a little more fire. But when it became a Disney film, the character changed. We lost an awful lot of character stuff that they felt was too strong for a Disney “family entertainment” vehicle. TJKC: Were you happy with the final product? DAVE: About seventy percent of it. You seldom get even that much. If we had remained a Touchstone release, as we’d originally signed on, then we could’ve hung onto a lot more than we were able to. TJKC: There’s something about your work that obviously can’t be dismissed: You objectify women... DAVE: I glorify them! (laughter) TJKC: ...yet there’s real character to them, there’s real affection. You like women, as opposed to a lot of the “cheesecake” artists out there who don’t like women necessarily. DAVE: What I do, I do out of sheer fascination and love for the subject matter. I have been bedeviled by women since my teens, and I think there’s nothing greater than interaction with a woman. It’s what we’re here for! TJKC: Do you draw from life? DAVE: Always. I start out with an idea sketch, and I’ll pull it back to reality in areas that I think it needs it structurally, by getting somebody in and shooting them in as close to the pose as I can. But most of my poses you can’t really get with a real figure; you have to stretch it some. TJKC: Your creative output in comic books has been slim. (laughter) Is it agonizing to get out work? DAVE: It’s just boring, tedious. I’ve never misled anyone into believing I had intentions of having a long, prolific career in comic books. Ever since my stint with (Russ) Manning, I knew it was not the direction I wanted to go in, because I was not naturally gifted at telling stories quickly and efficiently, unlike the people I idolized.
TJKC subscriber Mark Marderosian published a newsletter called Big Barda Believers in the early 1970s, devoted to “the only true independent female... in all comics.” Alas, it only lasted one issue. 28
TJKC: There’s a very humanistic quality in your work that I think affects a lot of people; it’s usually only in the eyes of the characters. Is it something you picked up along the way from other artists? DAVE: I think it probably came from Steranko; he was the only comics guy I saw rendering the eyes of the soul. When he’d do a close up, he actually gave men eyelashes and pupils. He would also use emotional cut-in shots just of people’s eyes. It sucked me right in. And that’s still what I respond to as a reader; from the bridge of the nose up, I want to convey what that person’s feeling.
any of the “cheesecake” covers you were working on? DAVE: He saw them, but I didn’t push it on him. He got copies of everything I was doing, and he was right behind me during the trouble with Marvel. He’d call me up and ask me, “Do you need anything? Do you need us to give a deposition?” He and Roz were always ready to go to bat, very concerned. They didn’t want to see me give up or go under. With the pin-up stuff, I think Roz was amused by the turn my career seemed to be taking. I’m sure Jack liked the work, but he never would say because Roz was always right there. (laughter) But Jack liked a well-turned ankle. I think more than anything else, Jack was kind of proud whenever any of us snotnoses did something with ourselves later in life. When we were all high schoolers visiting the house, they probably had no idea any of us would take it any further than just a hobby, and I think when Scott Shaw! and myself and John Pound and a few of the other guys actually made a career of it, that kind of tickled him in a lot of ways.
TJKC: Through the ’80s and ’90s, did you see Jack often? DAVE: Not as often as I’d have liked. I got too involved with my own baggage; I’d talk to him on the phone, I’d occasionally go on outings with them and the Wildeys, but mostly saw him at group functions in LA. I remember Jack and Doug and I judged a couple of art contests in Orange County years ago; that always struck me as odd, a full-circle for me, the fan. I kind of regret not asking Jack a lot more important questions that I wanted to know earlier, but I was just too timid about it. As a kid, I never wanted to impose, asking, “Why do you do this?” —things that I’m sure he never intellectualized! He just did it. Now, of course I’m dying to know! (laughter)
TJKC: Are you going to be doing any comics work in the future? DAVE: Naah. (laughter) Only occasional covers, these days. I’ve got too many other projects that are all film-related that I feel my time is better spent on. I was always broke when I was doing comics, it’s just a losing proposition for a guy like me.
TJKC: If you could ask him a question today, what would it be? DAVE: It’s an long list; it’s not any one question, that’s the problem. I doubt I could narrow it down; I suppose his ability to create really powerful, emotional body language, and facial contortions that told you everything about a person in that moment in time. He did that so well, and so economically. It was such beautiful visual shorthand compared to guys like me who render the hell out of it, unnecessarily. He was able to summon it up from his guts, his subconscious, and he always got it with such certainty, and effortlessness. I’ve always wondered, when did that start? How did that ability emerge? It obviously didn’t happen overnight—and yet, it’s there in the earliest Simon & Kirby works.
TJKC: What aspect of your career so far are you most pleased with? DAVE: The first reward for me was when an older gentlemen approached me at a comic convention and wanted to shake my hand for doing the series. That meant something, because he’d lived through that time, and he liked what I’d done. I’ve also gotten to spend time with a few aviation pioneers, serial actors, pin-up queens, and amazingly, gotten to work with some of my boyhood heroes in comics, like Doug and Jack. TJKC: What’s the greatest lesson you learned from Kirby? DAVE: Probably about being gracious to fans; to people who really impose, and don’t go away, and don’t have a clue—and yet Jack would always take the time, and he was never rude to anybody. He treated them all with respect.♥
TJKC: There has been some criticism that Jack didn’t have strong female characters. DAVE: Are you kidding?! (laughter) What’s Granny Goodness? What’s Big Barda? If those aren’t he-man women, yikes! No, he had very strong, solid, and matronly female characters that were at the core of some of his books dramatically. I enjoyed all of the characters he did, particularly Granny Goodness, the Female Furies. My personal favorites were characters like Medusa and Sif—very strong, compelling, yet different from what became Jack’s stock in trade later: Bigger-than-life females, with broad shoulders and barrel chests. He did such an array of different types of women in all shapes, sizes, and demeanors; I don’t see how anybody could say that.
A very Steranko-inspired ink job by Dave, using one of Jack’s Marvelmania drawings.
TJKC: Did you read any of his romance work? DAVE: Oh, sure. But, if any of them have any shortcomings in the writing or characterizations, you have to put that in perspective. How old he was when he was doing those stories? He was probably still pretty young. TJKC: Did you show Jack 29
date but rather a point of reference for the future. The way to understand the future is to comprehend the past, and thus Kirby was satisfied to utilize its “primitive into star-child” motif. This cerebral SF—as opposed to Marvelesque space opera—could explain the lukewarm reaction to 1978’s The Silver Surfer trade paperback. In this, the Surfer is like the HAL-9000, torn between his mission and limited affinity with humans. Galactus was even more complex and awe-inspiring, opposed to the monster of-the-month he was in FF. The Surfer is probably the most romantic of Kirby’s creations. Sheer inspiration put him to paper, and a non-audible chord was struck. Harlan Ellison called him the “eternal paradigm of The Wandering Jew.”2 Stan Lee portrayed him as a Christ figure in Silver Surfer #3 (1968) and John Byrne again had him tempted by Mephisto in a 1982 one-shot. Ironically, Kirby modeled the Surfer on the fallen angel and Galactus as God.3 (A digression: Based on Fantastic Four #48-50, I always considered the Watcher more God-like, trying to shield us from the fear Galactus would bring, yet knowing we must find “The Ultimate Nullifier” on our own.) The trade paperback was full of theological overtones, not familiar symbolism but raw insight about core beliefs. Lee’s dialogue was heavy-handed, but if a picture is worth a thousand words, then Kirby’s narrative art surely invoked thousands upon thousands. Yet at the center of this underappreciated work is, once again, a love story. Galactus creates Ardina to lure the Surfer back into his service. (Anyone who says Kirby couldn’t draw women should see the golden-skin beauty on pgs. 58 and 87.) The Surfer is wary of this mate made for him, but as they argue the fate of humanity, they truly fall in love. But will the Surfer deny his love or forsake humanity? Was it true that he left his first love, Shalla Bal, not just to save their planet but to realize his dream of space travel? Does this silver martyr have a selfish streak? Of course, the best example of his exploration of love was in the classic neo-comedy tale in Fantastic Four #55, where the Thing grew insanely jealous of him and Alicia Masters. How refreshing it was to see superpowered characters fighting—not for the world, but over a woman (like a Popeye cartoon). The absurdity made it all the more realistic! Perhaps we have relegated true character romance into base soap opera clichés. Perhaps romance is corny, yet it is no less an altruism than super-heroics. Perhaps Kirby knew that’s what made the characters real: Not an Achilles’ heel, but a little heart.♥
Romantic Worlds Of Science-Fiction by Bill W. Miller
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n 1947 Jack Kirby co-created the first romance comic (My Date, McFadden Publications).1 It was only natural for him to develop this popular genre after years of creating heroic fiction having futuristic overtones. Great science-fiction, after all, deals with relationships, be it between man and alien or nature and machines. Fantastic Four, for example, is not about cosmic rays but the continued effect they have on four individuals: Two members engaged to be married, the third person a sibling to the fiancée, and the fourth their best friend. Added early in the series was a romantic rivalry with an arch-villain, and later on, the fate of an unborn child. Comics historians usually credit TV soap operas as the inspiration for those sub-plots, but I concur it was simply mining a vein carved out by Kirby a decade before. The FF was not just Challengers Of The Unknown redone as super-heroes, but super-heroes as challengers of unknown romance. If heroic ideals could conquer tyranny, imagine how far the power of love could go in our distant future! Kirby attempted a different kind of science-fiction romance when he adapted the movie 2001: A Space Odyssey (the 1976 treasury edition). The mothering Monoliths initiated a centurieslong courtship, beckoning humankind to them. By 2001 what had passed for enlightenment had merged man with technology in a marriage of convenience to search the stars for what they really longed for (Science calls it looking for answers; I call it searching for love. We feel alone in our universe and reach toward the heavens for their acceptance). Even the HAL-9000 episode contained the classic suspicion/ betrayal/divorce cycle. Poole and Bowman suspected HAL of having a divided loyalty to their mission; HAL computed their concerns as a threat to their continued involvement (not a physical love, of course, but what an artificial intelligence would perceive as an emotional state). HAL could only conclude their acts of “betrayal” as attempted sabotage of the mission which joined them together (wedlock). The final “divorce” came with the computer left as a jilted lover while Man mated both creation and evolution within the Monolith’s infinite womb. As everyone knows, that movie was left open for interpretation, and the above was mine. Kirby wisely kept that aura of mystery in his own version of 2001. Many criticized the monthly issues for having little to do with the actual year, but 2001 was not meant as a calendar
Bibliography 1Comics Scene Vol. 1 #2, 1982, Starlog Publications. 2The Comics Journal #103, November 1985, Fantagraphics. 3The Masters Of Comic Book Art video, ©1987 Ken Viola Productions.
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can get twice as much on a newspage. Therefore a 32-page newspaper contains the equivalent amount of material as a 64-page comic book. Fat City can use the same plates, presses, film, etc. as comic magazines, and since it does, it now becomes possible to economically print in color, depending on ad receipts (see IV) and production costs. The cost of color printing could be absorbed not only by the advertising revenues brought in, but by the fact that binding has been simplified to just 2 folds, different paper stocks eliminated, and costly cover color separations done away with. As there are now 24-page newspapers in black-&-white selling for 35¢, it seems feasible that a color paper could sell for 40-50¢.
Kirby Underground The original, unseen presentation for Uncle Carmine’s Fat City Comix (In the early 1970s, Jack created a female character named Galaxy Green for a proposed “underground”-style tabloid publication for DC Comics called Uncle Carmine’s Fat City Comix. On the next pages are Jack’s two pieces of presentation art for the Galaxy Green strip, inked by Mike Royer— other sample strips were done by Steve Ditko and Royer. Below is the original, unseen presentation that was to help sell the idea to DC. Steve Sherman comments: “I don’t know if Jack ever passed the Uncle Carmine idea along to DC. By the time we had A Mike assembled it, Spirit World and Royer solo In the Days of the Mob had drawing of come out and the idea of doing Big Barda anything other than color comic from the books kind of went by the wayside. 1970s. It’s too bad. I still think that we were Hubbaon to something with the idea of a hubba! nationally-distributed comic newspaper, especially since we had a great lineup of talent. Everyone we went to was willing to work on it—people like Steve Ditko, Steranko, Harlan Ellison. Once we started thinking about what we wanted to put in, the thing almost put itself together. Remember at the time there really wasn’t anything like it; I think maybe the Monster Times and Mediascene were out there. It’s funny to look at it now and think that we were charging the outlandish sum of 50-75¢.”)
II. DISTRIBUTION—In the area of subscription sales, a newspaper can be handled with greater efficiency than a magazine. A paper can be rolled and mailed without too much harm, where a magazine usually becomes damaged and must be mailed flat, thus making for a larger package. A paper is also lighter, ensuring lower postage costs. The newspaper format is a definite plus in newsstand sales also. Its large size makes it almost essential that retailers display it in a prominent place, usually flat for full-cover display. Newspapers are carried practically everywhere, unlike comic books which are at best either haphazardly stacked in a corner, or worse yet, not even opened. Many retail outlets don’t even carry comics, and magazines, unless they are well-known and high priced, are given poor treatment. Fat City is ideal for sales in airline terminals, college book stores, and record shops. The market has already been opened by the rock papers, sports papers and other specialty tabloids. III. READERSHIP—Although Fat City would be aimed at the 13-25 year age group, its appeal is unlimited. Mainly due to the influence of the rock and underground papers (such as Rolling Stone and others) young people are drawn to this format. A newspaper is immediate and now. Because of its wide distribution potential, Fat City would not only draw on the comics reading audience, but on those who ordinarily don’t buy comics. All age groups accept the “Sunday comics” look, even those who reject the comic books as kiddie fare. Its moderate price, coupled with color give Fat City an added impact over any item in its field. It is a new and unique item, something which people are looking for.
Uncle Carmine’s Fat City Comix
IV. ADVERTISING—It becomes possible through Fat City to draw new advertisers into the comics market. The strong youth appeal would be an attraction to record companies, clothing manufacturers, the food industry, soft drink makers, car companies, etc. The wide distribution and audience potential allows for ad space to be sold at a premium, while at the same time allowing the use of color on all ads through low printing costs. Fat City could offer advertisers maximum market impact at a lower cost than magazine space.
Prepared by Steve Sherman & Mark Evanier
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n approaching this matter our main objectives have been A) How to best present the material to the audience in an appealing and unique manner and B) How to keep the publishing costs low enough to justify the publication, without sacrificing quality. Our eventual conclusion is that there is a great potential in the publishing of a humor newspaper in color. Not only is there a vast readership, but through the use of National’s facilities it is economically possible. Fat City would be an 11" x 14", 32-48 page newspaper done in the style of the underground comix. Style in this case is used in terms of drawing techniques rather than content material. Breaking everything down into five elements: COST, DISTRIBUTION, READERSHIP, ADVERTISING, and PUBLICITY, we find the following advantages, as compared to regular comic books and magazines.
V. PUBLICITY & MERCHANDISING—As America’s first nationallydistributed color comic newspaper, Fat City is prime publicity material. House ads for other DC comic titles would draw new readership to the stands. The paper can be utilized as a sales piece for DC, not only in the promotion of its comic books, but in the field of merchandising, such as T-shirts, posters, special publications, etc. Thus far our concern has been with context rather than content. If the idea of a humor newspaper is accepted, the actual make-up of the paper can then be worked on. It is our feeling though, that in order for Fat City to be a success it should be totally different in approach in relation to Mad or the National Lampoon. The stories or incidents should revolve around a cast of characters who would become familiar to the readership. By creating characters with personalities, the merchandising aspect becomes that much greater. The newspaper format promises to be the media of greatest potential, economically as well as saleswise. The market is primed and ready, the format is acceptable to retailers, and the use of existing facilities in printing make Fat City a valid investment.♥
I. COST—Compared to the cost of printing a color comic or a black&-white magazine, it is much cheaper to print a newspaper. Eliminated are the costs of binding and glossy paper stocks, as well as cover color separations. The one drawback to a newspaper is that the National plant in Illinois is set up to print color comics. However, FAT CITY would utilize the existing facilities due to the fact that it is slightly smaller than the “standard” tabloid size. DC comics are printed on “flats” 211⁄2" x 28" with 8 pages to each side, or 16 pages to a flat. 3 folds are then made to make a signature of 16 pages. If, instead only 2 folds are made (one at the width and one at the length) we have an 11" x 14" page size with 8 pages to a “flat.” And yet, using the same size panels as conventional comics, we 31
Kirby’s Romance Women—Tough Enough? determination. The women of the S&K romance comics would have to face different conflicts than the relatively straightforward threats of the Hollywood Hunchback, Black Michael, or Agent Axis. No, the Kirby romance heroine moved through a (here and below) “Mama’s Boy” rough-hewn, stylized milieu of post-War American society, coping with a specific level of real-world drama—and doing it with strength and style.
by Richard Howell
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ack Kirby is quite deservedly regarded as comics’ “Action King”— master of visual dazzle, raw, kinetic energy, and the most effective illusionist of motion on the static, printed page. How, then, to reconcile this two-fisted action impresario with the measured, sedate charms of the romance comics genre—commonly perceived by comics readers by its restrictions—no action, no violence, no stylized exaggeration?? The answer to this, going in, is that Kirby’s approach to romance comics—a genre he co-created with Joe Simon in 1947—is in no way a degradation of the commitment and stylistic expertise that he brought to any other comics genre. His command of storytelling and panel composition in his romance comics work is—at its best—as good as it is in any single example of his work from Captain America, Boys’ Ranch, New Gods—even Fantastic Four. Better still, Kirby’s instinctive grasp of iconography—the ability that enabled him to create or co-create the ultimate patriotic hero, the most successful “monster” hero, the ultimate super-hero “family,” and several versions of the ultimate fusion of super-heroes and pantheic gods— “Different” also allowed Kirby to envision the romantic heroine as a symbol of individual female empowerment, and render her as such. Simply put, Jack Kirby approached translating emotional power to the comics page in the same way he performed similar magic with other types of power: With insight, sensitivity, graphic inventiveness, and raw, kinetic energy. In 1947, Joe Simon and Jack Kirby introduced the world to romance stories told in comics form, with their ground-breaking Young Romance #1 (Sept./Oct. 1947). The first issue, cover-billed as “For the more Adult readers of comics,” was a huge hit, and soon it was joined by two companion titles (Young Love and Young Brides). The comics publishing industry took note of these series’ success, and soon released a raft of derivative romance titles, none of which duplicated the excellence of either the sales or artistic level of the Simon & Kirby material. In story after story during the runs of the S&K romance output, the lead character’s quest for happiness and fulfillment involved an agenda of self-awareness and responsibility in the face of social change, respect between equals, and personal independence as a necessary facet of romantic completeness. To spearhead these narratives, Kirby developed a new, more focused version of his “super-heroine” archetype; retained were the strong features and jaw, the solid shoulders, the athleticism, and the casual grace showcased in previous examples of Kirbyesque femininity, like Betty Ross (in Captain America), and Sandra Sylvan (from Stuntman). Added to their already-admirable selection of personal recommendations was a higher quotient of intelligence, purposefulness, and clear-headed
Ruth Monroe, the heroine of “Fallen Idol” (Young Love #40) is a young wife who not only has to cope with the realization that her husband—a college basketball star—has been taking bribes to throw games, but has to impress upon him that the respect and hero-worship he enjoys from the neighborhood kids is nothing if he hasn’t earned it honestly. (Ralph: “I’m a ray of hope to those boys! I’m the guy who came out of the slums to make the headlines... what I can be—they can be! Every kid on this stinking street!” Ruth: “Well, I’m not from this neighborhood! I only know what I was taught! Right from wrong!”) Kirby’s depiction of Ruth is as a slight woman, tiny next to her athlete husband—but through her moral uprightness, she grows more substantial and forceful as the story progresses. Irma Williams, in “Different” (Young Romance #30), is a cute, button-nosed brunette who has to face down a different type of moral rot: Prejudice. When the Williams’ original family name—Wilheim— is revealed by Irma’s visiting grandfather, the town’s bigotry rears its very ugly head. Not only does Irma’s upper-crust boyfriend pull away from her, but the town’s avoidance of the “foreigners” threatens to cause her father’s business to fail. Julie Decker, the heroine of “Mama’s Boy” (YR #10) is a study in strength and confidence. Kirby’s delineation of her growing resignation in the fact of her medical student/fiance Orin’s constant capitulation to his mother’s whims and strictures is highly affecting, as is Julie’s explosion of resentment (“I suggest you wait until mother finds a suitable milk-sop for you who’ll knuckle under to Mama! I’m not the type!”) Later, Orin’s mettle is tested during a suspenseful roadside emergency operation—with his younger brother’s life at stake—while Julie assists by holding the flashlight on the grisly doings. The famous S&K woodcut-like inking is thrillingly effective here. Betty Marlowe, the lead character in “All Work and No Love”
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(Young Love #21), begins as an impish flirt. Her gamine grin and the sparkle in her eyes mark her as a woman who finds excitement and fun times too difficult to resist. When her fiance Jack dedicates himself to night school to ensure a comfortable foundation for their married life, Betty succumbs to the lupine charms of Jack’s roommate Howard, throwing away her engagement in the process. After her and Jack’s breakup, the two run into each other again at the lunch counter where they first met. (Jack: “It’s murder to be a human being, Betty! We can do everything but stop loving!” Betty: “I only know what it means to lose love! In that, I’ve realized my weakness—and found my strength...”) Without changing anything about Betty’s face structure, Kirby expertly depicts her passage into the maturity she earns through loss. Meg O’Brien, from “Gang Sweetheart” (Young Romance #23) is a truly superb embodiment of Kirby womanhood; Young, blonde, beautiful, slender, expressive, and selfpossessed. Kirby shows her sadness, her fire, and her sweetness with an economy of line and gesture, and a deep understanding of human emotions. The descent of Meg and her boyfriend Jimmy into the morass of gang life is reflected in the increasing “Gang Sweetheart” harshness in the faces and the slump of their shoulders. Ginny Crain, of “Love or Pity” (Young Romance #8) begins her story as a bright-eyed, fullcheeked Claudette Colbert lookalike. The light, airy tone of the story’s beginning is mirrored in Ginny’s pure joyousness and fey mannerisms. As the story progresses, Ginny’s brother Perry is arrested for suspicion in a government swindle and the town’s judgment and disapproval weighs hard on them. Ginny’s gestures seem more informed by the seriousness of the situation and she gains in stature and maturity as the circumstances worsen for the Crains. In an unusually powerful scene, Ginny returns home to find her mother crying, and her father informs her that he’s been asked to resign from his post as a professor at the local college. Ginny calls her father’s persecutors “jackals” and her father describes the town’s malaise: “It’s been touched by scandal—a social virus—a malignance that must run its course... strangely enough it shall be we who will remain untouched when it’s over—and those who flee from us in panic shall stand pitifully in their shame as the real victims!” Ginny runs into the garden, overcome with emotion, and collapses sobbing on a bench. Kirby’s depiction of Ginny’s despair is amazingly forceful and sensitive. As the story reaches its conclusion, Ginny comes to terms with her family’s place in the town, and makes her
peace with it, but the fairy-tale grins of the girl in the opening pages are gone, replaced by the experienced visage of a more mature, worldly woman. Being tested through adversity is a common theme in the S&K romance comics, and many a Kirby woman gains (here and below) “Back-Door Love” in depth and gravity in the story’s course. The heroines of “Back-Door Love” (Young Romance #15), “Just No Good” (Young Romance #18), and “I Was a Pick-Up” (Young Romance #1) pass from indecisive girlhood into their full womanly strength in fourteen pages (or less) and Kirby’s approach to depicting them brings their full range of emotions into sharp focus, as well as making them sensitive, strong, lovely women. As if any human being could remain unedified in the face of Dot’s mother’s speech (in “Back-Door Love”) which includes: “The loss of love wounds only the heart... but this sort of thing consumes all the values that strengthen us mentally and spiritually.” Dot gains in self-awareness, self-possession, self-respect, and finally embarks on a real love relationship with a man who values her and her finer qualities. Stormy, the smoky jazz vocalist who’s the focal character in “Just No Good,” begins as a brassy broad with a heart that only beats to the rhythm of her band’s current numbers, but she surrenders her vulnerability—and her heart—to Buddy Vance, the band’s clarinet player, and her stylized emotional stance gives way to a full-souled fortissimo. Another tough chick with a chip on her shoulder has her life’s most crucial juncture depicted in “One Way to Hold Him” (Young Romance #31). Lee Jarvis is the roughest of Kirby tough women and sneers and swaggers her way through her recruitment to be the rollerderby queen until she falls in love with her boss/impresario “Whizzer” Wilson and their inevitable face-off on the roller rink serves as the
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climactic event in their rough-and-tumble courtship. Intensely sizzling, sexually intense women also had a presence in the Kirby romance repertoire, most notably the langorous Lola from “The Girl Who Tempted Me” (Young Romance #17). The masterful narrative—a modern-day “Jude the Obscure”—is not only a depiction of a serious conflict between asceticism and sensuality, but is also an action-packed, steamy rip-snorter of a romance classic, and anyone who’s ever been benighted enough to doubt Kirby’s ability to draw sexy women should be compelled to examine this story before their inevitable capitulation. Lola was eventually established as a woman of character, however. In “Fraulein Sweetheart” (Young Romance #4), beautiful Annaliese’s romance with (here and below) “The Girl Who Tempted Me” her handsome American soldier is derailed by her refusal to let go of her sense of loyalty to Hitler and his preeminence to her countrymen. The series of panels in which Annaliese’s soft features become contorted with fierce pride in the lost Nazi cause are unexpectedly chilling. The common defining qualities in each of these superlative works of comics art are their translation of emotional power into graphic energy and the sensitivity to translating the story’s needs with the utmost in style. The S&K romance comics experiment, spearheaded by the powerful penciling of Jack Kirby, turned romance comics into an experience that was, in turn, thrilling, exhilarating, masterful, and deeply touching—and as entertaining as any other comics anywhere, any time. Each of these narratives is a superb piece of comics craftsmanship, aided immeasurably by Kirby’s depictions of the stories’ heroines. For this genre, his new archetype was entirely appropriate, with enough intelligence and glamour to satisfy the huge female readership of Young Romance and Young Love, plus ample pulchritude to engage the males’ attention (and keep it). Kirby’s technique—as always—was satisfying on so many levels as to deserve the huge success that the S&K romance comics enjoyed. It is possible to assert that these heroines—Kirby’s “tough” women— were the crucial component that assured the immense success and long life of the romance comics genre. It is impossible, though, to deny the achievement that they represent. Romance comics might have debuted—perhaps thrived—without Jack Kirby, but to think that anyone could have done them so well... well, that’s just too tough to imagine.♥
An Exercise In Realism Kirby’s Romance Comics, by Pierre Comtois and Gregorio Montejo
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ut of the possibly millions of words written about Jack Kirby it is probably safe to say that very few of them have addressed his contributions to the genre of the romance comic. The question then arises: Why not? The simple answer is that Kirby’s romance comics are not as accessible as his efforts in other, more action-oriented genres such as science-fiction, western or super-hero comics. The more complicated answer is that romance comics are too close to real life. After all, how realistic is it that a reader would encounter savage Indians, bug-eyed monsters or costumed supermen in their day to day lives? Uncluttered by such unrealistic distractions, romance comics are free to explore the more quiet drama of real life—the incidents, heartbreaks, and human conflicts that are actually encountered in the lives of their readers. Thus romance comics have had the perfect camouflage: Made up of the familiar details of daily life, they have not stood out. Instead, they have receded in the minds of readers as their more colorful competitors on the magazine racks have loomed ever larger in their more exaggerated presentations. This talk of realism in romance comics may surprise some readers, but it is our contention that it is they that are the true “mature” comics in the field. For years romance comics have been disparaged as melodramatic and contrived, dismissed as fodder for the simple-minded. But what has been accepted in their stead as worthy of consideration? Horror comics that revel in bodily dismemberment and murder and costumed characters that can leap a building in a single bound; even funny animals have come in for more serious treatment. Today, the label of “mature” has been attached to comics of an even more dubious nature involving pornographic animals, sexual caricatures of familiar comics characters and hellish drawings seemingly eked from the fevered brains of mental ward escapees. For many of these comics, the freedom to create has meant a license to offend or explore the dark byways of licentious sex. Far from being considered “mature,” the world outside the comics industry, when it deigns to notice them, often cannot understand the creators of these works. Some courts have even ordered them into psychiatric treatment. So just how “mature” can these modern works be that cannot be accepted by normal people without serious question of their creators’ mental condition? Against this backdrop, the version of reality dealt with in the now defunct genre of the romance comic seems a great deal more rational than the “mature” stories told in the hothouse atmosphere of the post 1960s sexual revolution. Without the distraction of physical sex (there was sex of course, but of a more implied variety), romance comics (and here we are referring primarily to those comics produced in the 1950s as opposed to their more watered-down cousins of the ’60s and ’70s when they had been reduced to a series of repetitive clichés), were free to explore a wider range of personal relationships. Relations between the protagonists and fathers, mothers, brothers, sisters, cousins, friends, and fellow workers all opened up a wider range of story possibilities and frequently were found in combinations that allowed for much more interesting stories. And of course, high on this list of comics were those produced by Joe Simon and Jack Kirby. It has been said that Simon & Kirby invented the romance comic. In a literal sense, this may be true. After all, there were no romance comics before the duo created Young Romance in 1947. However, stories of romance in the style Simon & Kirby would tell them already existed in the form of pulp magazines. The first such, published in 1920 was Love Story which eventually reached a circulation of half a million. Its success was soon followed by Real Love, All Story Love, Thrilling Love and many more. Not only was part of Kirby’s earliest employment as
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an artist for the pulp magazines, but Kirby himself read them voraciously the other. Eventually, true love brings them back together and Jane as a young man; thus in all probability, the duo were well-acquainted harnesses Dock’s talent, turning him into a successful novelist. The with the genre before they ever decided to produce it in a comics format. strength in this story is twofold: Told more simply with only two But whatever the genesis of the idea, the method of the application of main characters, it concentrates on the tug of wills between Jane and the genre to the demands of the sequential art form was surely invented Dock while Kirby’s detailed art keeps the story down to Earth in the by Simon & Kirby. dirty, grimy, smelly reality of the working man’s world. Although Young Romance was produced well before the institution The above examples are only a few of the scores of romance stories of the Comics Code and its material written in the general good taste produced by Simon & Kirby in the ’40s and ’50s that at the same time regarding sexual content prevalent in the 1940s, the stories in the represent the creative high point of the genre. Beyond them, the genre book still seem to crackle with sexuality mostly as a result of Kirby’s tended to be reduced to clichéd stories told with a good deal less comlush pencils and the almost sensuous inks. Densely plotted, each plexity. Whether the genre will ever retrieve its former sophistication story (told usually in about 15 pages) was a marvel of concise editing and acceptance cannot be said, but judging by the effort poured into where limits on word count seemed non-existent. his own contributions, it can be fairly said that Kirby himself felt A perfect example of all these points can be found in “Love or Pity?” the genre to be as legitimate as any other, perhaps even more so; and (mentioned in Richard Howell’s article on the previous page). In this after being sampled by readers, hopefully others will come to the same story, romance is not necessarily the focus of the plot. Simon & Kirby conclusion.♥ busy themselves with a morality play involving the fragility of the bonds between human beings, including a test of romantic love, filial loyalty, and faith in common sense. Entangled together is Ginny’s love for her fiance, brother, father, friends, and even the numerous residents of the town whom she encounters through the course of the story. Here we see the perfect example of the meaning of “mature” comics. Nowhere in Kirby’s work in other genres (many of which appear shallow and even silly by comparison) are such subjects treated with such depth or complexity. “Mama’s Boy” (also described in Howell’s article), which should have been a simple story of jealousy between a young woman and an older one, becomes a rich tapestry in 13 pages populated by fullyrounded characterizations brought to life by some of Kirby’s most expressive art. In particular, page 12 is a standout with its confident use of heavy black ink lines. Here, all the impact of the characters’ conflicting emotions are caught in the moment of their greatest trial in faces seemingly hacked out of the page by Kirby’s savage use of light and shadow—one of the artist’s greatest achievements in contextual and emotional power. Similarly, Young Romance #12 presents aspiring writer Jane Dickens who resents her apparently untutored boyfriend Dock Larson’s macho posturing. She yearns more for the finer things in life, including the more refined achievements of the intellect. But one day after reading her material, Dock criticizes it for being too phony. To calm him down, Jane agrees to write as he dictates the kind of story he feels is more realistic. “His words were the color of dirt and blood... words that glistened like beads of sweat on a naked back... that rang with lusty laughter and shook the soul with agonized cries! I was shocked by the profanity, the violent currents of emotion... it was a terrible, wonderful experience!” Of course, the story sells but Dock refuses to enter the writing game. The two part ways, Unpublished page from the aborted 1970 b&w True Life Divorce; perhaps the concept was too realistic for DC. each unwilling to yield to the wishes of 39
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Jack Kirby & Don Rico Discuss WWII, The Mafia, Watergate, & Comic Art
in the industry. In other words, you had to make sure you got paid because these guys were only too willing—.
(Our thanks to Barry Alfonso for allowing us to reprint this 1975 interview from his fanzine Mysticogryfil)
RICO: $7.50 was a high rate. One time Joe said to me, “You want someone to do your lettering? It’ll cost ya 50¢ a page!” Let’s say a word, Jack, about the most underestimated group in the whole industry: The letterers.
RICO: And remember the rates, Jack? KIRBY: Oh yeah. 5 bucks a page.
MYSTICOGRYFIL: I’d like to ask you two what it was like working back in the early days of comics. I’ve gotten the impression that in the studios back then, it worked like an assembly line, where an artist would be assigned a pre-written script and would draw it and then pass it on to several inkers, and so forth.
KIRBY: I can’t say enough about them. The comic letterers were matchless. Howard Ferguson was great. The layout, the kind of ads they did, they were just magnificent. You say, “Young people don’t look at these things,” but they do.
RICO: It was exactly like a movie studio set-up. The work was divided; there were script writers, there were some artists who were better or faster at penciling. There were inkers who were able to pick up a style, leaving the original penciler free to do more penciling, because he could work faster. The inkers were slower. Therefore one penciler like Jack could keep two or three inkers busy at a time. So it worked like a movie studio, except for a few artists who did everything from scratch, the way Jack is doing now. In those days you had your independence. If you worked for a house like Timely, then naturally Jack couldn’t spend his time inking—it would be a waste of time for him.
M: Why did you never put a finish to the New Gods/Forever People thing? Did you purposely leave it open-ended? KIRBY: No... it just happened that way. It had to end at that point, there was nothing I could do about it. For the New Gods it was unfortunate, but I had no time to make a finale for it. When I do write the finale for the New Gods, it’ll be something spectacular.
M: How many pages did you turn out a day then? KIRBY: Well, listen—looking back on that I’m gonna get tired! There was a time when I was really energetic. There was a time when I once turned out six a day. M: I’ve heard you talk about the “pressure cooker.” What is it like to work under a tight deadline? Is it something that helps you to work better? KIRBY: Of course. If you have to deliver at a certain time, you’re going to deliver that thing. At one stage or another you say, “I don’t give a damn how this comes out. I’m going to get it done.” And for some strange reason, you eliminate all the scratching around. I think Don will verify that. RICO: All the afterthoughts vanish. M: Jack, do you remember the first time you worked with Stan Lee? KIRBY: No, I don’t remember. RICO: Jack’s early days were with Victor Fox. Jack and Joe (Simon) were in charge of all their own books. KIRBY: (to Rico) Remember when Fox used to walk up and down the aisle looking at the artists and he’d chomp on his cigar and he’d say “I’m king of the comics!”? RICO: Yeah... Fox found out I was also a painter. So he commissioned me to do a mural for his home and he kept me prisoner in his house. KIRBY: Al Harvey was in charge of the keys. RICO: The thing about Fox was that we were freelancing for him. I don’t know what Jack and Joe did, ’cause they were in the office at the time, and I freelanced from the outside; but on Friday night, I would plant myself in the outer office and would not leave until I got my check. Fox would come out and say, “Are you still here?” I’d say, “Yep, I’m still here”—and he’d go back inside again. KIRBY: Don was wise because that was very prevalent
Unpublished page from In The Days Of The Mob #2. 51
M: It would be the battle between Orion and Darkseid? KIRBY: Yes, it’ll be the battle; and the battle itself will be a big surprise, I assure you. M: Was the series ended for financial reasons as they’ve said? KIRBY: No. No financial reasons involved. I can’t make a statement unless I make it in concert with those who make policy. M: Was there any kind of message you were trying to get through in the New Gods? KIRBY: There’s no overminding message. I’m just trying to see the times in my own way. I was just seeing the ’60s— when the New Gods was in progress—in parable. It was a feeling of the times. M: What I got out of the Life/Anti-Life thing was that the New Gods were like individualist sort of characters, and the Apokolips people
were the regimented society. The character I got a lot out of was Glorious Godfrey. I thought he was tremendous. KIRBY: Glorious Godfrey is tremendous; Glorious Godfrey is the only entertainment we have today. M: He was into the evangelist type of thing. KIRBY: Right—and I feel that kind of thing says: “Think my way and you’ll be happy.” To me, that’s Anti-Life. In other words, if you can’t do your thinking, you’re not alive. M: The names you used in the New Gods trilogy, the corny names like Scott Free, were those an attempt to get back to the Golden Age names? KIRBY: No, those were an attempt to symbolize. M: Did you just stumble on these names or did you plan them out? KIRBY: Oh, I planned them. M: Like Orion had a purpose, and... KIRBY: Orion is a hunter—a hunter and a killer; and he’s trapped in an environment he never even made. He was brought up on New Genesis. Can you imagine a son of Lucifer being brought up in paradise? With the urge to be a devil and he can’t? Can you imagine a guy with that kind of frustration, a guy who’s his own monster? And he can’t go against his environment, and yet here inside himself is something even more basic and primitive and he can’t exercise it. Oh, he exercises it. He justifies it. In other words, he’ll exercise it in consistency with his own background. I think that too is part of life. I think that’s instinctive in the cop as well as the crook. In time, we become our own monster. There will be things you’ll be terribly ashamed of, and yet you’ve done it. And it’s on you like a scab. Orion was so ashamed of it that he had to use a Mother Box to build him a good face, so he could walk around New Genesis without any stares. If Orion was back on Apokolips, he’d be happy. M: How did you get over having to be a tough guy? KIRBY: You suffer a little, you get humiliated a little. You see people die—and I’ve seen plenty of other people die. And in seeing them die, you see yourself die. I wound up saying services for some guys I wouldn’t have spit at. RICO: Also, death is a common denominator. KIRBY: It’s a strange experience. Just seeing it and participating in it is very, very strange. Some of it is even good. There have been times when I felt just great—it was almost like having sex. And you feel about ten feet tall if you can live through it. RICO: Jack, I didn’t know you were a necrophiliac. KIRBY: It wasn’t with dead people involved, believe me. M: Jack, Steranko and Barry Smith have been doing really detailed work, but they can’t do anything steady because they can’t handle the work load. Is there any future in, say, one comic, four issues a year, of just fine art? Would it be able to support the artist?
Jack did finally bring New Gods to a conclusion (of sorts) in the large, prestige format he envisioned. Here are pencils from the story in the 1984 New Gods book that lead into his Hunger Dogs novel. 52
KIRBY: One man doing four comics a year so he can put some quality in his work? Sure, it can get to that point, if comics refine their format, sell better. If a guy could do a comic that would sell for five dollars like a legitimate novelist has a book that sells
Mayday Shannon (from Sky Masters of the Space Force) was a tough Kirby woman who remained feminine in even the stickiest situations. for $5.95, I think that could be the future, in which a good man could sit down and take six months to do a comic strip; you’d get the best damn comic strip you ever saw.
sion is not too prevalent, but in our country people can see a 90-minute thing on TV but they’re not going to take the patience to read a book. RICO: They read comics.
M: Would that be like the European comics?
M: I believe that they will, but this is what the publisher is going to tell you. It’s not going to be an easy thing to get.
KIRBY: No, not necessarily. I’d like to see Blondie done in a more restrained manner. I’d like to see it done where the artist can really sit down and think and write a Blondie novel, in which he makes a point, instead of a gag a day.
RICO: Publishers will always tell you the wrong thing. The artist is always ahead of his time; he’s got to be. I went to Martin Goodman one time, and I said, “Look, we’re doing a whole lot of Westerns; how about instead of imagining things, let’s use the real West.” He was excited as hell; he said, “What do you have in mind, what kind of a hero?” I said, “How about a guy like Wyatt Earp?” He said, “Who? Who’d ever go for a guy with a name like Wyatt Earp?” Six years later he apologized to me.
RICO: I’m taking a play that I’ve written and I’m breaking it down into comic book form; a comic magazine but in novel form. It will be a novel in pictures. KIRBY: I think that’s the direction that comic books are going. When I do the last battle of The New Gods, that’s what it will be.
M: Why is there no provision for giving the artist some payment for re-use? It’s the only business I can think of where it’s not done.
RICO: In this format it must be completely written, penciled, and inked by the original person. The whole thing must be his.
KIRBY: I say that it’s medieval in that respect, because it’s highly specialized, and very limited.
M: Do you think that’s the best way to produce a comic book?
M: You literally sell away what you’ve done.
KIRBY: I think it’s the best way to get the most out of a subject, to get a comic in depth. A comic has a very limited format; you’re restricted either to a gag or an extremely collapsed story. You’re working in a restricted format—I’m working on frozen movies, really. I’m competing with the camera. I often have to take longer to get my point across so I have to stretch out my story over a period of months, whereas you can see a movie in one night.
KIRBY: You have no choice. RICO: Did you know we tried to start a cartoonists’ comic book union? M: Why isn’t there one now? KIRBY: Well, it’s gotten to the stage where there’s a minimal scale wage, which isn’t bad. And, slowly but surely, they are now beginning to give you your originals back.
M: What you are saying about these big books, $5.95 or whatever—I can see that happening. I remember when people were complaining about comics going up to 20¢ and I said, “My God, you’re crazy! Look at all the skill that goes into every page of this book. 20¢ for this?” I said that they should print them large, like Life Magazine-size, and charge a buck for them. And that came to pass. The guy at the magazine distributors said he can’t stock that giant $1.50 Conan. He said he sold 300 copies of that last week. So the public is going to buy it if you have a good product.
M: Maybe it has to do with Stan Lee and Carmine Infantino being artists before hand. Maybe they understand... RICO: Stan Lee was never an artist. Stan Lee, to my knowledge, was not even a writer when he began. He was a kind of editor and then discovered if you put some words together, you got a story out of it, you found a formula. It’s still working for him. It worked for him in the old days, and it’s working for him now. Carmine was an artist. He knows that end of the business, no question about that.
RICO: We all talk about the future of comics. The future of comics is in work which the artist loves doing. I think it goes beyond the comic book, even beyond the oversized comic magazine. I think it goes to the shape and form of a novel, with the same kind of price, so the artist works the same way as I do when I work a novel. I submit an idea to a publisher, he gives me an advance against royalties, then the rest is royalties. So the book pays. What I’m talking about is selling comics on the same basis you sell novels. You don’t go to a comic book publisher to put out a comic book novel. You go to a regular novel publisher, and you get paid on the basis of royalties. If the book makes it, you make a fortune from it.
SHERMAN: But Don, wouldn’t you say that the people who are selling comics today are the ones who were selling them 30 years ago, whereas in motion pictures producers go out and they’ll take a survey. But in comic books, their audience has shrunk but they’re still trying to sell them to that same group. M: What do you think the public wants in comics? KIRBY: They want good reading. M: Do you think they want something substantially different from what they wanted thirty years ago?
M: A publisher will tell you those books will go over in areas where televi-
SHERMAN: Sure. They want something that relates to their life today. 53
RICO: The Golden Age was the Golden Age, that was it. That was back then, it was forgotten about. I don’t draw the way I used to draw; neither does Jack. We’ve evolved.
something; I don’t know what it is. Some genius is going to walk in with it; I don’t know what it’s going to be. The only thing I can say is that a professional like me—and I consider myself a professional—will keep it entertaining enough to keep the books going. But some little guy, somebody’s going to walk in like Joe Shuster and Jerry Siegel, and they weren’t more than messengers in Akron, Ohio. They got this idea of a Superman, and that’s what got all the super-heroes started.
KIRBY: The Golden Age was simple stories with a basic theme and you got right to the point and that was it. Some of the stories were five pages, and it was limited as all hell. M: You were speaking of formats a while ago. Do you like the format of Gil Kane’s Blackmark?
M: Some people don’t like the way DC is handling you and... KIRBY: DC is looking. It’s not only my books that go by the way; it’s others, too.
KIRBY: That was a mistake, and I’ll tell you why: He made it paperback size. You can’t restrict comics down to that size. It could be the best story in the world, but I’d never do a paperback.
M: How much does DC tell you what to do with your books? How much freedom do you have?
M: As an insider to the industry, how do you feel comics are doing in the ’70s? Do you think there’s another renaissance going on like there was in the ’60s?
KIRBY: All they want to. I mean I’m subject to their policy as anybody else. M: Do they tell you editorially what they would like to do with your strips?
KIRBY: No, not a renaissance, but a waiting period. It’s waiting for
Jack’s pencils from Mob #2, which Richard Howell inked for this issue’s back cover.
KIRBY: No, I have complete control of that. M: Why have your heroes grown so in terms of muscles from Captain America, who could almost be termed light; I mean certainly he moved lightly, and all of your heroes do, but they’re getting really muscular. Kamandi started out more slender. As he’s been developing and having to perform kind of impossible feats... KIRBY: It’s kind of an instinctive way of drawing. In other words, you draw muscles so long that you draw muscles on anything. You know, I’ll do it on girls, too, and turtles if I have to. Part of it’s instinctive and part of it, well... for Kamandi to live the life he’s living (he) would develop an angular, muscular physique anyway. I imagine a boy of 16 would be wellmuscled living a strenuous kind of life, you know, forever running from something, or forever fighting something. I think I’d give you two years on a roughand-ready obstacle course, and you’d come out looking pretty good. M: How about Sandman? Was bringing back the Sandman just a whim on your part? KIRBY: No, it was a whim on their part. I didn’t want to do Sandman. But I did it and it went like crazy; I don’t know why.
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KIRBY (later in the conversation): The Draft Board was located right below the offices of DC—I used to get conniptions every time I went to the office. But I wound up there anyway. You see, I was supposed to wind up in the Navy. My card was stamped NAVY. And then some guy came in and he said, “We need six guys for the Army.” I swear it was stamped NAVY and you know I feel to this day I was meant for the NAVY. This guy came out and being a loser, I was one of the six guys. M: You should have been exempted because of the morale. You were on Hitler’s want list. KIRBY: Gee, I sure was. I must have been. Of course, I tried to stay out of the Infantry like mad. So they first sent me to the anti-aircraft, and I thought that was pretty rough. Then I went to Ordinance and I became an auto mechanic and I told them I took 2 years of it at school. I used to lay under the wheels and I used to knock on the wheels and the guy thought I was working. Ordinance was kinda rough, you know; they were being shipped out too soon, so I said I gotta get outta here, I’ll go back to anti-aircraft. I went back to anti-aircraft just in time for them to turn us into infantry ’cause D-Day happened. And they turned us into infantry. M: Is there a lot of this in your comic books? Are your comic books autobiographical in any way? KIRBY: There’s evidence of it, yeah; a lot of it in the war stuff. For instance, I did a story like “Hell In A Very Small Place,” that was the name of the story. My Lieutenant discovered that I could draw and I wound up with a buncha Texans. So this guy, this Texan, was about 5'3", so he had an inferiority complex—you can’t be a Texan unless you are 6'7". I did Captain America and I could draw and he wanted me to stay with him and become his runner. So I was his runner. We wound up in this town which nobody had and we wound up in this terrific hotel. Now the Germans are running all over the place and we’re in this place. It’s a railroad town, a vacation town and I go up in this room in this big Louis XIV bed and I’m looking like an animal. I got mud all over me, a beard down to here and I’m pooped. We’d crossed the Mousell River about three o’clock in the morning in a row boat. He wanted to see what was in this town and I told him he was crazy. So he holed up in this hotel and I kicked the doors A Roz-lookalike helps an inept soldier fix his jeep, in this semi-autobiographical cover. down just so I have a place to run and I lay down on this Louis XIV bed and I find this terrific pornographic book. It was well going on? Are you kidding?” And he said, “I’m supposed to pick out illustrated, beautifully illustrated. I’m looking at this thing, and the five men.” So we crawl out from under this, and we go to see Marlene Luftwaffe are running around outside. They don’t know we’re in Dietrich. We’re sitting there like dopey animals, not knowing what’s there. And I find German magazines and I think they’re terrific, you going on. I was asleep and she went through her whole act. When all know. And we get caught in a small place which is what I put in a this is through, we get up outta this church, and we get onto this truck, story. Of course, in the story, in “The Losers,” I make it a lot more and the truck takes us back where we were. Now where we were, the dramatic than it was. But sure, there was an element there. And it got Germans are already using 88s. We’re using 105s—all from a bicyclist. hot, but nothing as to what took place in “The Losers.” And the whole place is being blown apart. I hide under a jeep, though But there’s evidence in it. For instance, I put Patton in one, and I nothing can protect you when you’re out in the open, and this was caught a glimpse of Patton. Nobody liked him and everybody thought after seeing Marlene Dietrich. So, it was that kind of crazy war. And I he was a lunatic. I put a little element of that into it. He wanted to know give an element of that into some stories. why we weren’t wearing ties. It was all crazy. One day, one guy sees a JIM HARMON: You know, I think a lot of people don’t read the German bicyclist. This guy’s riding on a bicycle; evidently, some kind newspaper comics anymore. I think the newspaper comics are in a lot of courier. The Germans are holding half the town and we’re holding worse shape than the comic books . half the town. And this guy shoots the bicyclist. I turned to him and asked, “What the hell did you do that for?” The guy’s on a bicycle, you M: That’s probably the adventure strips. The humor strips are doing know. There’s no big attack. He’s an ordinary Texan; he felt he ought fairly well. to kill the bicyclist. So what happened was they opened on us with a KIRBY: Doonesbury is great. I met Trudeau in Nashville; we talked at machine gun. And we open on them with a machine gun. A half hour a university. He’s a great guy. He probably thinks I’m an old fart, I later, five machine guns are in action and two rifle platoons are involved. suppose. He talks a different language. I think guys like Trudeau didn’t Everything is gone, everything. And I’m layin’ there, caught on the get as many knocks, really. I thank God to see that kind of a generation, ground still trying to figure out why this guy shot the bicyclist. So my who can talk more freely to people. I couldn’t talk to anybody—you Sergeant crawls over to me in the middle of all this and he said, “Take couldn’t walk right up to anybody without arousing suspicion. But I five men and go see Marlene Dietrich.” And I said, “What for? What’s 55
think the mark of the ’70s really isn’t all the crappy scandals we see around us. What I think is happening between ourselves is remarkable. I know on my block, the only way you could make yourself known in any way was in an aggressive way. There was no other way out.
feel that Nixon played that kind of game. He was true to that game, he was consistent. He got paid off and he paid off. Liddy played the game, and he was rough. I’m quite sure he’s done in a few guys. RICO: I covered the Liddy hearings for CBS as a courtroom sketch artist. I had to familiarize myself with his face first so I went to my files and got out the old Liddy photographs—he had a full face, nice smile, and so forth. I then went to the court and set myself up—and in came the most shriveled-up scarecrow you ever saw in your life. His eyes were sunken into his face, bones prominent, no neck to speak of, he was a dead man. He stood at the stand and never moved, just talked. So I made the drawings as I saw him—and I drew a ghost. When they telecast the drawings, I got many letters congratulating me on what I had done. I had shown the effect of what Watergate had done to this man.
RICO: My block was so bad that even the mobsters kept quiet. KIRBY: It was a macho world. The gangsters locked me in a telephone booth—I was about nine years old. They used to hang out in a candy store on the corner. They locked me in a booth and they all began to kick the door at once. That can scare the hell out of you. RICO: We had a more sophisticated group of gangsters on my block. I was about thirteen and I got into a fight with somebody, and I was on top of this guy, beating the hell out of him. A pair of hands reached out and picked me up. It was a guy called “The Ox.” He says (heavy Italian accent used here), “Hey Rico, stop what ya doin’. Whaddaya doin’ that for? Yer an artist, ya got yer hands, get outta here! Don’t hurt yer hands!” He kicked me out, and he beat the guy up. It’s a true story. These guys watched out for their own. If you had a certain kind of talent, they made sure you were all right.
M: Jack, which strip have you enjoyed drawing the most of all those you’ve done? Which do you think is your best? KIRBY: That’s a common question for everybody—you don’t really know. All you can say is that whatever you’re working on, if it gives you enjoyment, that’s it.
KIRBY: Listen, even the gangsters are articulate today.
M: Is there anything you ever did in comics that you’re ashamed of? Something that you did purely for the money and that was just a complete piece of trash as far as your standards were concerned?
M: A lot of the Mafia families turn out decent, law-abiding people who make contributions to society. We know they get what they want, OK? If they would publish this novel just the way you wanted it, would you go along with it?
KIRBY: I did it for the money and I got the money, but the strip lasted one issue: The Red Raven!!! The Red Raven, boy, it was a real dud!
RICO: That’s a good question and I’ll answer it in another way: There are publishing houses owned by the Mafia.
M: It was just the Sub-Mariner with wings, wasn’t it? KIRBY (Breaking up): Gee, I don’t know what it was! It was a guy in red underwear with wings and he looked pretty good to me. Boy, he just konked out in the first issue! And you just sit there wondering what the hell happened. You just can’t explain it. Sure, that kind of thing happens all the time.♥ (below) Unused art from In The Days Of The Mob #2.
HARMON: There sure are. There are publishing companies owned by the Mafia who publish books exposing the Mafia. RICO: Nixon’s father wasn’t a mobster. KIRBY: Some people play a game called “Screw your buddy week.” I
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Captain Victory & The Lightning Lady The Original Screenplay © Jack Kirby and Steve Sherman mental draws rapidly closer, it becomes more violent in nature, until we find ourselves swept into its blinding fury. When we are inside its chaotic core, our senses are assaulted by naked light and frightening, unbearable sound. This nightmarish experience ends at its most terrifying peak and, abruptly, we plunge through to face a startled policeman and a crowd of onlookers. The viewer begins to understand what this movement through the barrier represents when we see the policeman confronted by a smiling young man attired in a costume—a costume common to the super-hero genre. Although it is apparently of some kind of fabric, it has a dull, metallic sheen and is molded extremely well to his body. This man is capable of guided levitation and it was his flight through the barrier the viewer experienced. “How did you get in there?” asks the policeman. “How did you get out of there?”
(The concept of Captain Victory began in the mid-1970s as this movie screenplay by Jack and Steve Sherman. This first draft story treatment was initially submitted on March 11, 1977, and while a number of things changed when Jack produced it in comics form, the character of the Lightning Lady is remarkably well-defined. Our thanks to Steve Sherman for sharing this rare gem with us.) he film opens with a weirdly-diffused lighting effect which leaps busily across the screen, accompanied by a soft, droning, musical hum, the strange embodiment of what is happening on the screen. The formless, shifting light begins to resolve itself in more meaningful terms to the viewer. The humming sound has grown louder. It is recognizable as a human chorus imitating the collective buzzing of an insect swarm. In effect, what we are witnessing, as the image is brought into sharper focus, is the human equivalent of a beehive in the heat of furious activity. Men and women, in sharply animated condition, jostle past each other in endless haste to accomplish some nameless task in an alien structure, which is not unlike the natural environment of a bee colony as visualized by the average audience. This, in fact, is just what a larger overall shot of this scene communicates to the viewer, as the sound, having reached crescendo, blends with the devastating impact of the entire image: A sight, similar to the startling and intriguing sensation achieved by one who has sliced away the section of a hive to reveal the massive turmoil within. The people, in a far shot, ape the seething movement of an insect horde, in tightly packed numbers, diligently engaged with some universal purpose, undefinable and alien to the human mind. We begin to rise above this scene, for a larger view of the structure, as it breaks through the surface of the Earth in an ugly lumpish design, like some monstrous mouth emerging from the soil, its giant, bony teeth poking through the cracked surface of the wide circular heap caused by the force of its thrust. On the surface, the buzzing has subsided and become a tolling bell which echoes in the deserted streets of a fairsized town. The buildings and stores look unoccupied. Traffic vehicles are not to be seen. A rooftop shot of the surrounding countryside accents the complete absence of life. It is a place sucked clean of all moving things—an empty husk, a past tense existing in the present. We are now on a road, moving like a car, past billboards leading out of town. It is on the progression of these signs that the film’s title and credits are brought into view. This is accompanied by appropriate music, which increases in pace as the speed of movement accelerates with each passing sign. The last billboard rushes out of view as the road and billboards become a moving blur, hurtling at the audience at breakneck speed. The lighting starts to fade as we barrel through the growing darkness. We hear the roll of thunder, and the first flashes of lightning make an eerie web of the sky. A moment later, the sky becomes alive with the continuous traces of fiery brilliance, which now forms a permanent curtain of lightning across the black horizon. As this ele-
T
Pencils from Captain Victory #3. 57
This, of course, embodies the theme of the film—that man’s game is not the only game in town. The universe is large and diverse in social pathology. There are others with their own pattern of existence who must thrive and expand, irregardless of the effect this will have on the host society. Even as the Spaniards plunked themselves down among the Aztecs without invitation, a similar operation has begun in the heart of the US. However, this intrusion is of a completely alien nature and is inexplicable to the onlookers. In essence, what has happened is that destructive, insectlike creatures, human in form, with the power to unleash vast amounts of raw energy, have begun to build the nucleus of a colony which will eventually extend throughout the entire Earth and make of it a planetary hive. This process repeats whenever a queen is born and seeks another planet to begin a new hive. Although the premise has the surface look of simple science-fiction with comic strip ingredients, it also contains all the elements to be utilized for suspenseful, human drama, resolved in the happiest of feelings. The finished script is intended to emerge as a product pleasing to a wide range of age groups. The young man (described earlier) is a member of a three-man galactic team, assigned by unseen superiors to contain and drive out the planet-hopping “bee-people,” who, it seems, have broken through the cordon of an area in space where their kind are permitted to breed in peace. In short, if they are allowed the freedom to roam unmolested, they could easily overwhelm entire star systems and leave their planets empty, tunnel-ridden husks, abandoned for new places of habitation. Not only Earth, but every planet in our galaxy is in danger of falling victim to this weird life process. Indeed, the vastness beyond Earth is as chancy in structure as our own space pebble. Thus, the appearance of this young man and his companions in answer to this strange situation. He faces the policeman and a crowd of anxious onlookers—a variety of people caught by fate on the scene of an incident which will try them psychologically, spiritually and physically. Oddly enough, like the “bee-people,” confined by authority to a specific domain, these citizens are now in a quarantined area, surrounded by American troops assigned to control this bizarre situation. To avoid an embarrassing brush with the policeman and those present on the scene, the young man presses one of a symmetrical series of studs on his chest plate and vanishes into a color range which cannot be detected by the human eye. This act generates confusion and fear, but in concentrating on his progress, we find him reappearing to join the other two members of his team who have become part of a circus, stalled in its journey by this unforeseen turn of events, which has engulfed in its perimeters a small army of motorists. In this manner, we meet the three principal characters, Captain Victory, The Human Missle and Razzle-Dazzler. Of course, these names suggest special powers peculiar to super-heroes. However, despite the fact that these men do possess them, these powers have a sober purpose in relation to their assigned task—a Herculean task—a dangerous, but spectacular removal of the bee people from their entrenched and almost impregnable position. The leader of the galactic trio is Captain Victory, a truly heroic figure who projects authority, decisiveness and confidence with a likable human quality in his manner. The young man we’ve already been introduced to at the beginning of the film is The Human Missile. He can, naturally, levitate with accomplished skill and speed. Razzle-Dazzler is a super-illusionist who can induce visions in the mind which are fantastically real and offer some opportunities for entertaining special effects during the circus sequences and dramatically utilized in the terrifying climax of the film. These talents have earned these men a place in the circus where their costumes are accepted as show business accouterments and their skills as part of a clever gimmickry all their own. Captain Victory, though, truly confounds witnesses to his feats
because of their overwhelming nature. He is a powerhouse of strength, a dynamo of unending stamina and instant reflex. He can lift a bull elephant with ease, snatch a man from sudden death in the path of a speeding car and absorb enough electrical current to light up a city. In a preliminary conversation, The Human Missile reveals that he’s penetrated the barrier and made a survey of the situation. The “beepeople” have repeated here what they’ve done on many other worlds. They’ve occupied a populated site, pressed the natives into service with mind-control and established the nucleus of what is to be a planetspanning network of tunnels. These creatures are capable of releasing mammoth amounts of energy from which they create the material for their structure and form the protective barrier to insure the safety of their operation. As their structure expands, so will the barrier, not only in circumference, but in killing intensity. Expansion will, of necessity, generate increased energy power and render new penetration almost impossible. The source of this power is the queen of the hive, a female giantess, a biological marvel of a female who overpowers the senses by her very presence. It is she and a small escort of males, driven by a ritual perpetuated somewhere in outer space, who must seek and find a host world in order to continue their existence. When new queens are born in this new hive, they will be forced to fight for the Earth-hive or be driven in turn to seek another suitable world for their purposes. The present queen will be identified in the script as the “Lightning Lady,” a protagonist to be reckoned with. Not only can she unleash energy bolts of staggering power, but like Razzle-Dazzler, is capable of deceiving the senses with frightening images. In addition, she is an awe-inspiring sight, in view of her imposing stature and desirability. She is an alien image designed by nature to overwhelm the male and render him defenseless to her purposes. The story itself rolls on at this point with focus on the secondary characters—the natives of Earth, ordinary men, women and children caught in a deadly happening they don’t understand and must endure until it’s all resolved. There are the people who live in the area, the travelers and the forces of authority who must risk their lives in an attempt to contain this menace. Naturally, they don’t know how. They are dealing with extraterrestrial beings and four days of time before the entire country becomes aware of the reason why the lid of secrecy has been clamped down on this particular area of middle America. An initial attempt by troops to penetrate the barrier results in death and casualties. What’s more, the barrier itself erupts with renewed power as it begins to expand. In this threatening atmosphere, the characters of the story are forced to abandon their roles in society and react as endangered human beings who must also battle their own conditioning. Facades crumble and the true people emerge. Some with the face of respectability and unquestioned morality react with decided flaws; there is an armed gang with stolen cash in their car trunk, whose members break into segments of varied character, which are not without some admirable qualities. Still, the basically decent guy will remain so, under pressure, even as the incorrigible rat is too damned screwed up to change. All this is revealed in the four nightmarish days which this variety of characters will spend in the path of burgeoning death. Kept in the area to enforce the secrecy order, their rear is blocked by troops, and what lies before them is tightening the squeeze upon their lives. Every manner of habitation, from barns to hotels within the cordon, are requisitioned by the hapless civilians. But the steady advance of new eruptions of the barrier begins to destroy these places and panic the occupants. Cars explode and buildings touched by the barrier burst into flame. Acreage is ignited and the troops are fighting fires as well as preventing chaos. The immediate countryside now takes on the appearance of a scorched battlefield. This is the framework in which Captain Victory and his galactic team set to work. Isolating themselves from other members of the circus, they apply their powers to the mission. Razzle-Dazzler is in reality a mind-wave jammer. By marshaling his power to its maximum he sends a powerful mental beam lancing through the barrier. (This is visible 58
to the audience and is accented by sounds of electronic origin. His entire head begins to glow and his face is encompassed by a sunlike corona of light which broadens into a long undulating beam upon which bulletshaped globs of light are shot into the barrier.) The effect of this on the queen of the “bee-people,” who rules her subjects with mental commands, is equivalent to a disruptive force which destroys communication within the hive. It also disrupts the flow of energy to the barrier and makes it unstable. The evidence of this More pencils from Captain Victory #3. Despite differences, the basic plot of the screenplay was kept intact in the comic. soon becomes the barrier’s rim, now becomes a frightening tribulation from which apparent. The barrier, which has achieved a certain consistency, there is no telling what their fate may be. They are caught as unwilling begins to crackle and pop and “blink out” in various places on its surcaptives in a contest of alien wills. Captain Victory and the Lightning face. It becomes a mass of wild electrical activity and shows signs of Lady (the name given to the bee-queen) will make a shambles of their losing its structural form. lives, but the survivors will emerge from it with an extraordinary At this point, Razzle-Dazzler ceases his mental cannonade. The experience which will destroy their game-playing and bring them face galactic team knows it has shaken up the foe and made known the to face with their true selves. At its core, this is essentially a story of fact that opposition to the building of the hive has come from those people facing disaster in a bizarre, but exciting context, slanted towards qualified to stop the process. audience appeal. However, since this fact cannot come across in an abstract or The queen’s bee warriors attack with their own peculiar brand of obscure fashion, it must be illustrated in a sequence involving the queen ferocity and terrorize the humans. Through the efforts of Captain in her habitat. We’ve got to see her surroundings and life-style, her male Victory and his companions, they are thrown back. Super-gimmicks, attendants, the captive humans. We must see the constant leap of energy of course, are involved. There are feats of fantastic strength. Captain from the queen to every element of her domain. Even the walls of the Victory ignites the fuel in a large truck and hurls the flaming vehicle structure under construction are organic spin-offs of this energy and like a molotov cocktail at the enemy. He uproots a large tree and shatters emit flashes, as does every living thing in the hive. In essence, the it among his foes with a splintering force equivalent to an explosion. queen is a biological generator, gaining sustenance in a highly-pitched The bee warriors are showered with a deadly rain of flying shards. environment. And only when everything around her begins to sputter They reel before monstrous illusions conjured up by Razzle-Dazzler. and falter, and lose its intensity, can we see the effect of Razzle-Dazzler’s An attack from the air by The Human Missile causes chaos among mental assault. The queen herself is momentarily stricken. The smooththem. The fierce creatures keep up their attack despite this threat to ness of her operation suddenly fades and organizational control becomes their ranks. The insect culture does not allow for retreat. They must jeopardized. Her male helpers develop difficulty with the mind-enslaved destroy the enemy or be destroyed. humans who are losing their bee-like attitudes and show signs of returning Meanwhile, the humans do the best they can against this alien to their natural behavior. Fear and anger overtake the queen. She struggles force. But bombs and bullets are exploded harmlessly by the shield of to resume her normal output. Slowly and finally she does. The “Beeenergy which rises from the massed ranks of the bee warriors. Rifles Machine” works again. But, she is now aware of the galactic hunters on blow up in the hands of soldiers. Mortars, machine guns, any weapon her trail. It is a warning of new assaults upon the hive. She must fight loaded with ammo suffers a similar fate. Dive-bombing planes are back, or clear out. Proud and savage, she decides to fight back. exploded by their own ammunition when the raw energy makes contact There are unopened cells in the structure. When their lids are blown with them. It is a mad melee which is turning in favor of the warriors, away by blasts of energy, full-grown warriors come pouring from their until they turn as a group in unison, and vanish into the barrier. crypts, alive with crackling energy and eager for battle. With a regal Behind them, the perimeter looks like the aftermath of a tornado. flourish, they are sent on their way. While the humans are occupied with their casualties, Captain What has been an anxious situation, at this point, for the people on 59
end. There are romantic cameos involving female circus performers and the galactic heroes. Specifically, a young widow and her boy become closely attached to Captain Victory. This is not a cardboard relationship. These people are trying to cross a gap of danger and differences in origin. There is also the insect queen herself. Although she descends from an insectlike strain, she is definitely human in form, as are her people. This heritage, sadly, makes her an object of conflict and misunderstanding. She is not a villain, per se. She is a departure from familiar guidelines. The Lightning Lady must, because of her own instincts, act out the role in which the vagaries of the universe have cast her. The Lightning Lady is sexy, statuesque, and a dominating figure of force and organization. She is capable of projecting sincerity and tender emotion as well as a fierce nobility peculiar to her own background. In short, the Lightning Lady is an intensely desirable “Earth Mother” image who is a danger because of these very admirable qualities. She can overwhelm the male, but must react to the code dictated by her genes, and kill him when he has fulfilled his part of the courting ritual. Strangely enough, she is a creature without guile or machiavellian propensities. She does what she has to do and wins or loses like anyone else. In this case, she will lose, but not without a certain admiration for her courage and sympathy for her plight. In the end, she and her people must leave the Earth and elude containment, to find another nesting place among the stars. The Lightning Lady gives as good as she gets. She unleashes every power at her command as she expands the hive. From the volatile energy she generates, she creates terrifying creatures which she sends through the barrier. When these are dispatched after wrecking havoc, they are followed by meteoric fireballs which scream out of the barrier to heighten the panic among the humans. Meanwhile, the deadline of four days is reaching its explosive limit. The country, already aware of the quarantine, is witness to the movement of troops and planes, and a feeling of national apprehension is rapidly mounting. Every imaginable, negative rumor is adding to a clamor for the truth. Time is being consumed as the queen’s barrier expands. The quarantined perimeter is narrowing at a frightening pace, leaving less and less room for the humans to maneuver. The breaking point is approaching swiftly. The galactic team must now initiate the final phase of its operation. This must depend on Captain Victory alone. In the final moments before the climax, there is a meeting between the Lightning Lady and Captain Victory. Being as much a creature of love as well as power, she tries in desperation to overwhelm the Captain, a task which she is readily equipped to accomplish. However, Captain Victory is hardly eager to cash in his chips for a short-lived period of unequaled ecstasy. She is hypnotic and appealing. The Captain is shaken, but resolute. They are victims of their own conditioning and meant for conflict. One must destroy or put the other to flight. If the Lightning Lady wins, if she destroys this galactic team, Earth
Attacking the Insectons in Captain Victory #4. Victory, extricating himself from a heap of fallen bee warriors, moves on to rejoin his two friends. The Human Missile has been jolted from the air by energy blasts, but he’s survived them. A bright corona of light emanating from a heap of dead bee warriors indicates the location of Razzle Dazzler. He’s at the bottom of the pile and literally ablaze with light. He is battered and dazed, but will evidently recover. It was his powers that cut communication between the warriors and their queen and caused her, in panic, to recall them with a renewed burst of energy. At any rate, he is weak and over-extended. His extraordinary capabilities have been seriously reduced. It will take time to replenish himself and this sad condition renders him comparatively ineffective against what is yet to come. Although the human interest has not been fully described until this point in the treatment, it runs throughout the film, from beginning to 60
will be well on the way to becoming an impregnable hive before the next team arrives. If Captain Victory wins, it may be at the cost of his own life, or at best, a trial of his powers with consequences of an unpleasant nature. Nevertheless, the battle is on. While the circus puts on a show for the depressed and nerve-shattered humans, Captain Victory emerges from the woods. (His spaceship is hidden there and will be revealed at the film’s end.) He is wearing what looks like a spacesuit encrusted with complex gimmickry. Upon his head is a large, bulbous helmet which obscures his face. The Human Missile and Razzle-Dazzler bid him good luck and watch as he approaches the barrier. They watch him activate the suit, which comes alive like some alien electronic machine. A humming sound generates from his metal space shoes and he rises from the ground and begins to move into the barrier. There is a huge explosion of energy which cracks and roars, surrounding his helmet with scrabbling fingers of fire, before the energy puffs out and disintegrates. Captain Victory has made a large hole in the barrier and surges through it. Then, soaring above the highway which leads into the captive city, he heads for his target—the center of the hive. This will mean running a gauntlet of extraordinary ferocity. No man, except Captain Victory, is equipped to survive what will befall the intruder. Behind him, the circus performance is presented in a tense and gloomy atmosphere. Uncertainty is written on every spectator’s face. Men, women and children, strung out as far as they can go on courage, are momentarily diverted by what transpires in the arena. The Human Missile, through the use of fireworks, performs spectacular aerobatic feats which are visually spellbinding. Razzle-Dazzler creates mental fantasies of a wholesome and humorous quality, which brightens the mood of the audience. He supplements the usual circus acts with innovations of his own and gives the entire bill a super-image it never had before. Unhappily, it is a super-spectacle given in the shadow of Gotterdammerung! The twilight of the gods! The awesome, frightening sounds of the barrier intermittently penetrate the proceedings and affect the audience. But there is no panic. The performance seems to be the anchor upon which the humans screw their courage. As long as the acts go on without pause, the spectators do not respond to their hidden fears. Within the barrier, all hell is breaking loose. Lightning stabs down from the black heights and winds of tornado force sweep the land. The land itself seems to have turned personally hostile. It cracks apart and spews great gouts of flame in Captain Victory’s path. Boulders tear themselves out of the soil and hurl themselves at him, en masse. Even as he burns a path through them with a chest laser and smashes the rest of them with his fists, he is faced with being decapitated by uprooted telephone poles which come at him like missiles. When his flight level becomes packed with deadly debris, he rises above it and is forced down by tremendous fireballs which narrowly miss him. At low level, the earth forces up hills in his path. Only experienced maneuvering enables him to keep from crashing into these obstacles at killing speed. Captain Victory reaches the empty city to encounter even greater hazards. He is almost crushed by a falling building. He is struck by simple objects which shatter upon him with the force of cannon shells. Anything from a sewer cover to a steel girder attacks him as if by silent command. The sounds of impact will serve to heighten the effect of the action. Naturally, the Lightning Lady is the source of what is happening. She stands transfixed, ablaze with crackling energy which rockets off beyond the structure. The fact that this is a crucial moment for the “bee-people” is evident in the absence of activity. They flank their queen in groups and step forward to contribute their energy charge to hers. One by one, they die, like batteries emptied of power. What they fear most is happening. Captain Victory has reached the base of their structure and is unslinging some equipment from his pack, which he assembles in the fury of the electrical hell that boils
around him. His bulbous helmet is now a fiery torch. His suit flashes with deadly discharges and is slowly being destroyed. The instrument he has fashioned is completed with great difficulty. He jams it into the ground and attempts to levitate with his boots. But they’ve been damaged in the holocaust. There’s no choice but to leave on foot—a monumental task in this atmosphere of roaring chaos. Captain Victory crawls like a stricken bug in a sea of pyrotechnic violence. He is trying to put as much distance as he can between himself and the “imploder” he’s planted near the structure. It will act upon the energy storm as dynamite does to a blazing oil well. It will do its job in one terrifying moment. It will implode and draw into itself every iota of existing energy around it. It will be an instant of horrible impact, followed by an eerie silence, in which the barrier will have vanished. The alien nest will have disintegrated to harmless silt and the “bee-people” will have been entirely drained of their life-force. In the death-like stillness, the planted instrument itself will glow with a blinding brightness, a beautiful star against the dark backdrop of churned debris. The performance at the circus will be interrupted at the moment this happens. An echo of something calamitous in nature will wash into the great tent and then subside. It will affect the audience and the performers as well, and bring them out into the open, to fill the silence with murmurings of wonder. The barrier is nowhere to be seen, and they somehow sense that the menace to their lives is gone as well. Razzle-Dazzler and The Human Missile immediately take off in search of Captain Victory. He is nowhere to be seen in the smashed heap of a city. Only when he slowly crawls out from beneath the debris is he found. In the aftermath, the only ones alive in the alien structure are the enslaved humans, who emerge in a dazed condition. The “bee-people” are drained, smoking husks. The queen and her entourage have fought to the death, and lost. Captain Victory can only comment that they’ve been true to their own instincts and the unfathomable arrangement of things in the universe. At any rate, the galactic team must now leave and dispose of the dangerously energized instrument which has decided the issue. As for the humans, they are busily picking up the pieces of their fragmented lives. This traumatic experience is beginning to fade as do all disasters that never come to pass. Normality is returning and the quarantine is due to be lifted. When this is done, the people emerge from the area in a jubilant rag tag parade; in cars, on foot, civilians, soldiers, and the circus itself. The music which pervades the scene is really army band music, well-chosen, well-played, stirring and somehow, happy. The core of the film, after all, is not really heavy. It’s simply a testing of the spirit which expands when it survives in triumph. There is a final scene, in which Captain Victory and his companions take their leave. Strangely enough, the most important character here is the widow’s boy, to whom Captain Victory is not only a heroic image, but a possible step-father. This is not to be, but there is a strong residue of “manhood well-demonstrated” that will always live with the boy and shape his character. The galactic team repairs to the woods, where Razzle-Dazzler puts an end to the illusion of trees which camouflages the deep space vehicle which has brought the team to Earth. With workman-like efficiency, the three fasten the still glowing “imploder” to the top of the vessel where it projects the effect of a candle on a cake. Containing the massive power of what it has absorbed, the “imploder” bristles with potential for calamity. It is an erratic package which must be gotten rid of, in deep space. Thus, the departure of the galactic team is dramatic and swift. They shoot skyward as a sort of pyrotechnic adjunct to the patriotic blare of the band and the continuing flow of people from the field of trial. Of course, all this may seem a bit hokey, but it is contrived to leave the audience, at the film’s end, with a time-proven positive and happy feeling in the best tradition of a socko finale.♥ 61
Orion for who he is both then and now. In the end, Orion’s real triumph is to leave Apokolips with his rescued mother and Bekka, for “Life beckons.” Perhaps in this new, forward-thinking family unit, this community mostly of women, Bekka will transcend her helpmeet status as much as she’s surpassed Orion’s understanding.
The Newer Gods By Adam Sternberg McGovern
K
irby had clearly given the Fourth World’s gender dynamics further thought by the time he revisited it in 1985 with the Hunger Dogs graphic novel. In many ways as haunting a tale as any in the original cycle (notwithstanding a somewhat hurried and contrived last few pages tacked on at DC’s insistence), it finds Orion returning to his hellish birthplace of Apokolips, not for the Oedipal father-son slugfest with Darkseid as “prophesied” throughout the series, but for the love of a woman—Bekka, daughter of Scott Free’s mentor Himon.
You’ve Come a Long Way? Our sociology of the Kirby pantheon wouldn’t be complete without mentioning “Even Gods Must Die,” a frightful rush-job done to fill out the mid-’80s New Gods reprint series and “lead in” to Hunger Dogs. Produced under pressure from DC, Kirby’s dignity should be spared discussion of this travesty, but for one noteworthy (and to some, notorious) scene with Granny Goodness and the Female Furies (minus an M.I.A. Barda). On Darkseid’s new, automated Apokolips, Granny has been demoted from warrior-trainer to petty supervisor of the
The Woman Ahead Of The Man Raised in seclusion and thus still in possession of a moral optimism foreign (though attractive) to Orion, her influence gradually opens his eyes to a destiny other than vengeful martyrdom. Like the Old Testament heroines she’s modeled after in demeanor as well as name and appearance, she’s strong if not active, exercising an independent mind within gender-role constraints which aren’t particularly explained or justified in the text. Bekka rebukes her father for the “foolish”-ness of his desperate acts in these final days of the Apokolips/ New Genesis conflict (a sentiment seconded in Kirby’s own narration); she chides a reunited Orion and Lightray for the “silly games” of their affectionate wrestling (before diverting them with a serving of food!); she counsels Orion in the only moments of doubt and fear we’ve ever seen him express—and, in Kirby’s final scene of sensible daughters outliving doomed fathers, she bravely escapes an Apokolips engulfed in cataclysm at Himon’s dying command, but under her own power.
Orion’s Better Half The change in Orion is profound but convincingly gradual. First, after a monumental battle he barely survives, we see him admitting his “want” for love to Himon (at the same moment that Bekka’s concern awakens her father to the realization of where Orion has found it). Then we see him unself-consciously bidding farewell to Lightray in the language of love poetry: “See, Bekka? How like a wandering star he seems. How like a passing spring which ends its stay in the fading light of dismal times!” Immediately thereafter, he confesses being “afraid” of such times to Bekka, and professes his hatred of war. Hatred or no, he still hasn’t completely renounced it, but he next shows up fomenting rebellion amongst Apokolips’ “lowlies”—in effect, dedicating himself to popular will rather than the top-down (read: patriarchal) concentration of power in one individual, be it Darkseid as despot or Orion as deliverer. At the end of this sequence we even see him praying, in a sense, to the New Gods’ mystical “Source” for mercy toward the spirit of a fallen enemy (the once-idealistic Esak of New Genesis, long-since turned cynical armaments designer on Apokolips). “I understand your torture and pain,” he tells Esak, directly before realizing he must reveal his true face to Bekka, for “There can be no love... unless it can live with truth!” —an insight she had already grasped, accepting
The infamous scene in 1984’s New Gods; button-pushing didn’t agree with these former warriors. 62
technicians who monitor mechanized sentries. These posts are filled by disgruntled ex-Furies, who subject Granny to insubordinate taunts and even physical abuse, and fall to nostalgic brawling (in-between push-button sabotage of Darkseid’s patrols) before being disciplined through remote-control electro-shock by male overseers. This sequence underscores the narrow span of opportunities for women in Kirby’s idea of dystopia (and, consequently, the shades of gray in even the most villainous of the saga’s female characters). Kirby was clearly scarred by his WWII infantry experiences and anxious about Cold War-era militarism, and seemed to associate both with rampant masculinity: A telling coming-attractions caption in
Eternals #16 declares, “In a battle between males, the deciding factor is always an angry woman.” His 1984 comments to Amazing Heroes magazine noted that Barda “was just as important as anybody else” in the original cycle, and promised that in Hunger Dogs “the women are going to be the big surprise. Women are important to my work.” Their level of prominence in the graphic novel didn’t quite match the expectations fostered by Kirby’s remarks, but their importance to his work, either at the center of action or in absentia, was always plain to see.♥ (Thanks to John Morrow for loaners and the lead on Amazing Heroes, and to Robert Alter’s The Art of Biblical Narrative for an insight in Paragraph Two, Sentence Two.)
Flowers For Miss Conway (In which Jimmy Olsen explains why Morgan Edge’s secretary is the greatest thing since Wite-Out TM) by Robert L. Bryant, Jr. Dear Miss Conway—May I call you Laura? Laura, I hope you liked the flowers Clark Kent and I sent you after your... unusual... illness and that whole mess with Count Dragorin and Dabney Donovan’s weird experiment. It was a wild trip!! I know you probably see us as a couple of busybodies—always hanging around your office at Galaxy Broadcasting, trying to pry information about Morgan Edge out of you, trying to make you put us ahead of your duty to your boss. I wouldn’t trust Mr. Edge if I were you—he’s got a dark side you don’t know about. But that’s not really what I wanted to say. Laura, I’ve known a lot of super-women—a lot of 38-24-38 heroines trying to save the Earth from one menace or another. You know how it is when you live in Metropolis; you can’t walk across the street without bumping into a statuesque crusader with a skintight costume and a giant ego. But you, you’re different—you’re the girl next door, you don’t have any of those clichéd old super-powers, you’re not out to conquer the universe. You’re just making a living working 9 to 5. You’re a normal 1971 woman. Wow. You’re a breath of fresh air!! I love your sense of humor, like the time you told Don Rickles you’d do it when he suggested that you “Get yourself a bikini and start a chain of heart attacks at a garden party!” He was right. You do deserve “something better than a typewriter and this sneaky crumb,” Morgan Edge. You should have seen the way you looked when Clark lifted you up in his arms in Mr. Edge’s office after you’d been “bitten” by Dragorin’s long-distance vampire power—you were all arms and legs and flowing hair in a tight red dress—you were so vulnerable and sexy and mysterious, all at the same time! (I hope you don’t mind me saying so. Golly.) Well, it was then that I decided I had to get to know you better. There’s just nobody else like you around here. Anyway, Laura, you think you’d be up for a movie Saturday night? I could pick you up around 7:00. And I don’t like to brag, but I’ve got the coolest car you ever saw in your life! Sincerely,
Jimmy Olsen
Cover pencils to Jimmy Olsen #143; poor Ms. Conway was the first victim of Count Dragorin. 63
Collector Comments Send letters to: The Jack Kirby Collector c/o TwoMorrows • 1812 Park Drive Raleigh, NC 27605 or E-mail to: twomorrow@aol.com _____________________________________________
(I’d planned to make this a 52-page, $4.95 issue, but when I got my hands on the incredible unused GALAXY GREEN and TRUE LIFE DIVORCE pages, I just had to bump it up to 68 pages so I could run them at the size at which Jack intended them to be seen! TJKC subscribers still get this issue at the regular, lower price—whatta bargain! Now, on to your letters about #19, starting with a couple that involve females:) _____________________________________________ I must confess that as a little girl, I never read too many comics done by Jack Kirby. My older brothers brought home copies of THOR and FANTASTIC FOUR while I indulged my adolescent fantasies through the antics of TIPPY TEEN and BETTY AND VERONICA. My brothers put down my choice of comics and I reciprocated. But when no one was looking, I one day sneaked into their comics drawer to see what all the fuss was about. There, I discovered Crystal!! Whatta tough chick! And that crazy headband! I even made a Halloween costume out of that wild outfit she wore because it impressed me so much. (Tippy had nothing on Crystal and Sif when it came to fashion!) Now my husbandʼs getting your magazine and Jack Kirby is again a small part of my life. I even read issues #18 and #19 from cover to cover. Iʼd never read fan publications before but these were something different—and very worthwhile. I canʼt wait to see Sif, Sue, Medusa, and Crystal (all my sisters!) in your next mag. Mr. Kirbyʼs talents got my brother Brian to develop his drawing skills and become an architect, so I was a little disappointed that #19 didnʼt have any art by your fans. Can we see some later? Jackie Lundy, Belmont, CA (I’d hoped to include a small section of fan art in #19, but the issue filled up quicker than I’d planned. But how about it, readers? Do you want to see some of the really nice Kirby-inspired fan art that’s been sent in? Let me know.) _____________________________________________ Though Heather and I have been together for about ten years, it wasnʼt until last year that we finally got married on Valentineʼs Day. For our first anniversary, we spent the weekend staying in a luxury hotel in St. Paul. But the best part for me was the Anniversary present that Heather
gave to me. The first anniversary is “paper” as you may know. The gift of “paper” that I received from my wife was my very first piece of Jack Kirby original artwork. I was incredibly touched by this. Heather had called up Michael Thibodeaux after getting his number from an ad in the back of TJKC #18. As you know, with the unfortunate passing of Roz Kirby, all the original artwork in the ad went back to the Kirby estate and could no longer be sold. However, even though Michael Thibodeaux had a lot of messages, he returned my wifeʼs call and offered to sell a piece out of his personal collection. He even went to the trouble of faxing my wife a piece that he thought I might like and that she would be able to afford. I couldnʼt stop looking at the piece that weekend. It is something that I will always treasure. Please pass on my personal thanks to Michael. Itʼs nice to know that there are such good people associated with the hobby. It is also a testament to the power of Jackʼs work that it continues to delight, years after the man himself is gone. Mark C. Schussler, St. Paul, MN _____________________________________________ Art-wise, the highlight of this issue was the incredible painted cover by Alex Ross. To see the results of two artistsʼ collaborations has always been one of my favorite aspects of the comics medium. The “child” produced by the two “parents,” with infinite possible combinations, can be a delight to look at. This piece, combining the artists of two eras—both whose work is a standard to which others strive for—turned out surprisingly well. The painting is easily identified as Kirby work as well as Ross, highlighting the best traits of both artists. Please continue your tradition of running Kirby covers with different inkers (and painters). They are a real treat! Michal Jacot, East Tawas, MI _____________________________________________ Great Alex Ross Captain America cover this month. That blew my mind when I opened the mail. I just sat back and said “WOW.” Then, when I saw the Dave Stevens centerfold, I was floored again. Any chance of enlarging these to the size of the JACK KIRBY COLLECTOR promotional posters (17”x23”) and offering them for sale? Great concept you used this issue. You are truly keeping the spirit of Jack Kirby alive by keeping us guessing whatʼs coming next. Mike Arndt, Fredericksburg, VA (Boy, a lot of you folks contacted us about getting a poster-size version of Alex’s cover! All I can say for now is that TJKC won’t be offering anything of that sort, but don’t be surprised if someone else does soon.)
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I have to agree with Bill Wray. It wouldʼve been far preferable to see straight inks in the NEW GODS collection. Kirbyʼs art is so spectacular uncolored—even more “electric” (to use Kaneʼs word) in a black-and-white state, which we rarely get to see aside from on art dealer tables at conventions. This is especially true with Royer inks. Why “colorize” it with a limited palette? The ideal format for the entire Fourth World series would be raw pencil art, collected together in the order the stories were originally released, rather than a separate edition for each series title. I disagree with Wray that Jack “would have hated it.” Bill knew Jack personally and I didnʼt, but look at the evidence. Jack went through years of terrible inking without even seeming to care. Mark Evanier and Steve Sherman had to TELL Jack that Colletta was omitting figures and butchering his pencils after years of collaboration before Jack even noticed, or so it seemed from all accounts. Maybe he hated the inking and kept it to himself, but my impression is that he was tolerant of most changes made to his work by inkers and editors. It always struck me as a huge paradox that Jack saw himself as kind of a Joe Lunchpail doing a job. Cranking out pages was just a way to make a living, but yet his work was simultaneously so inspired and personal. Anyway, my guess is he would have been happy the work was on the racks again after 28 years but, unfortunately, all we can do is speculate. Hereʼs the main point of this note: Forget the experiment in art direction and typography in the first half of this issue. The old design is much cleaner and more visually inviting. I found the newer look harder to read and completely out of sync with the consistency and solidity of Jackʼs art. The different title fonts over the various articles add nothing, and detract from (if not delete) the overall look of the magazine, which is usually so well-coordinated with Jacksʼ sense of design it seems as though he art directed it himself. Magazines that change typefaces all over the place come across as cheesey fanzines. Otherwise, keep up the great work! Gene Fama, Los Angeles, CA (As promised, we’re back to the old layout and design for the foreseeable future. Last issue was a fun experiment, done to respond to a number of requests for a more varied look to the magazine. But I intentionally created a pretty straightforward, basic design way back in TJKC #1. To me, Jack’s art should do the talking, and the design should be secondary—glad you agree.) _____________________________________________ Congratulations and much thanks for what must be the handsomest ish of TJKC youʼve ever produced. I enjoyed the suggestive use of various Kirby script quotations; that was a nice touch. The deployment of art throughout this issue is very, very good: I particularly liked the color insert, the contrasting examples in Link Yacoʼs piece, the flow diagrams in Ian Cairnsʼ article, and the plentiful examples in Jim Ottavianiʼs bit. Good, intelligent, demonstrative use of Kirbyʼs art. (That Ben Grimm drawing at the end of the Roz eulogy was a wonderful choice.) I particularly appreciated the Groth interview; itʼs high time someone went to Groth to have him address the scurrilous rumors that have flown around since JOURNAL #134. I donʼt think Grothʼs comments will necessarily put those rumors to rest, but I was glad to see the questions raised and frankly dealt with. At the risk of seeming humorless: Link Yacoʼs overview of Kirbyʼs stylistic growth is useful, and very nearly persuasive, but for the unfortunate reference to Cubists and Abstract Expressionists as “academic poseurs” (5b). His dismissive view of these modernist painters as frauds, content to drip “squiggles of paint” for fame and fortune, reveals a staggering disregard for the way modernist insights have changed, not only the world of academic art criticism, but also the practices of comic book creators. This sort of rhetorical broadside betrays fandomʼs reflexive anxiety about cultural status. Such anxiety is crippling, and such broadsides only show how insular and intellectually gun-shy fandom still is. Here again we see the stereotype of the hard-working, authentic comic book artist, in contrast to the alleged phoniness and cupidity of
the “fine art” world (alas, articles elsewhere in TJKC #19 show that such qualities are also found in comics art collecting). Yaco should recognize that harping on such a tired theme only serves to reinforce the cultural economy he is trying to criticize. It accomplishes nothing—NOTHING—in Kirbyʼs favor to denigrate Pollack and Picasso as “poseurs.” On the contrary, such remarks make comic book fandom appear narrow, defensive and ill-informed. Yaco is on to a good idea when he makes an implicit comparison between modernist abstraction and Kirbyʼs artistic techniques. The “squiggles” and the “geometric shapes” are there. But I donʼt think itʼs necessary to denigrate fine art or academia to arrive at an appreciation of Kirbyʼs techniques. Falling into that trap means surrendering to a sort of cultural “either/or” which I donʼt buy in the least. (This is the flip-side of the equally misguided attempt to make Kirby the “Picasso” of comics or some such.) I detect a similar strain of anti-intellectualism in Jim Ottavianiʼs piece, but, ironically, the thing is at least as useful as it is funny. His opposition of “enjoyment” and “analysis” doesnʼt ring true (since when does one preclude the other?), but itʼs a good piece nonetheless. Perhaps the funniest thing about it is that, in the end, it turns out to be more useful than funny? “Kirbytech” is a damn good phrase, sort of like “chicken fat.” <grin> Charles Hatfield, Storrs, CT _____________________________________________ Every time I get a new issue of TJKC in the mail, Iʼm amazed that youʼve been able to outdo yourselves again, and issue #19 is no exception. I found the article by Link Yaco on the evolution of Kirbyʼs style particularly interesting. Iʼve done a lot of thinking and had discussions with other Kirbyphiles on that very subject, and think that Linkʼs breakdown was well done. However, I donʼt think he went quite far enough. To lump all of the post-1965 work that Jack did as “artsy” does a disservice to his ongoing evolution of style. I agree that Kirby was probably affected by the zeitgeist of the era, but I think more than anything the sheer volume of work he was doing affected his style. Remember, he had never before single-handedly produced so many stories and covers than his middle-ʼ60s Marvel period, and the fluidity of his figures and his storytelling, as well as the innovations in characters, costumes and concepts, show what happens when Jackʼs level of creativity is pushed to the limits of the envelope. He had obviously hit a creative peak that he sustained for many years. However, I believe that Kirbyʼs style continued to evolve, and I would like to suggest that what Link referred to as Jackʼs artsy period starting in ʼ65 should be broken down even more. Perhaps we should call the period from ʼ65-ʼ70 “Classic Kirby.” A further evolution of style became apparent during his tenure at DC and his early return to Marvel that I would call his “Expressionistic” period due to the fact that his art was becoming somewhat looser, a bit less realistic and more exaggerated in service of the emotions played out in his stories. This Expressionism evolved, in my opinion, into an even more “bulked up” figure style with more geometric forms and looser style of drawing that I would call “Abstract Kirby.” I believe that what Jack was going for, ultimately, was a type of shorthand image-and-word gestalt that would convey to the viewer action, movement, emotions and thought all at the same time. Many people who have been critical of Kirbyʼs writing in later years have said that he had no feel for real human speech. In my opinion, Kirby was no more interested in writing “real human speech” than he was in drawing ultrarealistic figures. Taken as a whole, one begins to see that Kirby was attempting to convey a series of complex emotional/intellectual concepts using a sort of shorthand and symbols he had helped develop and evolve over many years. (This comment also has application to Robert L. Bryant Jr.ʼs article on Dialogue.) As usual, I canʼt imagine how youʼre going to top this issue, but then again I say that after every issue! Keep up the great work. Long live the King! Bruce Younger, Rochester, NY
_____________________________________________ Iʼve noticed that in DCʼs ʼ70s BLACK MAGIC reprints, a lot of the womenʼs faces donʼt really look like Kirbyʼs. Were they changed, or did he just have bad inking when they were done? Andreas Gottschlich, Berlin, GERMANY
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If you examine the lettering in NEW GODS #3, at least through the first half, wherever the Black Racerʼs name appears, “Black” seems slightly out of sync with the rest of the lettering (particularly in the title and in the caption on pg. 8, panel 2, but throughout the first half). There even seems to be just a little more white space on each end of the word “Black” each time. Did Jack originally have a different name for the Racer? Did he or DC change the name? Keith A. Bowden, Richmond, CA (Okay, here’s a couple more mysteries for us to solve in upcoming issues. Anyone have any ideas on these?) _____________________________________________
The Jack Kirby Collector is a not-for-profit publication, put together with submissions from Jackʼs fans around the world. We donʼt pay for submissions, but if we print art or articles you submit, weʼll send you a free copy of that issue or extend your subscription by one issue. Hereʼs a tentative list of upcoming issues, to give you ideas of things to write about. But donʼt limit yourself to these – we treat these themes very loosely, so anything you write may fit somewhere. And just because we covered a topic once, donʼt think we wonʼt print more about it. So get creative, and get writing; and as always, send us copies of your Kirby art!
Was Jack Kirby a genius? A genius, I think, is someone who opens significant new avenues of thought and feeling—not necessarily someone who is obviously and immediately profound. It sometimes takes a while to recognize profundity. Thatʼs the reason itʼs profound. Consider Alexandre Dumas. For decade after decade he was regarded as a skilled but certainly not “serious” writer of popular fiction. After all, what is obviously and immediately profound about his work? Yet we are now a hundred and fifty years away from the first publication of THE THREE MUSKETEERS and THE COUNT OF MONTE CRISTO and THE MAN IN THE IRON MASK and there is no end of their popularity in sight. Was he a genius? He must have been. For a hundred and fifty years heʼs said something important to us. In many ways, Jack was a modern Dumas. The same vitality, the same syncretic imagination, the same belief in the individual, the same opposition to oppression; but there was also a dimension to Kirbyʼs stories that echoed no one else, and although Jack left little fully-developed work behind—through no creative fault of his own—what does exist is unique and immensely influential. I canʼt help wondering what Gary Groth would think of Jack Kirby if Jack alone had worked in the Kirby style and told the Kirby stories. The second-rate imitators who have skimmed the surface of his drawings and trivialized his vision have created a false over-exposure to his work that has affected even significant critics. Was Jack a genius? Time will tell us. Personally, I believe time is on Jackʼs side. Richard Kyle, Long Beach, CA _____________________________________________ Issue #19 in a word: WOW! Analysis of the Kingʼs art style has been done before, but never with as much depth and perception as put forth in this issue. Gil Kane (one of my all-time favorites) has a fascinating way of putting the Kirby vitality into words. Thanks for finding that article. Kevin Sharp, Palo Alto, CA (Gil’s one of my favorites too, and we’ve got a very Kirbycentric interview with him scheduled for next issue. Also, Gil’s contributing a cover and interview to our sister ’zine COMIC BOOK ARTIST #2, due out in August.) _____________________________________________ I never had a “problem” with Jackʼs emphasizing different words than, say, Stan. What threw me for a long time was his use of language in general. When I first saw Jack interviewed on television, and later read interviews in magazines, I discovered that he WROTE the way he did because he TALKED that way! NOBODY Iʼve ever encountered phrases his thoughts the way Jack did. Itʼs clear—Jack Kirby did NOT think like any average human being. No wonder he stood out from the crowd so much in every thing he ever did. LOVED the color pages. The “psychedelic” paintings in particular make me think of what COULD have been done with Kirbyʼs NEW GODS if anyone at DC had even considered experimenting with different formats. Such a shame... Henry R. Kujawa, Camden, NJ
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#22 (No v. ’98): Villains
From the Red Skull to Doctor Doom and Darkseid, weʼll take a closer look at what makes Jackʼs bad guys so darn good! Deadline: 9/1/98. #23 (Jan. ’99): ANYTHING GO ES!!
Write about ANYTHING as long as it pertains to Jack! If youʼve got art that doesnʼt fit other theme issues, this is the issue for it! Deadline: 11/1/98. #24 (Mar. ’99): Marvel in the 70’s
Weʼll explore Jackʼs 1970s return to the House of Ideas he helped build. Deadline: 1/1/99. #25 (May ’99): Greatest Battles
From fight scenes on the comics page to his personal slugfests, weʼll detail Jackʼs greatest battles throughout his career. Deadline: 3/1/99.
Submission Guidelines: Submit artwork in one of these forms: 1) Clear color or black-&-white photocopies. 2) Scanned images – 300ppi IBM or Macintosh. 3) Originals (carefully packed and insured). Submit articles in one of these forms: 1) Typed or laser printed pages. 2) E-mail to: twomorrow@aol.com 3) An ASCII file, IBM or Macintosh format. 4) Photocopies of previously printed articles OK. Weʼll pay return postage and insurance for originals – please write or call first. Please include background info whenever possible.
NEXT ISSUE: Get ready! From Devil Dinosaurs to Fighting Fetuses, #21 spotlights JACKʼS WHACKIEST WORK, and starts with color covers featuring MISTER MIRACLE (inked by BOB WIACEK) and the ultra-scarce 1960s CAPTAIN NICE poster art (inked by CHIC STONE)! Then we interview comics legend GIL KANE about working with Jack, and animator supreme BRUCE TIMM discusses the Kirby influence on his SUPERMAN and BATMAN cartoons! Thereʼs also a rare KIRBY INTERVIEW, features on MISTER MIRACLE, OMAC, THE INHUMANS, SILVER SURFER, Jackʼs years in animation, his work for TOPPS COMICS, the unseen SILVER STAR screenplay, and lots more! Plus thereʼs the usual array of unpublished Kirby art including unused pages, published pages BEFORE they were inked, and more! (And donʼt forget THE COLLECTED TJKC, VOL. 2, out next month!) Since weʼre off to Summer conventions, weʼll see you in mid-September! The deadline for submissions: 7/15/98.
Classifieds (10¢ per word, $1 minimum) ______________________________ WANTED: Buried Treasure #1 (Pure Imagination, magazine). Also Ark Magazine #33 (1990, England), Dark Domain (Gray Morrow). Brian Postman, 238 East 24th Street #2A, New York, NY 10010. ______________________________ 1960s MARVEL memorabilia wanted! Buttons; fan club kits; toys; send-away T-shirts; Captain Action; Bullpen autographs. Contact: Aaron Sultan, 3201 Arrowwood Dr., Raleigh, NC 27604. 919-954-7111. e-mail: dtbb67a@prodigy.com
MIGNOLA Hellboy art wanted, also Alex Toth DC work, Vampirella Special Hardcover, “Ark” #33 (Toth Interview). Brian Postman, 238 East 24th Street, #2A, New York, NY 10010. ______________________________
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LIMITED EDITION PRINTS FOR SALE. Jack Kirby--A Premier Presentation from the Ruby-Spears Productions Animation Collection — can be seen on the Web at: www.madmorgan.com or by contacting Jeff Cooke at Mad Morgan Enterprises, PO Box 6698, Burbank, CA 91510, (818)848-1445, FAX (818)840-1252, e-mail: morgancooke@earthlink.net (catalogs available). ______________________________ SEEthe Atlas Comics Homepage at: http://members.tripod.com/ ~Herodotus71/index.html
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Volume Two! Volume Two is a 160-Page Trade paperback, reprinting the out-of-print TJKC #10-12!! Plus we’ve added a NEW SECTIO N with o ver 25 Mo re pieces of art never befo re published in TJKC, including UNINKED PENCILS to The Prisoner, New Go ds, Tho r, Hunger Do gs, Jimmy O lsen, SHIELD, & more! It’s only $14.95 po stpaid ($16.95 Canada, $24.95 elsewhere)! O rder No w FO r July Shipping!
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THE JACK KIRBY COLLECTOR #20 A TWOMORROWS
ADVERTISING & DESIGN PRODUCTION IN ASSOCIATION WITH THE KIRBY ESTATE EDITOR: JOHN MORROW ASSISTANT EDITOR: PAMELA MORROW ASSOCIATE EDITOR: JON B. COOKE DESIGN & LAYOUT: TWOMORROWS PROOFREADING: RICHARD HOWELL COVER COLOR: TOM ZIUKO CONTRIBUTORS: BARRY ALFONSO D. BRUCE BERRY NORMAN BLASDEL JERRY BOYD ROBERT L. BRYANT LEN CALLO PIERRE COMTOIS JON B. COOKE SHEL DORF KEVIN EASTMAN MARK EVANIER MIKE GARTLAND MIKE GOLD DAVID HAMILTON RICHARD HOWELL FRANK JOHNSON LISA KIRBY ADAM MCGOVERN BILL W. MILLER MARK MILLER GREGORIO MONTEJO MICHAEL LIAM MURPHY MARK PACELLA GREG PHARIS MIKE PRICE STEVE ROBERTSON MIKE ROYER DAVID SCHWARTZ SCOTT SHAW! STEVE SHERMAN KEN STEACY DAVE STEVENS MIKE THIBODEAUX R.J. VITONE WORDS & PICTURES MUSEUM SPECIAL THANKS TO: JON B. COOKE SHEL DORF MARK EVANIER MIKE GARTLAND D. HAMBONE RANDY HOPPE RICHARD HOWELL ROBERT KATZ LISA KIRBY MARK PACELLA MARK PACELLA GREG PHARIS MIKE PRICE MIKE ROYER DAVID SCHWARTZ STEVE SHERMAN KEN STEACY DAVE STEVENS MIKE THIBODEAUX TOM ZIUKO AND OF COURSE THE KIRBY ESTATE MAILING CREW: MITCH BANKS RUSS GARWOOD D. HAMBONE GLEN MUSIAL ED STELLI PATRICK VARKER AND THE OTHER KIRBY FANS IN RALEIGH, NC
over 25 NEW pieces of Kirby art!!
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