Q&A Interview - Dr. Cleveland T. A. Mason, II

G&G: Dr. Mason, you have shared with Grace & Glory a few times before, and I consider this opportunity to interview you a special honor as you celebrate 50 years in ministry. Can you believe it, 50 YEARS? Has the reality of it sunk in?

Dr. Mason: Yes, the reality is sinking in. What is amazing to me is how fast the time has gone by.

G&G: Dr. Mason there is so much we could talk about; let’s go back to when this 50-year journey first began. Most pastors have shared that “preaching the gospel” was not what they had planned for their lives. Did you always know this was your purpose? Did you have other plans for your life?

Dr. Mason: When I was very young, I thought I wanted to be in law enforcement. Not a street cop but an agent for the FBI or the CIA. The influence of television shows like The Wild Wild West, Highway Patrol, The FBI, and others glamorized the life of law enforcement officers.

But for me, nothing was more exciting than church life. Sunday worship at New Shiloh Baptist Church was dynamic, dramatic, mystical, engaging, and entertaining. The Holy Spirit’s engaging us in worship helped us to cope with the despair and problems of life. Sunday was our therapy. Sunday evening was Baptist Training Union (BTU) where we learned Baptist Doctrine and the fundamentals of spiritual formation. Monday was our Youth Express meeting where we got to express ourselves and explore the application of biblical knowledge. Wednesday was mid-week worship. Thursday was choir rehearsal for me. Saturday was the Neighborhood Youth program which was later converted to our Saturday Church School. This is where time was devoted to biblical and academic learning. The core development of the church was centered around merging education and experience.

When I was 8 years old, shortly after my conversion, I had opportunities to share my faith in Jesus Christ. Persons like Pastor William W. Payne at Wayland Baptist Church; Pastor Thomas R. Taylor at New Bethlehem Baptist Church and later Second Baptist Church in Annapolis, MD; Pastor Lawyer L. Swinson at New Metropolitan Baptist Church, and so many other Pastors across the nation gave me opportunities as a lay speaker to share God’s Word. Also, my early association with the Deacons Conference of Baltimore & Vicinity and the National Baptist Deacons Convention of America, Inc. through its Youth Department helped to shape where my life was headed.

People would say to me, “You’re going to be a preacher”, and I would rebuff their words. Little did I realize how God was using their words and life’s experiences to prepare me for the call and give me the foundation upon which the ministry would be built.

I have always loved preachers and preaching. To me, preachers were the best people God had on the planet and preaching was for me the centerpiece of worship and I could remember sermons like some people remember songs. I loved Dr. Harold A. Carter, Sr., and his preaching. Great sermons like: “Determined” and “Honey on the Ground” were masterpieces. Pastor’s best friend, Dr. William Augustus Jones at Bethany Baptist Church in Brooklyn, NY came with an impressive bass voice, and I remember the first sermon he preached at our revival entitled “Universal Conviction.”

1. Everybody Experiences Conviction. 2. Some Are Convicted and Running. 3. Some are Convicted and Condemned. 4. Then there is the Convicted and Redeemed. These revival messages were followed by sermons: “The Harlots House” and “A Tale of Two Cities.”

In short, my simple answer is, I did not take preaching up, preaching took me up!

G&G: Looking back at where you were when you started this journey, where did you think, it was going to lead you? Are you at all surprised at where you are today?

Dr. Mason: I clearly began this journey as an evangelist. I was amazed at how God would use me to witness to people and they would pray for God to save them. As a

Continued on page 10 child, I met and was encouraged by Eli Stanley Jones, a United Methodist Evangelist known for starting the United Christian Ashram movement hosting Christian retreats around the world after serving as a missionary to India. At the Ashram, I learned about witnessing and had opportunities to witness. I went to the Billy Graham School of Evangelism where I was taught by Dr. Manuel Scott, Sr., and others on evangelism. At the core of our teachpreaching ministry today is evangelism. I was fully satisfied serving as an evangelist until the Lord was calling me to serve as a pastor.

My first pastoral call was to the Mount Enon Missionary Baptist Church in southeast Washington, D.C. The founding Pastor, Dr. Willie J. Mason, died within a year of starting the work and I served six years after him. The Lord was leading me to prepare for my next assignment and September 11, 1991, Perkins Square Baptist Church called me to serve as the fourth Pastor. The church is now 142 years in Christian service and this year, April 12, I have completed 31 years of service.

The journey has had some hills and valleys and I have had great support along the way. I believe I have great people who with me have faced life together, battled the devil together and are learning to live in the Spirit together. The words of my Pastor, Dr. Harold A. Carter often echo within me. Little things like, “Don’t let the dead kill your ministry.” In other words, do not try to fight every battle with people; God knows best how to straighten His people out. Know when to let go! Words of people like Dr. A. C. D. Vaughn, who reminded me, “It takes a tender heart and a tough hide to do ministry.” The words of these and so many significant others like my grandmother, Julia Ruffin Holmes said, “Live so God can use you.” So, I seek to live to please the Lord! It is harder to please people and their award is so temporal. True honor comes from the Lord!

Where I am today, is a result of the Lord’s promise. Our God is a promise-keeper.

G&G: Dr. Mason, what was the turning point in your journey or that moment when you realized that God had called you to an assignment of this magnitude?

Dr. Mason: While most young children, came home from school and turned their attention to getting the homework done; mine was reading the Bible. At age 15, I was walking home from school, and I recall as if it were yesterday at the corner of Calverton Heights and Wheeler, I heard these words, “Son of man, prophesy and say, Thus saith the Lord

God; Howl ye, Woe worth the day!” I was immediately arrested by these words because no one was around at the time. When I got home and opened my Bible; my eyes fell upon these words in Ezekiel 30:1-2

1The word of the Lord came again unto me, saying, 2 Son of man, prophesy and say, Thus saith the Lord God; Howl ye, Woe worth the day!

I understood, as I read these words that God was speaking to me. He was calling me to preach and was using His Word to undergird the calling of His Spirit.

Now I do understand that I did not feel worthy of such a calling upon my life, and I argued with God about it. That’s when I learned God is a great attorney, He knows how to argue His case and wins.

G&G: Dr. Mason, once you submitted to the call, were there any unexpected oppositions, nay-sayers, etc.? Did you ask yourself, what have I signed up for? Have you ever wanted to throw in the towel?

Dr. Mason: I yielded to the call and had a long discussion with my Pastor. It was the second or third Sunday in November 1972, Bishop Walter Scott Thomas and I made our announcement to the New Shiloh Church that we were called into the Ministry.

On November 19, 1972, at dusk I was going to the store for a neighbor to get a loaf of bread and was hit by an intoxicated driver. When I came to consciousness, I had catapulted from one crosswalk to the other; clearing an intersection and blessed that no other vehicle hit me. I would learn that I had fractured bones and had to stay in the hospital from that night until January 19, 1973.

I was scheduled to preach my initial sermon on Sunday, February 25, 1973. I worked on my sermon in the hospital and from the book of Acts I preached, “Be of Good Cheer, God Will Take Care of You!” I have found it to be true that a preacher’s initial sermon tends to mark to course of their ministry. I have seen it in mine.

Tuesday, January 24, 2023, I was in a hospital emergency room, while there I had a heart attack. God had me where I needed to be to get the help I needed, and He was there to save my life. What a mighty God we serve!

As an evangelist, preaching and teaching I never felt like giving up although there were oppositions from time to time. I was anointed for this. I felt built for this and the Lord sustained me.

Called to serve as a Pastor, preaching, teaching, and working with the people of God, different story, different stresses. Sometimes Pastors do feel like quitting. As a leader of leaders, I have talked with Pastors, prayed with Pastors, and guided some to professional services. The George Barna Group has determined that we are losing 1750 ministers a month due to stress, burnout, and other ills.

Oftentimes, as you follow God, you want more for the people than the people want for themselves. Physical and spiritual attainments that they may not see as essential, but your job is to take them where they have never been, and the dangerous temptation is to keep the people happy.

G&G: Dr. Mason, were there any risks you have taken in ministry that achieved great results?

Dr. Mason: There have been occasions where taking risks was necessary to achieve great results. Fencing our property, the church renovation project, restructuring church leadership requirements, moving the church toward fiscal transparency and development of competent, compassionate ministry workers and development of policies and procedures to guide the ministry in its mission and outreach.

Because of the risks taken, we have been able to have worldwide impact on the mission field: clothing, feeding, teaching and preaching. We are a local church committed to global ministry impact.

G&G: Dr. Mason, I believe part of your 50-year legacy is how you have pastored the Perkins Square Baptist Church with such passion. I have heard it said that great passion does not come without great pain. What would you say it takes to be a successful pastor today?

Dr. Mason: I do not think I can speak to being a successful pastor. I am still simply seeking to follow the leadership of Jesus Christ by the inspiration of the Holy Spirit. I see so many Pastors who I think are doing great things in the Kingdom and I celebrate their success. I have been kept at a different place.

My passion is for people’s salvation, healing, and deliverance holistically. I want people to know Jesus Christ as Savior of sinners and the Lord of Life. Beyond this is the work of feeding the hungry, clothing the naked, ministering to the sick and oppressed.

Healing and deliverance ministry are a great work for the Church today, and beyond identifying demonic challenges in spiritual warfare, there is the work the church must do to help with mental illness and other sicknesses that have come to our community. This is where we must become strong today as we operate in the saving and healing name of Jesus.

G&G: Dr. Mason, I’m sure in 50 years you have experienced many changes in ministry. What would you say has impacted the church the most?

Dr. Mason: The Covid-19 pandemic has served to paralyze some churches, but it really has exposed the churches for who they really are. For most of us it has been a test of our faith. The Spirit of the Lord spoke to me some years ago saying, “God is drawing a dividing line between those who believe and those who say they believe.”

God is bringing His Church back to depending on God and demonstrating God’s power to heal and deliver his people. The Church will need to return to spiritual disciplines like prayer and fasting. I am still convinced that Much Prayer brings Much Power!

G&G: Dr. Mason, is there anyone who has had a tremendous impact in your ministry journey? Can you describe their impact on your life?

Dr. Mason: My grandmother, Julia Ruffin Holmes; my Pastor, Dr. Harold A. Carter, Sr.; and Dr. Alfred C. D. Vaughn were primary influencers in my life. Their faith, wisdom and struggles as they shared with me became a source of instruction and inspiration for me. They taught me to pray, to believe and to lead.

G&G: Dr. Mason, what words of wisdom would you share with that pastor who has just started their journey in ministry?

Dr. Mason: Trust God Boldly!

G&G: Dr. Mason, my last few questions are more on a personal note. After 50 years in ministry, what keeps you motivated and drives you to keep moving forward?

Dr. Mason: Prayer and the inspiration of the Holy Spirit keeps me going. He is my greatest companion. I also have a few close friends to whom I am accountable.

G&G: How would you describe yourself in three words? And what is one thing most people would be surprised to know about you?

Dr. Mason: Determined, Amusing and Ambitious. The one thing most people would be surprised to know about me is I have an earned 3rd degree Black Belt in Chin-Jitsu and I still workout.

G&G: Dr. Mason, after 50 years doing ministry, what’s still on the horizon for Dr. Cleveland Mason?

Dr. Mason: I am planning to do what I have been doing until the Lord says, “Well done.”